Roster Speculation '17-'18: Someone, Somewhere, In Summertime

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GellMann

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Dec 16, 2014
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Lancaster NY
Picture it being last offseason, only Sam skated way faster and hit 70 points in 82 games, and then an Avs fan strolling in and saying he'd only trade Zadorov for Risto and Sam.

That's what the original proposal was.
 

SECRET SQUIRREL

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Jan 17, 2007
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Clarence
I like the idea of Winnipeg trying to clear cap space... Myers and Mason, both have 1 year left. Assuming the cost is minimal... I’d be very interested.
I've been watching a ton of Winnipeg this year and it's insane how much Myers game has changed. He's still the same player offensively but man is he infinitely better at using his size now...At least 3 times in the last month or so he's lost his shit and been a full blown lunatic on the ice, it's incredible. He's a completely different player now and it makes that trade hurt even worse. I'd totally take him back on this team in a second, no idea what it'd cost tho...
 
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Sabreality

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Aug 12, 2008
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Not a Mason fan at all, I'd rather bring back Lehner. The Hutton idea is a solid one, although I'm not sure he replicates the solid seasons he's had of late, didnt realize he's already 32 also.

It is going to be interesting to see how Botts addresses goalie. Guys like Halak, Lehtonen or Ward arent the answer and do guys like Khudobin, Hutchinson, Hamburglar, Sateri etc provide enough upside if Ullmark struggles

Grubauer is still RFA, so Caps have no need to move him next year outside of overpayment?

Any waiver eligible youngins with upside stuck at 3G available? ala Dansk, Gillies, DeSmth...
 
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gallagt01

Registered User
Jun 10, 2006
14,747
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Sloan
Building on Jame's post from yesterday, if the "skeleton" for next year features a core of Eichel, ROR, Mittelstadt and Reinhart up front with Guhle, Risto and Scandella on the backend, Botteril has his work cut out for him in terms of supporting that group with quality depth.

(I'm only going to address the forwards right now because this post was getting super lengthy.)

Currently contracted forwards for 18-19 (excluding Moulson): Okposo, Pominville, Girgensons, Larsson, Rodrigues, Nylander, Porter, Cornel, Criscuolo, Pu, Karabacek.

Likely forward prospects to be signed: Asplund, Olofsson.

RFA forwards heading into 18-19 (excluding Reinhart): Wilson, Baptiste, Bailey, Griffith, Fasching, O'Reagan, Smith, Malone.

UFA forwards this offseason: Nolan, Josefson, Pouliot.

So the Sabres have nine "non-core" forward spots to fill with the above pool of players (plus trades, FA, and the 2019 pick if it's a forward).

Stating the obvious first, none of the three UFA forwards has earned another contract and I think rewarding any of them with one, given how replaceable their roles are, only perpetuates a losing culture that surely exists in Buffalo.

I do think every RFA forward has earned another contract, but the only that has a spot on my 18-19 roster is Scott Wilson. None of the others (again, excluding Reinhart) has made a clear-as-day case for an 18-19 roster spot, though I do think Baptiste and Bailey filling out the 12/13 spots is probably fine given their waiver eligibility.

I could see both Asplund and Olofsson putting up a fight for a spot but both will likely start in Rochester.

Moving onto the contracted forwards, things get muddy. The only player on this list that I'm confident has secured a depth role based on play is Rodrigues, who has shown to be a valuable complimentary piece offensively (despite some maddening tendencies).

Given contract status, as much as I'd like for them to find a taker, Okposo probably has to be penciled in. Girgensons and Larsson have, in my eyes, played their way out of meaningful minutes, and the skill really isn't there, but I'll take both back as fourth liners (ONLY fourth liners) to play with a legitimate veteran acquisition, or a younger Baptiste/Bailey that wins the job in camp. That line lacks skill and won't produce much, but I could see it being tough to play against and energetic.

Pominville, I'm sure we'll all agree, should be moved. I don't think he'll be on the roster next year (though I don't know how that happens).

That leaves me with the following forward "skeleton":

Rodrigues-Eichel-Okposo
Wilson-ROR-Reinhart
Xxx-Mittelstadt-Xxx
Girgensons-Larsson-Xxx/Baptiste/Bailey
Baptiste/Bailey
Xxx

I suspect a few people are going to complain about the positions Wilson, Okposo, Rodrigues, etc. are taking on here. Don't get hung up on the "lineup", but keep in mind that this isn't going to be an overnight process. They aren't going to sign some "stud 30-goal first line elite LW" to play with Jack. Okposo isn't going away. They need to bolster the core incrementally with smart, under-the-radar additions.

I don't expect a "splash signing". I'm filling the Xs with good NHLers that won't break the bank. Calvert as a third liner or solid fourth liner. Riley Nash for the same role. A fast, productive Grabner for the third line (though he may be in demand). Etc.

Obviously there are variables at play here that change the makeup of this roster. Nylander could impress enough. Olofsson, Asplund and Malone could make some noise. They could draft a maybe-ready forward in the draft. I don't know what kind of acquisitions Botteril is going to make.

But either way, it's going to take a couple seasons for the quality of the depth to catch up to the quality of the core.

Purging the roster of hardly-NHLers is a necessary start.
 
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Fezzy126

Rebuilding...
May 10, 2017
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Not a Mason fan at all, I'd rather bring back Lehner. The Hutton idea is a solid one, although I'm not sure he replicates the solid seasons he's had of late, didnt realize he's already 32 also.

It is going to be interesting to see how Botts addresses goalie. Guys like Halak, Lehtonen or Ward arent the answer and do guys like Khudobin, Hutchinson, Hamburglar, Sateri etc provide enough upside if Ullmark struggles

Grubauer is still RFA, so Caps have no need to move him next year outside of overpayment?

Any waiver eligible youngins with upside stuck at 3G available? ala Dansk, Gillies, DeSmth...

I'd rather see us go the veteran route a la an Elliot/Allen tandem, we already have the young guy in Ullmark. If Ullmark flounders this year then we can (hopefully) re-address our pipeline.

What about Schneider? Are his last 2 years aberration due to injury or a permanent decline? Anyone willing to take on his contract and bet on a return to form?
 

CaptPantalones

Registered User
Oct 8, 2006
6,355
503
Buffalo, NY
Building on Jame's post from yesterday, if the "skeleton" for next year features a core of Eichel, ROR, Mittelstadt and Reinhart up front with Guhle, Risto and Scandella on the backend, Botteril has his work cut out for him in terms of supporting that group with quality depth.

(I'm only going to address the forwards right now because this post was getting super lengthy.)

Currently contracted forwards for 18-19 (excluding Moulson): Okposo, Pominville, Girgensons, Larsson, Rodrigues, Nylander, Porter, Cornel, Criscuolo, Pu, Karabacek.

Likely forward prospects to be signed: Asplund, Olofsson.

RFA forwards heading into 18-19 (excluding Reinhart): Wilson, Baptiste, Bailey, Griffith, Fasching, O'Reagan, Smith, Malone.

UFA forwards this offseason: Nolan, Josefson, Pouliot.

So the Sabres have nine "non-core" forward spots to fill with the above pool of players (plus trades, FA, and the 2019 pick if it's a forward).

Stating the obvious first, none of the three UFA forwards has earned another contract and I think rewarding any of them with one, given how replaceable their roles are, only perpetuates a losing culture that surely exists in Buffalo.

I do think every RFA forward has earned another contract, but the only that has a spot on my 18-19 roster is Scott Wilson. None of the others (again, excluding Reinhart) has made a clear-as-day case for an 18-19 roster spot, though I do think Baptiste and Bailey filling out the 12/13 spots is probably fine given their waiver eligibility.

I could see both Asplund and Olofsson putting up a fight for a spot but both will likely start in Rochester.

Moving onto the contracted forwards, things get muddy. The only player on this list that I'm confident has secured a depth role based on play is Rodrigues, who has shown to be a valuable complimentary piece offensively (despite some maddening tendencies).

Given contract status, as much as I'd like for them to find a taker, Okposo probably has to be penciled in. Girgensons and Larsson have, in my eyes, played their way out of meaningful minutes, and the skill really isn't there, but I'll take both back as fourth liners (ONLY fourth liners) to play with a legitimate veteran acquisition, or a younger Baptiste/Bailey that wins the job in camp. That line lacks skill and won't produce much, but I could see it being tough to play against and energetic.

Pominville, I'm sure we'll all agree, should be moved. I don't think he'll be on the roster next year (though I don't know how that happens).

That leaves me with the following forward "skeleton":

Rodrigues-Eichel-Okposo
Wilson-ROR-Reinhart
Xxx-Mittelstadt-Xxx
Girgensons-Larsson-Xxx/Baptiste/Bailey
Baptiste/Bailey
Xxx

I suspect a few people are going to complain about the positions Wilson, Okposo, Rodrigues, etc. are taking on here. Don't get hung up on the "lineup", but keep in mind that this isn't going to be an overnight process. They aren't going to sign some "stud 30-goal first line elite LW" to play with Jack. Okposo isn't going away. They need to bolster the core incrementally with smart, under-the-radar additions.

I don't expect a "splash signing". I'm filling the Xs with good NHLers that won't break the bank. Calvert as a third liner or solid fourth liner. Riley Nash for the same role. A fast, productive Grabner for the third line (though he may be in demand). Etc.

Obviously there are variables at play here that change the makeup of this roster. Nylander could impress enough. Olofsson, Asplund and Malone could make some noise. They could draft a maybe-ready forward in the draft. I don't know what kind of acquisitions Botteril is going to make.

But either way, it's going to take a couple seasons for the quality of the depth to catch up to the quality of the core.

Purging the roster of hardly-NHLers is a necessary start.

Very well thought out, but I completely disagree with pominville needing to go. Nobody will trade for the contract, and his production and leadership is fine for a bottom 6 role next year. Pretty positive Botts feels the same
 

Kyndig

Registered User
Jan 3, 2012
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I'd rather see us go the veteran route a la an Elliot/Allen tandem, we already have the young guy in Ullmark. If Ullmark flounders this year then we can (hopefully) re-address our pipeline.

What about Schneider? Are his last 2 years aberration due to injury or a permanent decline? Anyone willing to take on his contract and bet on a return to form?

So your grand plan for replacing Lehner and TheChad is to find two goalies who may actually be worse this season instead of giving Ullmark, who will be 25 next year btw, a decent chance. Fire up the tank thread, whos going #1? Jack Hughes we're comin' for ya!
 

Fezzy126

Rebuilding...
May 10, 2017
8,541
11,267
So your grand plan for replacing Lehner and TheChad is to find two goalies who may actually be worse this season instead of giving Ullmark, who will be 25 next year btw, a decent chance. Fire up the tank thread, whos going #1? Jack Hughes we're comin' for ya!

Perhaps you misread my post, my plan is to go with a tandem of a vet (i.e. Schneider) and young up and coming prospect (i.e. Ullmark).

And nothing I could ever concoct in my head would be worse than Lehner and Chad.
 

Kyndig

Registered User
Jan 3, 2012
5,147
2,862
Perhaps you misread my post, my plan is to go with a tandem of a vet (i.e. Schneider) and young up and coming prospect (i.e. Ullmark).

And nothing I could ever concoct in my head would be worse than Lehner and Chad.

Yeah I thought you were saying you wanted Allen and Elliot after they've had terrible seasons this year.

Ullmark should be one of the two goalies for sure, as for the other I'd prefer Neuvirth over Schneider..assuming Neuvirth can stay healthy. Unless we can get Grubauer...
 

Jame

Registered User
Sep 4, 2002
52,673
9,037
Florida
Not a Mason fan at all, I'd rather bring back Lehner. The Hutton idea is a solid one, although I'm not sure he replicates the solid seasons he's had of late, didnt realize he's already 32 also.

It is going to be interesting to see how Botts addresses goalie. Guys like Halak, Lehtonen or Ward arent the answer and do guys like Khudobin, Hutchinson, Hamburglar, Sateri etc provide enough upside if Ullmark struggles

Grubauer is still RFA, so Caps have no need to move him next year outside of overpayment?

Any waiver eligible youngins with upside stuck at 3G available? ala Dansk, Gillies, DeSmth...

I don’t think anyone is a Mason fan... lol

I think the premise of allowing someone to cap dump a 1-2 year veteran goalie on us, while acquiring a legit top 4 defensemen... is exactly the type of opportunity cost we should be looking for this offseason.

If the belief is that Ullmark is the goalie of the future, we’re still gonna end up spending 3-4 or more million on a veteran backup anyways... why not let that be Mason (for only 1 year), while getting Myers to be the other top 4 RD that we need.

It’s the Scandella Trade (Poms = Mason)... with less term.
 

flashsabre

Registered User
Apr 5, 2003
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Visit site
Man Guhle and Nelson are such an upgrade over the deadweight on the backend (sign nelson now). A lot of people have mentioned bringing in Pateryn to create a shutdown pair with Scandella. If that doesn't happen I would like to see them start with Scandella-Nelson and then see at midseason if Borgen is ready to come up and join Scandella in that role and free up Nelson for another pairing. I really like Borgen's game and see him as a good shutdown D in the NHL down the road.

Dropping the dead weight and letting the kids step in will improve this team as much as big moves or signings. Mittlestadt has looked very good in a short sample. ERod looks so much more confident with the puck. Staple him to Jack for an extended period and i think the results would be very positive. Nylander has shown flashes of his high end skill over 2 games and him turning out would be a huge boost. Baptiste has been solid, using his speed and hands to create some chance while being stuck with garbage for the most part.

It's too bad Ullmark got hurt and couldn't get a couple games in to end the season. Hopefully he is alright for the AHL playoffs. I fully believe they let Johnson walk and don't qualify Lehner. Sign a guy like Francouz or one of the NHL tenders and let him and Ullmark battle it out.
 

CatsforReinhart

Registered User
Jul 27, 2014
7,315
1,623
Frankfurt
Building on Jame's post from yesterday, if the "skeleton" for next year features a core of Eichel, ROR, Mittelstadt and Reinhart up front with Guhle, Risto and Scandella on the backend, Botteril has his work cut out for him in terms of supporting that group with quality depth.

(I'm only going to address the forwards right now because this post was getting super lengthy.)

Currently contracted forwards for 18-19 (excluding Moulson): Okposo, Pominville, Girgensons, Larsson, Rodrigues, Nylander, Porter, Cornel, Criscuolo, Pu, Karabacek.

Likely forward prospects to be signed: Asplund, Olofsson.

RFA forwards heading into 18-19 (excluding Reinhart): Wilson, Baptiste, Bailey, Griffith, Fasching, O'Reagan, Smith, Malone.

UFA forwards this offseason: Nolan, Josefson, Pouliot.

So the Sabres have nine "non-core" forward spots to fill with the above pool of players (plus trades, FA, and the 2019 pick if it's a forward).

Stating the obvious first, none of the three UFA forwards has earned another contract and I think rewarding any of them with one, given how replaceable their roles are, only perpetuates a losing culture that surely exists in Buffalo.

I do think every RFA forward has earned another contract, but the only that has a spot on my 18-19 roster is Scott Wilson. None of the others (again, excluding Reinhart) has made a clear-as-day case for an 18-19 roster spot, though I do think Baptiste and Bailey filling out the 12/13 spots is probably fine given their waiver eligibility.

I could see both Asplund and Olofsson putting up a fight for a spot but both will likely start in Rochester.

Moving onto the contracted forwards, things get muddy. The only player on this list that I'm confident has secured a depth role based on play is Rodrigues, who has shown to be a valuable complimentary piece offensively (despite some maddening tendencies).

Given contract status, as much as I'd like for them to find a taker, Okposo probably has to be penciled in. Girgensons and Larsson have, in my eyes, played their way out of meaningful minutes, and the skill really isn't there, but I'll take both back as fourth liners (ONLY fourth liners) to play with a legitimate veteran acquisition, or a younger Baptiste/Bailey that wins the job in camp. That line lacks skill and won't produce much, but I could see it being tough to play against and energetic.

Pominville, I'm sure we'll all agree, should be moved. I don't think he'll be on the roster next year (though I don't know how that happens).

That leaves me with the following forward "skeleton":

Rodrigues-Eichel-Okposo
Wilson-ROR-Reinhart
Xxx-Mittelstadt-Xxx
Girgensons-Larsson-Xxx/Baptiste/Bailey
Baptiste/Bailey
Xxx

I suspect a few people are going to complain about the positions Wilson, Okposo, Rodrigues, etc. are taking on here. Don't get hung up on the "lineup", but keep in mind that this isn't going to be an overnight process. They aren't going to sign some "stud 30-goal first line elite LW" to play with Jack. Okposo isn't going away. They need to bolster the core incrementally with smart, under-the-radar additions.

I don't expect a "splash signing". I'm filling the Xs with good NHLers that won't break the bank. Calvert as a third liner or solid fourth liner. Riley Nash for the same role. A fast, productive Grabner for the third line (though he may be in demand). Etc.

Obviously there are variables at play here that change the makeup of this roster. Nylander could impress enough. Olofsson, Asplund and Malone could make some noise. They could draft a maybe-ready forward in the draft. I don't know what kind of acquisitions Botteril is going to make.

But either way, it's going to take a couple seasons for the quality of the depth to catch up to the quality of the core.

Purging the roster of hardly-NHLers is a necessary start.
I think we will see Nylander on the 3rd line the start of next season
 

Vito_81

Registered User
Jul 23, 2006
9,952
1,219
Toronto
Is an Okposo buyout really that bad?

18-19. Caphit 4.0M/saving2.0M
19-20Caphit 4.0M/savings 2.0M
20-21Caphit 4.0M/savings 2.0M
21-22 Caphit 5.0M/savings 1.0M
22-23Caphit 3.0M/savings 3.0M
23-24Caphit 1.0M/savings -1.0M
24-25Caphit 1.0M/savings -1.0M
25-26Caphit 1.0M/savings -1.0M
26-27Caphit 1.0M/savings -1.0M
27-28Caphit 1.0M/savings -1.0M

2 million in cap savings for the next 3 seasons is good.

5 million against the cap with just 1 million in capsavings in 2021-2022 is potentially very bad.
Considering this is smackdab in the middle of what hopes to be our winning window.

3 million in savings in 2022-2023 season is better

5 seasons of a dead 1 million in capspace from 2023-2028 is nothing to worry about.
 

AustonsNostrils

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Apr 5, 2016
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I was wrong about Don Granato and TNT
Jun 28, 2011
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Is an Okposo buyout really that bad?

18-19. Caphit 4.0M/saving2.0M
19-20Caphit 4.0M/savings 2.0M
20-21Caphit 4.0M/savings 2.0M
21-22 Caphit 5.0M/savings 1.0M
22-23Caphit 3.0M/savings 3.0M
23-24Caphit 1.0M/savings -1.0M
24-25Caphit 1.0M/savings -1.0M
25-26Caphit 1.0M/savings -1.0M
26-27Caphit 1.0M/savings -1.0M
27-28Caphit 1.0M/savings -1.0M

2 million in cap savings for the next 3 seasons is good.

5 million against the cap with just 1 million in capsavings in 2021-2022 is potentially very bad.
Considering this is smackdab in the middle of what hopes to be our winning window.

3 million in savings in 2022-2023 season is better

5 seasons of a dead 1 million in capspace from 2023-2028 is nothing to worry about.

Okposo is still a competent top six player when healthy. Buying him out hurts the team more than it helps given that the team lacks scoring.
 
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