Rumor: Rumors and Proposals Thread: Hallsy Take 2?

[Chabot84]

If only the cost of a Taylor Hall was an Adam Larsson

Exactly right.. but we could get a 50-60 point type FWD for him I bet and on this team that could mean 70-80 point FWD if this player makes it onto the #1 PP. but either way..

I think one more top 6 FWD added to this team makes a huge difference. Yeah are we perfect? No. But we could outscore any team.. and I’m cool with that. In the short term.

 

[belair]

who can’t win draws to save his life after nine seasons in the league. Or carry the puck into the ozone with any authority.
I’m sure the team can find a cheaper center to PK and pass back to Klefbom on the PP.
Are you sure? Lots of talk on this board about his exit interview last season and how ‘he must be tired of all the losing’.
For one sixty point season? Meh. The team can spend $8 million in much better ways.

Faceoffs? Plenty of literature out there to tell you how little those matter in the scope of things. The difference between a 45% win rate and a 50% one is pretty negligible.

And as I've already mentioned, the Oilers history spending in the free agent market doesn't place a lot of confidence behind the thought that $8m could be spent in better ways. Especially when you add to it the fact that the only way the Oilers have ever acquired impactful centers is by drafting them themselves.

 

[ImmuneEH]

Early Season Positives: We have the makings of a well-balanced team.

• The re-emergence of Neal gives us that bonafide winger that Nuge has sorely needed.
• Solid play by Kassian and Chiasson gives us cost-effective complementary players in the top 6.
• The special teams are great thanks to Tippett. Having Neal instead of Lucic on PP1 improved the results dramatically.
• With the emergence of Bear, we no longer have a hole in our top 4D. Going into the season, it seemed that we'd be going with either the less than desirable Russell in that spot, or flipping a coin on Persson or Benning at 2RD. Bear has looked great next to Nurse, does good work on the PK, and will only continue to grow. With Bouchard & Broberg on the way, we'll have a great young core for many years to come.
• Both goalies have been giving us quality starts.

2020/21 D Core:
Klefbomb/Larsson - Give them the tough minutes.
Nurse/Bear - Don't fix what ain't broken.
Lagesson/Bouchard - People might be apprehensive about seeing 2 rookies together, but I think Lagesson is solid defensively and seasoned enough at the pro level to make it work. It also helps that he and Bouchard will be playing a lot together in Bakersfield once Persson and/or Larsson is healthy.
Persson or Benning at 7D

If Klefbomb/Larsson isn't looking good for the remainder of the season, I'd consider selling Larsson in the off-season. I think his physicality, leadership, and experience would be useful to have while Bear and Bouchard are finding their way.

Protecting ourselves against expansion:
The rule: "One defenseman who is a) under contract in 2021-22 and b) played in at least 40 NHL games the prior season or played in at least 70 NHL games in the prior two seasons"

We need to give Persson or Benning a 2-year extension and ensure they accrue the noted games played above. I think Persson would be cheaper to keep, and we could probably get a 3rd out of Benning. I'm not sure that one is a big upgrade over the other at this time. Not doing this would force us to expose Bear.

2020 Off-season checklist:

• Off-load Kris Russell and Benning.
• Shop around for a quality 3C.
• Round out the bottom-6 with a combination of depth signings and prospects.
• Begin working on that Nuge extension pronto.

 

[GodPucker]

If you want to win the cup this year.. give our top 6 another solid contributor and it’s game over NHL.

No one would be able to stop our offence

That's what makes me excited. We have our stars. If Holland can get a solid contributor or two, it will be a huge improvement.

 

[Macblender]

How much do people realistically see RNH getting? I think the Hischier contract is probably a fair comparable less the RFA status. So probably in the 7.5MM range?

If that is the case then when Pouliots contract coming up after 20/21 at the same time as Nuge effectively would allow us to reallocate that dead cap to him and be pretty flat on cap expenditure with the cap likely going to a large degree that off season I see no issues at all for us long term. I think this will be a harder offseason fiscally.

Reason why I think the cap goes up is the new tv deal in the States. Here is some background https://thehockeywriters.com/nhl-tv-contract-nbc-deal-expiring/

 

[ImmuneEH]

How much do people realistically see RNH getting? I think the Hischier contract is probably a fair comparable less the RFA status. So probably in the 7.5MM range?

If that is the case then when Pouliots contract coming up after 20/21 at the same time as Nuge effectively would allow us to reallocate that dead cap to him and be pretty flat on cap expenditure with the cap likely going to a large degree that off season I see no issues at all for us long term. I think this will be a harder offseason fiscally.

Reason why I think the cap goes up is the new tv deal in the States. Here is some background https://thehockeywriters.com/nhl-tv-contract-nbc-deal-expiring/

$7.5 - $8. I don't give him more than $8 despite how much I like him.

 

[ThreeOfAPerfectPair]

 

[ThreeOfAPerfectPair]

delete

 

[Oilers in NS]

Dubas is a dumber version of Chiarelli. That was obvious the moment he signed Tavares and threw the salary structure of his young, up and coming team out the window. That type of signing made sense for that team when Stamkos was available and before the team starting drafting and developing young elite players. It didn’t make sense anymore last summer. It’s hilarious to watch that team starting to crash and burn because of that decision.

Maybe it will shut their fan base up and the Toronto media. Will they keep on saying McDavid wants to go to Toronto now? LMFAO

 

[frag2]

As the 7-and-1 Edmonton Oilers rocket out of the gate, we gaze deeper into a Taylor-made future: 9 Things

Haha wow. MacT is one petty mofo.
I mean I knew Buchberger was pissy about Hall because of alleged hurt feelings but haha MacT

Go freeze in Russia

 

[Snowpants]

I know Boyle not have the wheels Tipp wants for a forward but annoying to see a good third line centre signed this late in October and It not be here. It is clear Haas is not the guy right now and there is literally no one else. Hollsnd needs to make a move there and no Sam G is not enough (and I say as a big fan)

 

[Yeah15]

As the 7-and-1 Edmonton Oilers rocket out of the gate, we gaze deeper into a Taylor-made future: 9 Things

Haha wow. MacT is one petty mofo.
I mean I knew Buchberger was pissy about Hall because of alleged hurt feelings but haha MacT

Go freeze in Russia

Can't go freeze in Russia as he's not even welcome there as he's already been skidded haha

 

[rboomercat90]

As the 7-and-1 Edmonton Oilers rocket out of the gate, we gaze deeper into a Taylor-made future: 9 Things

Haha wow. MacT is one petty mofo.
I mean I knew Buchberger was pissy about Hall because of alleged hurt feelings but haha MacT

Go freeze in Russia

Mac T isn’t freezing in Russia. He didn’t last a month.

 

[ConnorMcNugesaitl]

As the 7-and-1 Edmonton Oilers rocket out of the gate, we gaze deeper into a Taylor-made future: 9 Things

Haha wow. MacT is one petty mofo.
I mean I knew Buchberger was pissy about Hall because of alleged hurt feelings but haha MacT

Go freeze in Russia

"1.There were 4 influential voices in the Edmonton Oilers decision to trade Taylor Hall. The obvious and most documented one was Peter Chiarelli. But Kelly Buchberger (in Player Personnel at the time) also advocated for it. So did former Head Coach Todd McLellan although Todd thought any return would be higher. Recently demoted G.M. Craig MacTavish was also still in the room. That MacT couldn’t make the playoffs with Hall likely stuck in his craw. Consider that Hall may have been a convenient outlet for MacTavish’s frustrations. None of the 4 men remain with the organization. In fact Oilers hockey ops have been pretty much wiped clean since then. If there were any hard feelings in the Hall Camp at the time (and there most definitely were) those who embodied those feelings are no long around. Remember, Keith Gretzky was hired almost 2 months after the Hall deal. His hands are clean."

This offers literally no insight on MacT or his impact on this trade.

This is just Leavins saying MacT might have been butthurt over Hall with literally no evidence. Just lazy stupid writing from Leavins here, reminds me of all the people who say Hall is a "cancer" with no evidence other than they've heard it said and are repeating it so it must be true.

This doesn't even speculate that MacT advocated for the trade or claim that he did only randomly speculates that he may have been pissy based on Leavins own assumptions.

This kind of crap is far too typical with the Oilers media, Staples, Spector etc.

 

[frag2]

"1.There were 4 influential voices in the Edmonton Oilers decision to trade Taylor Hall. The obvious and most documented one was Peter Chiarelli. But Kelly Buchberger (in Player Personnel at the time) also advocated for it. So did former Head Coach Todd McLellan although Todd thought any return would be higher. Recently demoted G.M. Craig MacTavish was also still in the room. That MacT couldn’t make the playoffs with Hall likely stuck in his craw. Consider that Hall may have been a convenient outlet for MacTavish’s frustrations. None of the 4 men remain with the organization. In fact Oilers hockey ops have been pretty much wiped clean since then. If there were any hard feelings in the Hall Camp at the time (and there most definitely were) those who embodied those feelings are no long around. Remember, Keith Gretzky was hired almost 2 months after the Hall deal. His hands are clean."

This offers literally no insight on MacT or his impact on this trade.

This is just Leavins saying MacT might have been ******** over Hall with literally no evidence. Just lazy stupid writing from Leavins here, reminds me of all the people who say Hall is a "cancer" with no evidence other than they've heard it said and are repeating it so it must be true.

This doesn't even speculate that MacT advocated for the trade or claim that he did only randomly speculates that he may have been pissy based on Leavins own assumptions.

This kind of crap is far too typical with the Oilers media, Staples, Spector etc.

So who do you believe?

 

[Snowpants]

So who do you believe?

Why not all of the above? We are not talking about Mensa here I could see MacT Tmac Buch and of course Chia laughing to themselves thinking they were the smartest people on earth trading Hall for Larsson

Thankfully all are gone

 

[Mcnotloilersfan]

Regardless is MacT was involved or not, Leavins is right and it echoing what I've been saying.

Hall wasn't angry with the city or the fans. He was angry because he saw potential here and he was thrown away for lesser value by a group of morons.

Those morons are gone and some very respectable people have taken their place.

Hall loved playing here, he is the missing piece to winning a cup here, he seems to still be very close with Connor. I have to imagine if the trade and contract make sense, Hall would rather win a cup here more than anywhere else because he knows how special it will be. Lifting the cup in Canada, for the team he always envisioned, and knowing Chiarelli is watching.

 

[frag2]

Regardless is MacT was involved or not, Leavins is right and it echoing what I've been saying.

Hall wasn't angry with the city or the fans. He was angry because he saw potential here and he was thrown away for lesser value by a group of morons.

Those morons are gone and some very respectable people have taken their place.

Hall loved playing here, he is the missing piece to winning a cup here, he seems to still be very close with Connor. I have to imagine if the trade and contract make sense, Hall would rather win a cup here more than anywhere else because he knows how special it will be. Lifting the cup in Canada, for the team he always envisioned, and knowing Chiarelli is watching.

Agreed. The management was so dysfunctional and Chia and co seemingly used Hall as their scapegoat IMO

I'm guessing the last quip about Hall's circle not being just him and Ferris probably includes McDavid and a few others on the roster still

 

[CaptainSexyPants]

Regardless is MacT was involved or not, Leavins is right and it echoing what I've been saying.

Hall wasn't angry with the city or the fans. He was angry because he saw potential here and he was thrown away for lesser value by a group of morons.

Those morons are gone and some very respectable people have taken their place.

Hall loved playing here, he is the missing piece to winning a cup here, he seems to still be very close with Connor. I have to imagine if the trade and contract make sense, Hall would rather win a cup here more than anywhere else because he knows how special it will be. Lifting the cup in Canada, for the team he always envisioned, and knowing Chiarelli is watching.

Well the bolded could be a bit much.

Personally though, I'd like to see more from Neal before deciding which side of the fence to jump on. 92 goals might be unrealistic, but does he land at 20? 25? 30? 35? Neal ain't Hall, but I'm not sure I'd pay 5-6 mil for the difference.

I think the D also needs to keep it up for a whole lot longer before we can say "we don't need a big upgrade there so lets go all in on a F instead".

 

[McShogun99]

Regardless is MacT was involved or not, Leavins is right and it echoing what I've been saying.

Hall wasn't angry with the city or the fans. He was angry because he saw potential here and he was thrown away for lesser value by a group of morons.

Those morons are gone and some very respectable people have taken their place.

Hall loved playing here, he is the missing piece to winning a cup here, he seems to still be very close with Connor. I have to imagine if the trade and contract make sense, Hall would rather win a cup here more than anywhere else because he knows how special it will be. Lifting the cup in Canada, for the team he always envisioned, and knowing Chiarelli is watching.

We haven't had a GM that's been this respected by the league since Sather. It's a weird feeling.

 

[Mcnotloilersfan]

Well the bolded could be a bit much.

Personally though, I'd like to see more from Neal before deciding which side of the fence to jump on. 92 goals might be unrealistic, but does he land at 20? 25? 30? 35? Neal ain't Hall, but I'm not sure I'd pay 5-6 mil for the difference.

I think the D also needs to keep it up for a whole lot longer before we can say "we don't need a big upgrade there so lets go all in on a F instead".

On the D side of things we have too many high quality prospects for it not to work. Some will/may bust sure, but enough of them will make it through and the back end will be solid.

Our teams problem right now is a lack of scoring threat when our top 2 aren't out there. I like Nuge and Neal has been a breath of fresh air, but neither make a defense pairing panic.

Now Imagine Nuge-McDavid-Neal on one line and Hall-Draisaitl-Kassian on another. How do you contain that?

 

[McTonyBrar]

"1.There were 4 influential voices in the Edmonton Oilers decision to trade Taylor Hall. The obvious and most documented one was Peter Chiarelli. But Kelly Buchberger (in Player Personnel at the time) also advocated for it. So did former Head Coach Todd McLellan although Todd thought any return would be higher. Recently demoted G.M. Craig MacTavish was also still in the room. That MacT couldn’t make the playoffs with Hall likely stuck in his craw. Consider that Hall may have been a convenient outlet for MacTavish’s frustrations. None of the 4 men remain with the organization. In fact Oilers hockey ops have been pretty much wiped clean since then. If there were any hard feelings in the Hall Camp at the time (and there most definitely were) those who embodied those feelings are no long around. Remember, Keith Gretzky was hired almost 2 months after the Hall deal. His hands are clean."

This offers literally no insight on MacT or his impact on this trade.

This is just Leavins saying MacT might have been ******** over Hall with literally no evidence. Just lazy stupid writing from Leavins here, reminds me of all the people who say Hall is a "cancer" with no evidence other than they've heard it said and are repeating it so it must be true.

This doesn't even speculate that MacT advocated for the trade or claim that he did only randomly speculates that he may have been pissy based on Leavins own assumptions.

This kind of crap is far too typical with the Oilers media, Staples, Spector etc.

Craig MacTavish is that you? How was Russia?

 

[CaptainSexyPants]

On the D side of things we have too many high quality prospects for it not to work. Some will/may bust sure, but enough of them will make it through and the back end will be solid.

At 8 games in I don't know that I'm that confident yet that D is the "very good" we've seen so far as opposed to the "bottom 5 in the league" that everyone would have thought we'd be minus Larsson.

I don't think it's as easy as saying "some might bust but enough will make it that the back end will be solid". Just "making it" is not enough. Bear for example might be a legit regular NHL'er, but there is a huge difference between him being a passable #6 and an elite 2nd pair guy you want going up against the Tampa Bay's of the league. If he's not the latter, who is and how do we get them?

Our teams problem right now is a lack of scoring threat when our top 2 aren't out there. I like Nuge and Neal has been a breath of fresh air, but neither make a defense pairing panic.

Now Imagine Nuge-McDavid-Neal on one line and Hall-Draisaitl-Kassian on another. How do you contain that?

Scary top 6 for sure but my hesitancy with Hall is I don't see any way we can keep all 5 of those guys. IMO Hall gets at least 11 and Nuge 8. 12.5 + 11 + 8.5 + 8 + 5.75 = ~45.75 on 5 guys, with still a ton of people to sign next year and the following. And if the free agents pan out like we hope, and we actually go somewhere this year, then it means they're all getting paid.

 

[Snowpants]

So I tried to find a way to fit in Hall at 10+ and while it is next to impossible with out ripping the team apart here it is with Hall at 9.5 (8 years 12/12/10/10/9/9/7/7)

Benson/Yams McD Drai
Hall RNH Neal
Khaira 3C Chiasson
Benson/Yams 4C 4RW
Marody Gambardella

Nurse (8 mill) Bear (3 mill)
Klefbom Persson (1.25 mill)
Lagesson (1.0 mill) Bouchard
7D

Koskinen
2G

-Larsson -Russell, have to trade for no roster players basicakly

Where 3C = 3 mill, 4C = 950k, 4RW = 800k, 7D 800k, 2G 900k.

Leaves 1.3 mill of space at a 84 mill cap.

Yo u can tweak here or there but I do not see many ways to get it lower than that. Maybe Nurse comes in lower that owuld help. Really the thing that hurts is all the stupid buy outs.

In 2021 on Seattle will boost the cap up like Vegas did and so will new TV deal plus we will have the buy outs gone so there is more room. If we are willing to maybe ice a not as good roster for one year to squeeze Hall in it is possible but is it worth te risk?

 

[CaptainSexyPants]

I did one sorta similar. Giving the existing roster somewhat minor (10% ish) re-ups, dumping Russell and Benning, and signing Nurse to a Provorov contract.
Drai 8.5-McD 12.5-Kass 2.75
Hall 11-RNH 6-Neal 5.75
Jujh 1.2-Shea 1-Chais 2.15
Nyg 1-Haas 1-Jurco .95
Bens .8

Klef 4.16-Lars 4.16
Nurse 6.75-Bear 1.25
Lage .8-Pers 1.15
Bou .9

Kosk 4.5
Smith 2.5

It still comes to 85.4 next year, then RNH is up the following so put another 1.5 towards that, conservatively..

Keeping the top 5 forwards isn't in the cards, IMO, and I'm not sure you can hang onto RNH's 7.5/8 with or without Neal, if Hall is there at 11.