Russian hockey journalists

[Atas2000]

Fine. So what is wrong? People complain about salary cap, but was is a job of Chernyshenko? He proposed 600 million, but the Board approved something else. The FHR does not agree with Lada & Yugra being off. OK. But the league decided to contract, so they need to finish it. Lets hope it will be good for the league. Yes, I do not agree with a decision that Seva stayed. Chernyshenko failed here, I agree. But if they do what they presented last year - 24 teams, accepting 4 new one. I have no problem with technical issues during a process.

You don't understand. I am against this kind of contraction alltogether. Bring back Kuznya, bring back Yugra and Lada. Stop killing our development system by creating a useless league for St.Petersburg and Moscow. Chernyshenko was supposed to help poor teams to keep up not expell them. Those teams are the foundation of our youth development, not the stupid supercreature SKA. SKA won't develop us any future stars, they will only buy them away from other teams.

 

[vorky]

You don't understand. I am against this kind of contraction alltogether. Bring back Kuznya, bring back Yugra and Lada. Stop killing our development system by creating a useless league for St.Petersburg and Moscow. Chernyshenko was supposed help poor teams to keep up not expell them. Those teams are the foundation of our youth development, not the stupid supercreature SKA. SKA won't develop us any future stars, they will only buy them away from other teams.

I get the point. Chernyshenko´s history says he wants only top Russian teams. So his mission has been clear since day 1. We can agree or disagree with him. Strong VHL would be more helpful to Russian prospects development than those 3 teams in the KHL. Lets ask the FHR what they have been doing with the VHL.

 

[Alessandro Seren Rosso]

You don't understand. I am against this kind of contraction alltogether. Bring back Kuznya, bring back Yugra and Lada. Stop killing our development system by creating a useless league for St.Petersburg and Moscow. Chernyshenko was supposed help poor teams to keep up not expell them. Those teams are the foundation of our youth development, not the stupid supercreature SKA. SKA won't develop us any future stars, they will only buy them away from other teams.

If SKA buys stars from other teams, then other teams will make stars for them. Or not?

 

[Jussi]

A Finnish paper pickd up Ilja Masjuk's venting at allhockey.ru:

Not happy about the contracting Lada and Yugra, says their finances would have been in sufficient order to play in KHL.

Doesn't understand why non-Russian teams aren't in danger. Sayas Riga has no moremoeny than the contracted clubs and froma sports viewpoint are doing even worse. Also asks what does Slovan have to give?

Then asks who in the end needs Jokerit in the KHL? "Team is strong but they should play in Finland."

Proceeds to call non-Russian clubs as "soap bubbles", praises the junior work of Lada, Yugra and Novokuznetsk.

"KHL politics are killing the national development. Non-Russian clubs do not work to advance Russian hockey."

 

[Atas2000]

If SKA buys stars from other teams, then other teams will make stars for them. Or not?

Soon there will be no new stars with no Kuznya, no Yugra, no Lada.

 

[Atas2000]

I get the point. Chernyshenko´s history says he wants only top Russian teams. So his mission has been clear since day 1. We can agree or disagree with him. Strong VHL would be more helpful to Russian prospects development than those 3 teams in the KHL. Lets ask the FHR what they have been doing with the VHL.

The devil is in the detail as always. It depends on how you define top teams. To me Kuznya is a top team because it produces top talent at a great rate. While SKA is a top notch off ice organization with a very poor hockey concept of buying a team together(while breaking a lot of regulations).

Strong VHL is a contradiction in itself. A minor league is called minor for a reason. No VHL will ever replace a top russian league in regard of development of young players. How many Russians will Jokerit develop? Zero. How many Russians will SKA develop 1 or 2 in 10 years. They should play in the KHL. It won't be with SKA or Jokerit.

I don't care what happems with the VHL. Teams like Kuznya have no business playing in a minor league if we want development.

 

[vorky]

A top team is a team with top notch infrastructure, marketing & player development. By player development I mean a club´s system, including hockey schools & minor leagues (the MHL, the VHL). Unfortunatelly Kuznya & Yugra did not fulfill infrastructure and marketing conditions. Lada is a bit better than those two sides.

There is a reason why there is the AHL. Why should not the VHL serve the same function? To develop players. Perhaps, the rules of call-ups or trades should be modified. But that is a minor problem. The big problem is the mentality, some VHL teams are not interested in developing of players for the KHL.

 

[Alessandro Seren Rosso]

Soon there will be no new stars with no Kuznya, no Yugra, no Lada.

Look at what teams are Gusev or Kucherov vospitanniks

 

[Atas2000]

Look at what teams are Gusev or Kucherov vospitanniks

What is your point? Have I said something about CSKA?

And now be honest. What team Gusev played for before he got noticed from the cloud SKA is on?

Why did he play there and not on CSKA? Because Kucherov and Gusev were victims of the same problem with CSKA. Again, be honest. I am pretty sure you know of this problem.

CSKA is a different case, but they are still a headache for the same reason. They spend on draining talent from other teams, but their own products have to go to Yugra to get noticed. Where will they go now?

 

[Atas2000]

A top team is a team with top notch infrastructure, marketing & player development. By player development I mean a club´s system, including hockey schools & minor leagues (the MHL, the VHL). Unfortunatelly Kuznya & Yugra did not fulfill infrastructure and marketing conditions. Lada is a bit better than those two sides.

There is a reason why there is the AHL. Why should not the VHL serve the same function? To develop players. Perhaps, the rules of call-ups or trades should be modified. But that is a minor problem. The big problem is the mentality, some VHL teams are not interested in developing of players for the KHL.

The VHL can perfectly fulfill it's purpose, but NOT with Kuznyas on it. And it was Chernyshenko's main task to help those teams to get to a level where their infrastructure would be sufficient. He hasn't failed. He never tried. He is a agent of the money sacks or better to say of only two money sacks. He os not working for the league.

 

[vorky]

I said it, but I will repeat it one more time. You know what was Chernyshenko´s role before the KHL´s launch. He was the main executive officer for the EAHL´s project. As I read, he wanted to launch the league with 9 Russian teams, he did not want all RSL clubs. He has never wanted to help small regional clubs, he has always been interested in strong, financially & infrastructure, sides.

 

[Toro2017]

Shevchenko is really funny guy. He wrote one or two weeks ago that Slovan, Riga & Yugra are leaving. Today, he wrote Yugra & Lada are leaving.

Here Shevchenko is apparently writing (among other things) that Torpedo is moving to the eastern conference. Is this going to happen and is there any other source for this or is this only "funny guy stuff"?

And if for example sport-express is not so good russian sport media (hockey wise), then what are the top 5 sport media in russia, that foreigner should try to follow, if they want reliable info on KHL? Every now and then I try to follow Tass, Allhockey, Championat, Sport-Express and KHL:s own webpage.

 

[Alessandro Seren Rosso]

What is your point? Have I said something about CSKA?

And now be honest. What team Gusev played for before he got noticed from the cloud SKA is on?

Why did he play there and not on CSKA? Because Kucherov and Gusev were victims of the same problem with CSKA. Again, be honest. I am pretty sure you know of this problem.

CSKA is a different case, but they are still a headache for the same reason. They spend on draining talent from other teams, but their own products have to go to Yugra to get noticed. Where will they go now?

Gusevs and Kucherovs of this world don't only need teams like Yugra to get more ice time. They also need strong competition to face. If the salary cap will spread players around, both things will be accomplished.
No one is denying that the current situation with CSKA and SKA is awful, but with time it will sort out itself.

 

[vorky]

Here Shevchenko is apparently writing (among other things) that Torpedo is moving to the eastern conference. Is this going to happen and is there any other source for this or is this only "funny guy stuff"?

If I noticed, championat was first with this news.

To be clear, Shevchenko is tabloid style writer. Look at his twitter, he can not avoid his traditional food tweet from the KHL events at latest KHL BoD meeting. Of course, he has sources, so I recommend you to follow him, but not believe him 100%.

And if for example sport-express is not so good russian sport media (hockey wise), then what are the top 5 sport media in russia, that foreigner should try to follow, if they want reliable info on KHL? Every now and then I try to follow Tass, Allhockey, Championat, Sport-Express and KHL:s own webpage.

The media are great with interviews, I agree. But the problem is that there is, in many cases, a lack of top notch analysis of the KHL. I like Biznis Online, which has great attendance stuff. That is an analysis I want to read.

Sport-Express is not so bad, just one journalist.

TASS is a classic agency. Another agency is RSport, which is the best source of reliable informations in my eyes. They are much better & faster than TASS.

Championat is good as well, they have good insides of transfer rumors. Articles of a few guys are useful.

Allhockey is, in my eyes, a copy+paste website. Sure, you can scroll them, but in 99% you will find the news on other websites. Similar website is sports.ru, they have a blog system, which is really good. Only problem is that anybody can write here, so some blogs are good, other really bad. KHL teams have blogs there as well.

If you are interested in marketing, finance etc of the league, you should read the KHL´s Year Reviews, which are available at the home page (Russian website version).

 

[Atas2000]

Gusevs and Kucherovs of this world don't only need teams like Yugra to get more ice time. They also need strong competition to face. If the salary cap will spread players around, both things will be accomplished.
No one is denying that the current situation with CSKA and SKA is awful, but with time it will sort out itself.

How will the cap bring 3 teams back?

 

[Alessandro Seren Rosso]

How will the cap bring 3 teams back?

Ok it will not. But having a higher level of competition with a more level playing field and, as a consequence, having more good players spread around teams, can only do the best interest for the development of good players. Not to talk about a working farm league model, a strong VHL can also be a good way to have more inner competition for roster spots. No one likes to exclude teams, but keeping Yugra had no sense. No spectators, no money, dead last in the standings every year. Look at Ak Bars own roster, it has at least 9 vospitanniks+Lukoyanov+Tokranov. This means that the team is doing a tremendous job with their own players, even more so considering the big talents on the pipeline. And that's without even counting other vospitanniks in other teams/leagues. Dynamo Moscow also has developed some good players lately, albeit no one of them will probably be a star. Neither of them had Yugra involved. Russia always was and always will be a rich-in-talent country (not only in hockey btw), if Yugra won't develop their own vospitanniks, other teams will.

 

[Atas2000]

Ok it will not. But having a higher level of competition with a more level playing field and, as a consequence, having more good players spread around teams, can only do the best interest for the development of good players. Not to talk about a working farm league model, a strong VHL can also be a good way to have more inner competition for roster spots. No one likes to exclude teams, but keeping Yugra had no sense. No spectators, no money, dead last in the standings every year. Look at Ak Bars own roster, it has at least 9 vospitanniks+Lukoyanov+Tokranov. This means that the team is doing a tremendous job with their own players, even more so considering the big talents on the pipeline. And that's without even counting other vospitanniks in other teams/leagues. Dynamo Moscow also has developed some good players lately, albeit no one of them will probably be a star. Neither of them had Yugra involved. Russia always was and always will be a rich-in-talent country (not only in hockey btw), if Yugra won't develop their own vospitanniks, other teams will.

So killing numerous pools of development won't affect theamount of talent developed? Bold statement.

Also raising the percentage of foreign teams which won't develop one russian prospect is helping how?

I soviet days most teams in the league could only hope to win a game against CSKA, but exactly those teams developed the players.

 

[Alessandro Seren Rosso]

So killing numerous pools of development won't affect theamount of talent developed? Bold statement.

Also raising the percentage of foreign teams which won't develop one russian prospect is helping how?

I soviet days most teams in the league could only hope to win a game against CSKA, but exactly those teams developed the players.

Going to the VHL though is not killing. Bringing good foreign teams in means generally to rise the overall level. The KHL wouldn't be better off without Jokerit, for example. We'll see how it goes in the next few years

 

[Atas2000]

Going to the VHL though is not killing. Bringing good foreign teams in means generally to rise the overall level. The KHL wouldn't be better off without Jokerit, for example. We'll see how it goes in the next few years

The only foreign team to elevate the level so far is Jokerit. The rest are middle of the pack at best. How are they supporting the level?

And in the end Jokerit helps developing finnish players not russian. And without trying to hurt anybody's feelings I don't care how finnish players develop. I care about the developmwnt of russian players. And the league should serve this purpose. By expelling russian teams with strong hockey schools it does the opposite.

 

[Rcknrollkillnmachine]

But wasn't the aim of KHL to create a pan Euro/Asian league?

I think the decrease in Russian teams will see more talented Russians spread amongst the clubs that generally don't get a deep play-off run. European teams usually don't have nor develop Russians, rather their own along with imports which seems the norm apart from say Riga and Minsk for obvious reasons. Regardless, Russia has always produced high-end talent and I don't see any reason why that will stop since the VHL is quite a decent level of hockey to watch, I find.

If you shed the European teams then I think interest in the league itself will decrease which would be detrimental to long-term funding from what I see.

 

[Alessandro Seren Rosso]

The only foreign team to elevate the level so far is Jokerit. The rest are middle of the pack at best. How are they supporting the level?

And in the end Jokerit helps developing finnish players not russian. And without trying to hurt anybody's feelings I don't care how finnish players develop. I care about the developmwnt of russian players. And the league should serve this purpose. By expelling russian teams with strong hockey schools it does the opposite.

Well, where did I write about Finnish players? I just wrote that it's better for Russian players (young and old) to face strong competition, which Jokerit certainly is. Russian hockey is certainly better with the KHL, Russia always produced plenty of high-level players and always will. There's not need to enter into panic mode because three low level teams were moved down a league. With a strong league like the KHL, Russian talent will have a chance to thrive in a more competitive environment, with a possibility to play at home in one of the world's top leagues.
Now, if only we'd find a way to stop those kids going to the CHL...

 

[Atas2000]

Well, where did I write about Finnish players? I just wrote that it's better for Russian players (young and old) to face strong competition, which Jokerit certainly is. Russian hockey is certainly better with the KHL, Russia always produced plenty of high-level players and always will. There's not need to enter into panic mode because three low level teams were moved down a league. With a strong league like the KHL, Russian talent will have a chance to thrive in a more competitive environment, with a possibility to play at home in one of the world's top leagues.
Now, if only we'd find a way to stop those kids going to the CHL...

How are the russian player going to face those foreign players if their teams are demoted to the VHL?

 

[Alessandro Seren Rosso]

How are the russian player going to face those foreign players if their teams are demoted to the VHL?

The best ones will move up to the KHL ...

 

[vorky]

But wasn't the aim of KHL to create a pan Euro/Asian league?

I think the decrease in Russian teams will see more talented Russians spread amongst the clubs that generally don't get a deep play-off run. European teams usually don't have nor develop Russians, rather their own along with imports which seems the norm apart from say Riga and Minsk for obvious reasons. Regardless, Russia has always produced high-end talent and I don't see any reason why that will stop since the VHL is quite a decent level of hockey to watch, I find.

If you shed the European teams then I think interest in the league itself will decrease which would be detrimental to long-term funding from what I see.

That is right question. Of course, it is KHL´s aim. But some Russian hockey officials/journalists/fans still think that the KHL is only for Russian (& CIS) teams. Since we are in journalists´ thread, I will put a video blog of one such journalist. His name is Ponomarenko, working for SovSport. He wants only Russian, and CIS, clubs in the KHL.

 

[Atas2000]

The best ones will move up to the KHL ...

How many spots do we offer them? That's the whole point.