Disagree. The nice thing about it is that defencemen get better in their zone with experience and age. So will Nurse. He has already settled down quite a but compared to how he would just be skating everywhere before. You cant trade for dmen like him, size, physical strength that is unmatched, and great skating ability, good offensive instincts. Not sure why we would want to keep downgrading our assets...that is Chia all over again.
Rumor: Rumours and Proposals Thread: Post Deadline, Trades For Next Season and Beyond If/When We are Out?
- Thread starter Bryanbryoil
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Disagree. The nice thing about it is that defencemen get better in their zone with experience and age. So will Nurse. He has already settled down quite a but compared to how he would just be skating everywhere before. You cant trade for dmen like him, size, physical strength that is unmatched, and great skating ability, good offensive instincts. Not sure why we would want to keep downgrading our assets...that is Chia all over again.
If at first you don't succeed, do the same dumb **** again!
At this point, I have no connection to anyone on this team.
McDavid and draisaitl are obvious keepers because they're two of the best players in the league, but literally everyone else can gtfo for all I care.
My list of untouchables used to include guys like rnh, klef, Larsson, nurse, etc, but at this point who f***ing cares. Nobody on this team is worth losing sleep over outside of drai/mcdavid.
I try to defend these players, and be optimistic, but then they put up efforts like last night, and the more I think about it, the angrier I get. You're fighting for your playoff lives, against the worst team in the league currently, and can't be bothered to show up.
We have drai and McDavid, and I'd still trade rosters with just about any other team in the league because it's not f***ing cursed trash like the oilers roster.
McDavid and draisaitl are obvious keepers because they're two of the best players in the league, but literally everyone else can gtfo for all I care.
My list of untouchables used to include guys like rnh, klef, Larsson, nurse, etc, but at this point who f***ing cares. Nobody on this team is worth losing sleep over outside of drai/mcdavid.
I try to defend these players, and be optimistic, but then they put up efforts like last night, and the more I think about it, the angrier I get. You're fighting for your playoff lives, against the worst team in the league currently, and can't be bothered to show up.
We have drai and McDavid, and I'd still trade rosters with just about any other team in the league because it's not f***ing cursed trash like the oilers roster.
Jet Walters
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- May 15, 2013
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I proposed Yamomoto and Manning for Blake Coleman before the trade deadline which no one seemed to like. After seeing him last night does anyone like that deal a bit more? Speedy, gritty guy who can help our PK and would bang in 20 playing with RNH on the 2nd line. Signed for another 2 years at 1.8 per.
780il
edm
Nurse to Lindholm is a massive upgrade. Not a downgrade at all. Lindholm is also only 1 year older
That's a terrible trade. Coleman is 27, having his first good season ever. You don't move a Yamamoto for that
Also moving Nuge+ for Rakell on a down year is a horrible move.
PBandJ
If it didn't happen in the 80's, it didn't happen
Yeah, Nurse might be as good as Lindholm if everything goes right for him. I'd be over the moon if we got him.
Burnt Biscuits
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- May 2, 2010
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Demote him and loan him out, IMO.
I think McDavid on the strength of his sustained offensive zone time alone is our best defensive forward, add to that his really high takeaway numbers, defending through puck possession tends to be superior to actually being good defensively, and it's not like Nuge is substantially better than McDavid defensively if we are talking in terms of the occasions we are hemmed into our own zone.The Nuge said:
What Rakell represents is a value contract, he's signed for 3 more years at less than $4M, compared to Nuge's 2 years at $6M, with some sort of raise after 2 years being likely. Rakell also has hit some marks that RNH hasn't yet, Rakell has a 34 goal and 33 goal season under his belt as well as a 69 point season. The two players are the same age, so we aren't getting any older with the deal, the difference between RNH and Rakell's career points per game is 0.08 (6-7 points pro-rated to an 82 game season) compared to the difference between Eberle and Strome at the time of trade which was 0.32 (26 points pro-rated to an 82 game season). It's fair to call this a downgrade, but it certainly doesn't seem to be a huge one, like the Eberle for Strome deal was.
Rakell is a really good player and really seemed to be blossoming in his 2 years prior to this season, basically every Duck has been terrible this season and its bared out in their point totals, I fully expect Rakell to bounce back. If we were to make the trade I wouldn't want Rakell playing C, to me it signals a permanent breaking up of the McDavid + Drai combo to run their own lines respectively, RNH provides a tremendous versatility and we really don't have many players of his ilk who can be utilized in any situation, that should be weighed heavily if we did endeavor to move him. I've watched a lot of Rakell, but no so closely to really pin down how much of a downgrade he'd be defensively, but IMO he was a good defensive player in any of the games I can recall over the past 3 years.
As an aside I'm a bit troubled by the amount of people in general who are shit-talking Nuge (more prevalent in GDT and PGT's than here) or want to trade him, cause of his recent down turn in play, basically no one is consistent through an 82 game season, people play way too hard into recency biases and should endeavor to be more balanced in their evaluations.
NeverForget06
Here we go again !
We have been repeatedly punished by trying to move assets in desperation. Yes, it is a result of incompetent management, but it is also a result of having zero bargaining power. Everyone knows we need to turn it around, and have the upper hand in most negotiations.
Sometimes the times that you need patience the most are the times when it is the easiest to feel like do something.
Sometimes the times that you need patience the most are the times when it is the easiest to feel like do something.
With guys on the farm playing well being patient could be okay. Could also blow up in our face
I wouldn't add to RNH to get Rakell, but if ANA offered Rakell for RNH straight up I'd at least think about it.
Rakell is more of a goal scorer than RNH which makes him valuable, but on the other hand RNH plays a more valuable position (Rakell is a winger, not a center). I haven't paid much attention to Rakell's defensive play but since he's not used on the PK I suspect that RNH has the advantage there. However, Rakell's cap hit is $2.2M lower which can't be discounted.
I think what it comes down to is consistency. Nuge has shown that with 1st PP time he can put regularly put up 55-60 points. Rakell's numbers are all over the place, usually around 40-50 points. To be honest, his 69 point season is looking like an outlier right now. Because of this risk, I don't think I'd make this deal.
ImmuneEH
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- Apr 2, 2017
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I'd do Nuge for Rakell + one of their C prospects like S. Steel or T. Terry. If they decide that's too much on their end I just walk from the deal.
I think Rakell would get better numbers than Nuge on McDavid or Drai's wing.
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A massive upgrade.....hmmm.........in what way? Also.....upgrade by adding a 1st and a 2nd pick as well?
The problem is this entire team makes me sick. These guys are not the only problem, but our team isn't good enough to make up for their deficiencies.
Is it their fault? Not entirely. The team built around them is not suitable for the NHL. It doesn't mean they don't frustrate me to no end when they take nights off like last night.
They're all okay players, who I no longer care if they stay or go, as long as the team around us gets fixed.
Burnt Biscuits
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- May 2, 2010
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Vastly vastly superior defensively, better passer, drives puck possession and goals for differential a hell of a lot better than Nurse does. Nurse is better at jumping up into the play, where Lindholm tends to want to play safer, Nurse is slightly more physical, and Nurse's top end skating speed seems better, though Lindholm's skating seems to be more fluid and efficient.
The Nuge
Some say…
Nope. I’d be all for getting him, but I’m not trading Yamamoto for him.
Yep. If you can pull off that swap, our defense looks really good.
Agree 100%. There’s a good chance he’d be our #7 or 8 down there next year (With the addition of Bouchard, Persson, and Samorukov). Loan him out, hope he plays top 4 with his new team, and try and trade him at the deadline to a playoff team looking for depth. It’s crazy just how far down the depth chart he is.
I’m fully on board with going after Rakell. I think he’s a great target. As you said, he’s on a good contract, and plays a pretty decent 200 ft game. But trading Nuge for him is still insane. Their career PPGs might be similar, but Nuge has found a new level the last year and a half. He’s a ~65 point guy playing with 4th liners. Meanwhile Rakell has fallen off. Sure the team sucks, and nobody is scoring, but what happens if he doesn’t turn it around here? Best case scenario there is we shuffled the deck chairs on the Titanic. We need to add Rakell to the big 3, not trade one of the big 3 for him.
Ya the Nuge bashing is utterly ridiculous. He’s still our 3rd best forward, and by a LOT. He got robbed a couple times last night or he would have had 2 goals. And despite that, he’s being blamed for the loss. He’s not a McDavid/Drai calibre player, but that doesn’t mean you trade him. It’s like people are expecting all of our top players to finish top 5 in scoring or something. If he puts up his usual ~60 points, while playing solid defense, that’s a building block of your team.
Typical grass is greener on the other side of the fence syndrome going on here. Nurse has more points, plus/minus is about the same, and he has significantly more shots on net than Lindholm having not played PP for most of the first half of the season. Corsi is about the same. Over twice as many hits as Lindholm. Just Lindholm at $6.75M? Really? Next year at the same age Lindholm is now I except Nurse to take an even bigger step.
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780il
edm
Lindholm is light years better in his own end, plays the toughest assignments and excels (shuts them tf down) and plays major minutes with dz starts. He also can make a decent breakout pass and doesn't really get any pp time whereas Nurse's offensive success this year has come off the pp with Mcdavid and Drai.
The 1st in the deal is for Rakell. A guy like him with that contract is totally worth our 1st.
You should look at the stats before you make stuff up. Nurse has 9 points on the PP and Lindholm has 6. That means Nurse still has more 5 on 5 points. If he is light years better than Nurse why don't we had RNH as well to that trade. Nurse and RNH for Lindholm?
Why do we keep holding onto RNH like he's untouchable? He's going to demand a raise in a year. We are looking at paying him at least 7M+. That's double the cost of Rakell
58 in 70 games? Wasn't half of those points playing on McDavid's wings and a bit more playing on the PP with McDavid and Drai?
I actually think Rakell gets more points playing with McDavid and it also creates another threat with Drai on the 2nd line while freeing up 2.2M for another 3 years.
I want a better player back if we're trading RNH than Rackell. One is a center, one should have considerably higher value.
Center depth is the only roster strength we have, you have to think long and hard before you start screwing around with that. Maybe the new GM can find decent wing support because he has half a brain.
I'm not so sure RNH gets a massive cap hit raise on his next deal either, you can structure it like
8/7.5/7.5/7.5/6/5/4.5/4 = 6.25 mill cap hit.
Center depth is the only roster strength we have, you have to think long and hard before you start screwing around with that. Maybe the new GM can find decent wing support because he has half a brain.
I'm not so sure RNH gets a massive cap hit raise on his next deal either, you can structure it like
8/7.5/7.5/7.5/6/5/4.5/4 = 6.25 mill cap hit.
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