Speculation: Roster Speculation Part VII

[Aladyyn]

If the Duchene rumor is true, I can see the ROR crowd getting worked up, but I think it fits with the MO that Botterill wants to build a team that can outskate anyone.

Worked up about what? We already established Botterill's words are meaningless months ago. Trading for Duchene is par for the course.

Though pursuing a good player would certainly be a a pleasant surprise.

 

[Snippit]

Getting a signed Duchene in a trade would be a great move.

 

[CaptPantalones]

As sexy a rumor as it might be to think the Sabres would go big-game hunting with Duchene, it's hard to see Botterill adding Duchene and re-signing him to the rumored $8M x 8 deal at the same time as Skinner's extension is in the mix.....it would be cap hell once Dahlin and Reinhart are on their next contracts with Eichel, Skinner and Duchene all over $8M and Okposo's contract still in the mix.

If Botterill makes any impact moves, I'd rather see someone like Zucker, Toffoli or Athanasiou be a target. I wouldn't mind Duchene from talent perspective but the cap issues are worrisome - even if the Sabres can afford it overall, they'd be going the top-heavy approach where 5-6 players take up more than 50% of the cap.

Not even close to cap hell when you got pominville and, although I wish him the best health wise, okposo, possibly coming off. And bogosian and scandella next year

 

[Zip15]

Guys like Stone and Duchene aren’t going to get away from a five-alarm tire fire of an organization, only to sign long-term with a slightly smaller tire fire of an organization.

 

[OkimLom]

If the Duchene rumor is true, I can see the ROR crowd getting worked up, but I think it fits with the MO that Botterill wants to build a team that can outskate anyone.

Wouldn’t mind it, I like Duchene, but as someone with “character issues” and a “fragile locker room” according to their own captain, I would find it more funny than anything, not to mention giving up assets instead of waiting until the offseason.

 

[Beerz]

Yeah... preaching about culture and then going after Duchene would seem legit.

 

[Jim Bob]

I would be shocked if the Sens traded Stone or Duchene in the division given how they handled the Hoffman and Karlsson trades.

 

[truthbluth]

Wouldn’t mind it, I like Duchene, but as someone with “character issues” and a “fragile locker room” according to their own captain, I would find it more funny than anything, not to mention giving up assets instead of waiting until the offseason.

It's not the kind of character issues that Pegula/Botterill care about. They care about Seguin-type character issues. They love people like Duchene.

The bigger issue with Duchene, imo, is he's not that productive. Only one 70 point season
(he will probably have his 2nd this year), only one 30 goal season (again, this season will probably be his 2nd) in 9 seasons. And his first PPG season comes in his first ever UFA ending season at 28 years old.
If you are going to spend that money, spend it on Stone.

 

[truthbluth]

I would be shocked if the Sens traded Stone or Duchene in the division given how they handled the Hoffman and Karlsson trades.

They did very poorly in those trades. They can't afford to get worked again.

 

[Jim Bob]

They did very poorly in those trades. They can't afford to get worked again.

Sure they can.

The reasoning for it is about avoiding embarrassment and not maximizing their return.

 

[truthbluth]

Sure they can.

The reasoning for it is about avoiding embarrassment and not maximizing their return.

I think when they made those trades, they thought they'd resign Stone and Duchene. They were putting off total rebuild. Now they're not.

 

[Zip15]

They did very poorly in those trades. They can't afford to get worked again.

Better teams can provide a better return. Ottawa isn’t taking Nylander and a 1st - and Buffalo isn’t even going to offer that for a rental, so it’s moot - if Nashville offers Tolvanen and a 1st.

 

[OkimLom]

Better teams can provide a better return. Ottawa isn’t taking Nylander and a 1st - and Buffalo isn’t even going to offer that for a rental, so it’s moot - if Nashville offers Tolvanen and a 1st.

Not to mention it’s within division. They wouldn’t trade Hoffman within division for anything, how do you think they will feel about trading Stone or Duchene?

 

[TehDoak]

I would be shocked if the Sens traded Stone or Duchene in the division given how they handled the Hoffman and Karlsson trades.

While I do think the idea Buffalo is even remotely in on Duchene, I could see a scenario where Buffalo is involved in the trade. Maybe a team doesn't have a first, gets a first via Buffalo. Or maybe a team is cap strapped and Ottawa doesn't want to take on a contract, etc.

 

[CatsforReinhart]

Guys like Stone and Duchene aren’t going to get away from a five-alarm tire fire of an organization, only to sign long-term with a slightly smaller tire fire of an organization.

Money solves their worries

While I do think the idea Buffalo is even remotely in on Duchene, I could see a scenario where Buffalo is involved in the trade. Maybe a team doesn't have a first, gets a first via Buffalo. Or maybe a team is cap strapped and Ottawa doesn't want to take on a contract, etc.

Rumor is Botts may be willing to let go 2 1sts at the deadline. Not saying it is going to happen but there is definitely a buzz out there about Buffalo trading 1st rounders
(When I say Buzz, Twitter Pundits repeating TSN and other talking heads)

 

[Jim Bob]

While I do think the idea Buffalo is even remotely in on Duchene, I could see a scenario where Buffalo is involved in the trade. Maybe a team doesn't have a first, gets a first via Buffalo. Or maybe a team is cap strapped and Ottawa doesn't want to take on a contract, etc.

It will be interesting to see how Botts plays it at the deadline.

 

[CatsforReinhart]

It will be interesting to see how Botts plays it at the deadline.

Do fans give up on winning if Botts sells? To be honest him selling off Sobotka, Pominville, Scandella or other vets will probably make the team better.

 

[Jim Bob]

Do fans give up on winning if Botts sells? To be honest him selling off Sobotka, Pominville, Scandella or other vets will probably make the team better.

The question is not do the fans give up, but do the players in the locker room give up?

 

[CatsforReinhart]

The question is not do the fans give up, but do the players in the locker room give up?

We can't control the players so not really thinking that.

I am thinking about the booing and the dumpster fire the board will turn into like last year when the team tanked.

 

[Jim Bob]

We can't control the players so not really thinking that.

I am thinking about the booing and the dumpster fire the board will turn into like last year when the team tanked.

I care less about fan reaction than player reaction.

The players impact W/L way more than the fans.

 

[CatsforReinhart]

I care less about fan reaction than player reaction.

The players impact W/L way more than the fans.

I dont really care what you care about. You can worry until you are blue in the face its not relevant to the outcome because you can't control the players.

You can boo and complain. Also booing gets people fired.

I was asking a question. Its ok, you aren't capable of answering. We can move on.

 

[TehDoak]

Yes, magic beans for useful players. Tank on.

I think, given the recent history of the Sabres, we probably need to take a look at most of the roster. I certainly agree that Girgensons and Larsson ARE useful.

However, I also think they have limited upside and have been mired in the "Sabres culture" for too long. These are career 4th liners. They've had ample opportunity to rise in the ranks on these awful teams....they haven't. While I'm not advocating a full on stripping the team down to the core and re-building, I do think we finally have a deep enough bench in Rochester where our 4th line can be used as a developmental tool. I'd love to give O'Regan shot at 4th line duty before he walks as a UFA at this summer. I'd also love to have some spots to put veterans in on PTO at camp.

Larsson and Girgensons are both declining assets. This summer we have to either start buying out UFA years ($$) or simply let them sign their QO (over 1.5M each). This is a sellers market. They are both movable assets that would be desirable and over valued on the deadline market.

 

[Jim Bob]

I dont really care what you care about. You can worry until you are blue in the face its not relevant. You can't control the players.

You can boo and complain. Also booing gets people fired.

I was asking a question. Its ok, you aren't capable of answering. We can move on.

If fans whining, complaing, and booing got people fired, Housley wouldn't still be the coach.

 

[Jim Bob]

I think, given the recent history of the Sabres, we probably need to take a look at most of the roster. I certainly agree that Girgensons and Larsson ARE useful.

However, I also think they have limited upside and have been mired in the "Sabres culture" for too long. These are career 4th liners. They've had ample opportunity to rise in the ranks on these awful teams....they haven't. While I'm not advocating a full on stripping the team down to the core and re-building, I do think we finally have a deep enough bench in Rochester where our 4th line can be used as a developmental tool. I'd love to give O'Regan shot at 4th line duty before he walks as a UFA at this summer. I'd also love to have some spots to put veterans in on PTO at camp.

Larsson and Girgensons are both declining assets. This summer we have to either start buying out UFA years ($$) or simply let them sign their QO (over 1.5M each). This is a sellers market. They are both movable assets that would be desirable and over valued on the deadline market.

What do you think they would return and what would you want to get back to move them?

 

[AustonsNostrils]

Larsson and Girgensons are both declining assets. This summer we have to either start buying out UFA years ($$) or simply let them sign their QO (over 1.5M each). This is a sellers market. They are both movable assets that would be desirable and over valued on the deadline market.

How are you deducing this? Girgensons and Larsson aren't returning 1st round picks, even if they returned 2nd round picks the odds of those picks becoming the equals of Girgensons and Larsson in 3 or 4 years are about a 30% probability.