Ryan Kesler

[Upoil]

You're focusing on these days? I'll edit the OP to avoid confusing you further.

Again - I'm basing this judgment on the past few years. He was not a particularly effective 2nd line C last year either. He may say he feels the healthiest, but again - he looks pretty slow out there right now.

He racks up points on the PP, and is good on draws, and can take over games when someone lights a fire under his ass. But more and more, to me at least, that sounds like a perfect 3rd line C. Not a player to build a line around that we need secondary scoring from.

This is why we have struggled to get secondary scoring, not because we still haven't found the magical winger that will turn him into an even-strength producing 2nd line C.

Thank you.

If you are looking at him from the past couple years he's looked like a turd sandwich from what we'd expect. But I would say you have to look at that in context too. That's two years where he wasn't able to train during the offseason due to injuries/surgeries.

If he still looks sluggish after 20-25 games then we have something we need to worry about.

 

[ShouldveDraftedFiala]

He needs a play maker, seriously.

This. I've been ranting for a few years now about how Kesler needs to either be moved to the wing or have a play-making winger on his line, but those are rare.

I'm still astonished that AV would not give Hodgson a shot centring Kes. I'm so happy he's gone now and we have a competent coach. But now we don't have a 2nd line centre anymore that can do that.

Ever since his 40 goal season he thinks he's Ovi out there. He never uses his teammates, will always try to dangle 2v1 and just constantly ends rushes all by himself by taking long shots that are easily saved because there's no traffic. Sure he will have a "beastmode" game once in every 5 or 10, but in between that he plays like a 3rd liner. Good players make the players around him better. Kesler does the opposite of that. He desperately needs a good player to help him out and I feel that a play making centre would be the best. Kesler played on the wing of Sundin remember and he gave a lot of credit to him being able to get his game to another level. Well it's now time to bring someone in full time to do that again.

 

[NuxFan09]

There's definitely some concern there, but I'm going to try to be patient.

I still maintain this team needs some actual 2nd line wingers though. Before last season, the Canucks were one of the top offensive teams for a few years so the top 6 winger issue was effectively masked. This is why this team is seriously due for an injection of youth, like the Sharks are getting now. I know Jensen, Shinkaruk and Horvat weren't ready, but God I hope they're ready soon.

 

[Diamonddog01]

This. I've been ranting for a few years now about how Kesler needs to either be moved to the wing or have a play-making winger on his line, but those are rare.

I'm still astonished that AV would not give Hodgson a shot centring Kes. I'm so happy he's gone now and we have a competent coach. But now we don't have a 2nd line centre anymore that can do that.

Ever since his 40 goal season he thinks he's Ovi out there. He never uses his teammates, will always try to dangle 2v1 and just constantly ends rushes all by himself by taking long shots that are easily saved because there's no traffic. Sure he will have a "beastmode" game once in every 5 or 10, but in between that he plays like a 3rd liner. Good players make the players around him better. Kesler does the opposite of that. He desperately needs a good player to help him out and I feel that a play making centre would be the best. Kesler played on the wing of Sundin remember and he gave a lot of credit to him being able to get his game to another level. Well it's now time to bring someone in full time to do that again.

Agreed 100%. In regards to your 3rd liner comment - I feel that perhaps the team should just accept this. Once they do, they can focus on finding a good 2nd line C (or grooming Horvat for that role) and finally solving the secondary scoring issue.

We can try to find one of those elusive play-making wingers, or put him on the wing. But at what point do we stop trying to find a player who serves as a cataylst for him (what happens if that player gets injured) and just accept what you wrote - he does the opposite of making the players around him better.

He'd be an expensive 3rd line C to be sure, but like ROR, one of the best in the league.

 

[shortshorts]

There's definitely some concern there, but I'm going to try to be patient.

I still maintain this team needs some actual 2nd line wingers though. Before last season, the Canucks were one of the top offensive teams for a few years so the top 6 winger issue was effectively masked. This is why this team is seriously due for an injection of youth, like the Sharks are getting now. I know Jensen, Shinkaruk and Horvat weren't ready, but God I hope they're ready soon.

The Canucks Fandom definition of "2nd line winger" is a first liner on a second line.

I'm totally loving this thread.

 

[NuxFan09]

The Canucks Fandom definition of "2nd line winger" is a first liner on a second line.

I'm totally loving this thread.

How do you know what my definition of a 2nd line winger is?

My idea of a 2nd line winger isn't Thomas Vanek or Bobby Ryan, but it isn't Chris Higgins or Jannik Hansen either. David Booth would constitute a 2nd line winger if he actually produced like one.

Is it not okay to point out this team's obvious faults, or do I have to pretend that everything about the roster is fantastic and everything is rosy in Canuckland?

 

[Barney Gumble]

David Booth would constitute a 2nd line winger if he actually produced like one.

He might if he wasn't given borderline to illegal hits.

 

[ShouldveDraftedFiala]

Agreed 100%. In regards to your 3rd liner comment - I feel that perhaps the team should just accept this. Once they do, they can focus on finding a good 2nd line C (or grooming Horvat for that role) and finally solving the secondary scoring issue.

We can try to find one of those elusive play-making wingers, or put him on the wing. But at what point do we stop trying to find a player who serves as a cataylst for him (what happens if that player gets injured) and just accept what you wrote - he does the opposite of making the players around him better.

He'd be an expensive 3rd line C to be sure, but like ROR, one of the best in the league.

I still am a firm believer that if moved to the wing and given a strong play making centre on his line, he could flourish. Kesler plays like a winger now, but given his history, the team seems to be reluctant to admit it for some reason. When Daniel was on his wing, that line became instantly dangerous and Kes seemed to relax and play as if it wasn't all up to him. If splitting the Sedins isn't going to be a permanent thing, then we need to bring someone else in.

He could be dropped to the 3rd line, a la Pavelski, but with Horvat potentially making the team next year, I wonder if that would be the best way to go. Also I'm not sure Kesler's Ego could handle it.

Also, unlike the Canucks, Colorado has moved ROR to the wing of Duchene.

 

[Just A Bit Outside]

I still am a firm believer that if moved to the wing and given a strong play making centre on his line, he could flourish. Kesler plays like a winger now, but given his history, the team seems to be reluctant to admit it for some reason. When Daniel was on his wing, that line became instantly dangerous and Kes seemed to relax and play as if it wasn't all up to him. If splitting the Sedins isn't going to be a permanent thing, then we need to bring someone else in.

He could be dropped to the 3rd line, a la Pavelski, but with Horvat potentially making the team next year, I wonder if that would be the best way to go. Also I'm not sure Kesler's Ego could handle it.

Bingo.

 

[Outside99*]

Kesler needs a linemate with whom he has great chemistry. We know who that is. They may not be world beaters offensively but they'll be darn hard to play against.

 

[B-rock]

Too early to tell much?

Gotta remember that the season he put up 41 goals he had no points in the first 4 games... You know.... perspective.

Bingo, we have a winner!

 

[Jyrki]

Last night he was doing the "wrist shot through shinpads" all night along. That's an indication he feels as if he needs to carry the line he's on. Not good.

 

[BC Ben]

Never was a fan of Kes, but it's only been 4 games and we need to give him time to orient to Torts' system.

 

[shortshorts]

Last night he was doing the "wrist shot through shinpads" all night along. That's an indication he feels as if he needs to carry the line he's on. Not good.

Which is stupid, because Booth and snake-bitten Higgins was infinitely better than Kesler both defensively, and offensively.

How do you know what my definition of a 2nd line winger is?

My idea of a 2nd line winger isn't Thomas Vanek or Bobby Ryan, but it isn't Chris Higgins or Jannik Hansen either. David Booth would constitute a 2nd line winger if he actually produced like one.

Is it not okay to point out this team's obvious faults, or do I have to pretend that everything about the roster is fantastic and everything is rosy in Canuckland?

Might not be you, but check out the armchair GM thread. Booth has produced like a 2nd line wingers (pro-rated) every year he's been here. It's not his fault Kesler refuses to utilize him. Great centers raise 2nd line 40pt players to 50+ pt players. Kesler is not that.

I also don't know what your last point is referring to. I've been trashing Kesler forever now

 

[Diamonddog01]

Might not be you, but check out the armchair GM thread. Booth has produced like a 2nd line wingers (pro-rated) every year he's been here. It's not his fault Kesler refuses to utilize him. Great centers raise 2nd line 40pt players to 50+ pt players. Kesler is not that.

I also don't know what your last point is referring to. I've been trashing Kesler forever now

And this is the crux of it really - maybe the problem isn't Booth. Or all of the other players we've put on the 2nd line. Maybe it's the fact that Kesler is incapable of being part of a cohesive unit, and our 2nd line possession and scoring suffers consequently.

That's why I think he would be better served as a 3rd line C, where he can focus on one thing, as opposed to trying to do it all.

 

[Reign Nateo]

Needs to find a linemate that works with him. Not sure where they find it as it seems like it's gotta be someone specific. Someone that can pass the puck and get to the net with speed. Not a common combo though. His biggest issue is inconsistancy to me. He can be the best player on the ice one game, and then look like he's going through the motions the next.

Every year we worry about Kesler and have a thread about it, then by the end of the year we're happy with him again. He is what he is, and effective, albeit inconsistant 2-way centre.

 

[canucksfan]

He doesn't seem as fast as he once was.

I doubt he scores 40+ goals again.

 

[Bourne Endeavor]

The Canucks Fandom definition of "2nd line winger" is a first liner on a second line.

I'm totally loving this thread.

My idea of a second liner for Kesler is Cammalleri or Hemsky.

 

[NuxFan09]

He doesn't seem as fast as he once was.

I doubt he scores 40+ goals again.

I'm just fine with that. I never expected him to. That 41 goal season was an anomaly. I'd like to see him get back to a form that resembles his 09/10 season when he scored 25 goals and dished 50 assists. That's when he played like a true 2nd line centre.

 

[CherryToke]

He needs a play maker, seriously.

yup and we've known this for a long freakn time. Gillis needs to pull his head out of his ass and do something about it.

 

[petrishriekandgo]

My theory:

a) Kesler is one more hip injury away from retirement
b) Kesler is healthy for the 1st time in 2 years and wants to keep it that way
c) Kesler is "managing his game" as to avoid any injuries, stay healthy for the Olympics
d) Kesler will turn it up in December to make sure he makes the Olympic squad
e) After the Olympics who knows? Maybe he has the confidence that he can play is game at full-speed (which is his game) and avoid injuries OR maybe he continues to "manage" his game and avoid putting himself in high-speed, high-contact situations.

I see an INEVITABLE clash with Torts. Torts wants balls out effort everywhere (Santorelli, Burrows, Hansen-esque) and Kesler wants to "manage" his game (read, pick his spots) to avoid any more set-backs.

Torts has already said that if he "see's your A game once then you're in trouble, because he'll want to see it all the time". Maybe he gives Kes more rope but it can't be that long.

Guys been invisible 3 out of 4 games this season, supposed to be a leader, an assistant Captain/Olympian and one of the best 2-way centers in the game.

He is NOT that right now, hasn't been since 2010.

Seriously... If I'm Gillis he's moved while he's still considered an asset in this league. Maybe after the Olympics at the trade deadline? If only Wally Buono was the Canucks GM.

 

[Superpest]

Kesler's play fits perfectly the Torts mold. (Callahan-esque)

Kesler's personality guarantees a clash with Torts' personality.

 

[MikeK]

Kesler also hasn't played a lot of hockey in the last 2 seasons either. He has had injury after injury and also went under the knife. He is also trying to learn a new system and doesn't seem to have the right type of line mates for his style of play. I think he still has productive hockey in him but we'll never see that 40+ goal scorer again. The type of money that is thrown out to top 6 forwards these days I still think, for what he brings defensively, he's still a bargain at his salary.

I think we just have to be realistic in what we can expect from a guy who has clearly been beat up with multiple injuries, surgery, and lost a step or two from what we came to know from him. As long as he is still great Defensively I don't have any issues with his play.

 

[Wetcoaster]

My idea of a second liner for Kesler is Cammalleri or Hemsky.

My idea is Kassian - a play making winger who can crash the net for rebounds from the Kesler and Booth shooting gallery.

 

[F A N]

I've learned over the years not to count out Kesler.