Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XVIII

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Tawnos

A guy with a bass
Sep 10, 2004
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Semantics here, but isn't it only top-3 protected? If ARI goes on a skid, the Devils could still end up with two top-15 picks in a loaded draft class.

Only top-3, though, I thought?

Guys... I always thought that's what lottery protected meant. It's protected if they win the lottery. When it's been different, it's been said a different way. i.e. "top-10 protected"
 

wafflepadsave

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May 28, 2011
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Kreider is a big player with speed, he uses neither on a regular basis. I love his ability and skill but he is a pretty passive player given his physical attributes. Of all players on our team that could force dmen into mistakes by barreling in on them he is the one that could but doesnt have the biggest impact. Zuc as small as he was was more physical than Kreider in all areas of the ice.
The only thing I can say in Kreider’s defense is that when he has steamrolled players, the referees called penalties to the point of keeping him passive.
On the other hand, he doesn’t seem to be able to adjust his speed or body position to make cleaner hits either. He could quite possibly learn to bend down a bit hit cleanly to please the refs.
 

Edge

Kris King's Ghost
Mar 1, 2002
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At the end of the day, the same reasons why there is the hesitation to move Kreider, and concerns about replacing him, is exactly why someone else wants him.

They don't have that depth piece or wing for their center. They want that depth or wing for their center.

Chris Kreider, without having a real hot streak yet this season, is pacing at 20 goals and 45 points. And that includes going without a goal for the first 10 percent of the season. Since that time, he's right back where he's been the last few years --- a roughly 28 goal, 50+ point pace. So no, his value is not going to drop because he went goal-less the first 8 games of the season.

The asking price will be a first and a B-prospect. Teams know this. Everyone expects it. Maybe you have a slight bidding war and the prospect becomes a bit more enticing, or maybe it comes down to which pick the Rangers think will be higher (look at what happened with Winnipeg's last season). Or maybe someone gives the Rangers a younger player that they like more than a late first.

Kreider's value and market really isn't hard to determine or establish. It will be there.
 
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GoAwayPanarin

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It's also not one or the other.

Nylander, Jost, picks, north-south players, etc. don't have to exist in an either/or world.

It's not that it's Jost OR an established player. Likewise it's not Nylander OR a left defenseman.

I think there's many moving parts in what the Rangers are going to be doing and it's not as linear, or as much of a fork in the road as we might think.

Yeah if there is one thing JG has done since the letter, it's open up several avenues.

Established player? We have the assets for that (see Trouba)

Rental Players for sale? We've been doing that.

Packing picks in order to move up? We've had and will probably continue to have the volume to do that at least for one more draft.
 

wafflepadsave

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At the end of the day, the same reasons why there is the hesitation to move Kreider, and concerns about replacing him, is exactly why someone else wants him.

They don't have that depth piece or wing for their center. They want that depth or wing for their center.

Chris Kreider, without having a real hot streak yet this season, is pacing at 20 goals and 45 points. And that includes going without a goal for the first 10 percent of the season. Since that time, he's right back where he's been the last few years --- a roughly 28 goal, 50+ point pace. So no, his value is not going to drop because he went goal-less the first 8 games of the season.

The asking price will be a first and a B-prospect. Teams no this. Everyone expects it. Maybe you have a slight bidding war and the prospect becomes a bit more enticing, or maybe it comes down to which pick the Rangers think will be higher (look at what happened with Winnipeg's last season). Or maybe someone gives the Rangers a younger player that they like more than a late first.

Kreider's value and market really isn't hard to determine or establish. It will be there.
Sure would like to see the market come to fruition soon like dreger intimated.
 

Shesterkybomb

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Dec 30, 2016
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The only thing I can say in Kreider’s defense is that when he has steamrolled players, the referees called penalties to the point of keeping him passive.
On the other hand, he doesn’t seem to be able to adjust his speed or body position to make cleaner hits either. He could quite possibly learn to bend down a bit hit cleanly to please the refs.

I'd even be happy if he just used his speed to get in on the d and separate them from the puck, I'm not looking for him to decapitate anyone just use his speed and size to get the puck and force dmen into making quicker more panicked decisions.
 

romba

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Aug 2, 2005
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You heard it here first folks:

Ck + Rangers 3rd round pick 2021

For B- prospect + three 5th rounders that become firsts (2019,2020,2021) if trade partner wins the cup that year.

If CK resigns with the team then an extra 4th rounder gets thrown in. If CK resigns with Rangers 3rd round pick sent over becomes a 2nd.

Rangers of course resign CK in the offseason 7 mil/season.

Am I doing this right? Is that enough conditionals to satisfy Rangers brass?
 

Trxjw

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May 8, 2007
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I'm continually surprised by the resistance to adding players who haven't put it all together yet. Especially considering how many guys our roster is comprised of who didn't put it all together with their old team. Zibanejad, Strome, Lemieux, and ADA were in very similar situations to guys like Jost, Puljujarvi, and Bennett not that long ago. Of course its not a guarantee that those players take steps forward, there are plenty of examples where guys didn't, but the Rangers thus far have done a very good job of identifying those players.
 

Tawnos

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Sep 10, 2004
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I'm continually surprised by the resistance to adding players who haven't put it all together yet. Especially considering how many guys our roster is comprised of who didn't put it all together with their old team. Zibanejad, Strome, Lemieux, and ADA were in very similar situations to guys like Jost, Puljujarvi, and Bennett not that long ago. Of course its not a guarantee that those players take steps forward, there are plenty of examples where guys didn't, but the Rangers thus far have done a very good job of identifying those players.

Agreed on that point. Bennett can still take a step forward, but I'd hesitate to say he *is* a middle-6 guy. His production is pretty low. He's only hit 30 points once. Last year he paced it. This year, he has 5 points in 21 games.

That's the kind of thing we see out of Fast, who is a 3rd line option when we don't have enough top-9 depth, but he's best suited to the 4th.
 

Off Sides

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Sep 8, 2008
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I can get behind the Nylander idea, he would fit the team as a primary player, or at least he has the talent to do so.

Yet the other stuff, like adding more to the Howden, Hajek, Lindgren, Lias, etc grouping, I guess I don't see the value there given they already have a grouping of those players.

I'd rather have the picks and hope some other team ends up in a situation where they have to move someone they do not want to. At that point two 2nd round picks looks pretty good to them.

These deemed expendable prospects/players as add-ons at the deadlines by those who are renting, were deemed expendable for reasons beyond that they just had not put it all together yet. If the Rangers were renting, who would they make expendable, would it be Chytil or Lias for example.
 

Edge

Kris King's Ghost
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I'm continually surprised by the resistance to adding players who haven't put it all together yet. Especially considering how many guys our roster is comprised of who didn't put it all together with their old team. Zibanejad, Strome, Lemieux, and ADA were in very similar situations to guys like Jost, Puljujarvi, and Bennett not that long ago. Of course its not a guarantee that those players take steps forward, there are plenty of examples where guys didn't, but the Rangers thus far have done a very good job of identifying those players.

And ultimately, that's somewhat of the internal debate.

Do you take the dinette set or go for the mystery prize behind door number one.

But the whole putting it all together debate always gets dicey. Everyone has their players who they like and think can put it together, and an equally long, if not longer list of players they think won't.

So when you have guys like JP, Jost, Bennett, etc. there's going to be more variation in opinions.

I think picks are sexier to our fanbase, but I really don't think they are the preference of the organization this time around.

I do think if they get younger players, who haven't lived up to their potential, you're more likely to see some negative reactions around. Never mind the fact that the same outcome would be considered a success for a pick in the 24-31 range, it's a bit of a perception thing.

I think there's some hope in believing that there's a chance the pick could be a home run, even if it's relatively small, rather than more or less knowing that a player is more or less what they're going to be, with maybe a decent chance to be a little more, but not quite a home run.
 

Edge

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Yet the other stuff, like adding more to the Howden, Hajek, Lindgren, Lias, etc grouping, I guess I don't see the value there given they already have a grouping of those players.

I'm confused who we're adding to that group though.

I mean if we talk Jost and Bennett, they're ahead of Howden and Lias at this point. They're a known quantity, as oppossed to the latter two for whom we still don't know at this point.

On defense, I don't know if I see us adding more depth defenseman.
 

Irishguy42

Mr. Preachy
Sep 11, 2015
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Wait, that's all Hall got?!? Shero was probably worried he'll get injured and completely kill the value so he took the best he could get now. Man oh man, come TDL trade partners are going to try to use Hall to drive the price down on CK. Stay strong JG.
I mean, they got three prospects along with it, but none of them are good.
 
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