Robert Hagg Season Review

[Striiker]

Did you just refer to yourself in the 3rd person haha

Striiker always talks about Striiker in the 3rd person.

 

[GapToothedWonder]

Striiker always talks about Striiker in the 3rd person.

Striiker don't play!

Those toys are for babies not a 12 year old like Striiker!

 

[Ghosts Beer]

My only question is if this misrepresentation is because of ignorance or dishonesty.



Getting more and more like your BFF every day.

What parts of what I wrote do you consider “misrepresentations?” You certainly can’t say all of them are misrepresentations. And if I erred, I’d like to know where & why.

 

[Striiker]

What parts of what I wrote do you consider “misrepresentations?” You certainly can’t say all of them are misrepresentations. And if I erred, I’d like to know where & why.

Not going to go point-by-point and explain this to you. All it'd do is fill this thread up with stupid bullshit and waste my time.

You know exactly what you did. For someone who gets so worked up when people misrepresent arguments, you sure do like to do the same thing.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

Not going to go point-by-point and explain this to you. All it'd do is fill this thread up with stupid bull**** and waste my time.

You know exactly what you did. For someone who gets so worked up when people misrepresent arguments, you sure do like to do the same thing.

So you do give Hakstol credit for putting G on Cout’s wing & for it helping contribute to their double career seasons & making the playoffs?

You haven’t tried to rationalize the Weise signing because, in your mind, the majority of the board approved at the time?

You have applied that same logic to the Weal signing?

Could’ve fooled me.

 

[Striiker]

 

[Ghosts Beer]

No, the real misrepresentation is your accusing me of misrepresenting what you’ve said on these issues, & then avoiding answering how.

 

[bear3330]

Hagg may never be a big piece of the puzzle but what's wrong with him having a ceiling as a number 5 or 6 D?

With some of the hate he gets you'd think he was a Top 10 draft choice. At least he's not Luke Schenn.

Worst case - he holds down a bottom 2 spot until a younger gun beats him out. At which time he can be traded for a draft pick or packaged in to a bigger trade.

Best case - actually takes a big step the next year or so and becomes a legit top 4 dman

 

[Striiker]

By "holds down a bottom 2 spot" do you mean plays at a sub-NHL level and is overwhelmed, even on the bottom pair? Because if so, then that's still not a realistic worst case.

The real worst case is he's used as a top 4 D, as he was last year, and he still looks like an AHL defensemen.

Also, Luke Schenn was a superior defensemen, so that comparison fails too.

 

[bear3330]

By "holds down a bottom 2 spot" do you mean plays at a sub-NHL level and is overwhelmed, even on the bottom pair? Because if so, then that's still not a realistic worst case.

The real worst case is he's used as a top 4 D, as he was last year, and he still looks like an AHL defensemen.

Also, Luke Schenn was a superior defensemen, so that comparison fails too.

I agree that he's not top 4 quality right now and probably won't be but it's not his fault he's put in that spot. That should resolve itself once Sanhein, Myers, and Morin cement their places in the top 4-5 spots.

I think he is fine given the right role. If he ends up being our 7th D in 2 years then so be it.

Also, you really think Schenn has more talent ? He's at best a 5th D in a good team. Here's there rookie year stats :
Schenn- 70 gp...2 g, 12 a, minus 12, 206 hits
Hagg- 70gp...3 g, 6 a, plus 5, 238 hits

Based on these stats, who's to say Hagg doesn't have a comparable or even better career than Schenn?

 

[Captain Dave Poulin]

By "holds down a bottom 2 spot" do you mean plays at a sub-NHL level and is overwhelmed, even on the bottom pair? Because if so, then that's still not a realistic worst case.

I think that's called a "power bottom"

 

[Striiker]

I agree that he's not top 4 quality right now and probably won't be but it's not his fault he's put in that spot. That should resolve itself once Sanhein, Myers, and Morin cement their places in the top 4-5 spots.

I think he is fine given the right role. If he ends up being our 7th D in 2 years then so be it.

Also, you really think Schenn has more talent ? He's at best a 5th D in a good team. Here's there rookie year stats :
Schenn- 70 gp...2 g, 12 a, minus 12, 206 hits
Hagg- 70gp...3 g, 6 a, plus 5, 238 hits

Based on these stats, who's to say Hagg doesn't have a comparable or even better career than Schenn?

I don't blame him personally for how he was used, but it's still a problem that's unlikely to be solved. The player is still here and the coach is still here... a recipe for disaster.

And I don't really know which I'd say is more talented between Hagg and Schenn... both are pretty completely devoid of skill. I don't want either of them here, so Hagg ending up like Schenn (which would be an improvement) is still something I'd dread seeing. Honestly, if Hagg plays 100 more games for the Flyers, something has gone very very wrong.

He should be the #8 next year, but unfortunately he'll manage to find his way into the lineup, without the help of injuries, thanks to Hakstol's incompetence. Provorov, Ghost, Sanheim, Gudas, MacDonald, Myers, and Folin should all be ahead of him on the depth chart, but I'm sure a superior player will be underused... after all, Hagg almost led the league in hits last year. Gotta have that grit!

 

[Striiker]

I think that's called a "power bottom"

Made me think of this

 

[Magua]

Schenn- 70 gp...2 g, 12 a, minus 12, 206 hits
Hagg- 70gp...3 g, 6 a, plus 5, 238 hits

Schenn was also in his age 18-19 season; Hagg in his age 22-23 season. So, you have to compare hit totals by age using the statistic "RelativeExpectedAdjustedManStrength." So, really Schenn had 4007 hits his rookie season.

 

[bear3330]

Lol the grit is undeniable!

Either way, when this team is ready to seriously compete he'll probably be bumped out of the top 6 anyway.

 

[TB87]

Hagg may never be a big piece of the puzzle but what's wrong with him having a ceiling as a number 5 or 6 D?

With some of the hate he gets you'd think he was a Top 10 draft choice. At least he's not Luke Schenn.

Worst case - he holds down a bottom 2 spot until a younger gun beats him out. At which time he can be traded for a draft pick or packaged in to a bigger trade.

Best case - actually takes a big step the next year or so and becomes a legit top 4 dman

He has a lot to work on to be a more competent NHL defenseman:
- Clean exits
- Clean entries
- defending the blueline from oncoming rushers
- taking some chances in the OZ

If he doesn’t improve in those areas over the next two seasons...I’m fine with him being part of a package in a big trade. For a physical player, he plays a very passive game.

 

[GapToothedWonder]

Lol the grit is undeniable!

Either way, when this team is ready to seriously compete he'll probably be bumped out of the top 6 anyway.

I hope so. He isn't the style of player I want on the Flyers when we are competing for cups. Having a defensive minded 3rd pair that is mobile and can be a catalyst to transitioning out of our some smoothly is very important in mind. I don't think Hagg will be able to produce that style of play.

 

[FatTugboatFlahr]

I wonder how good or bad Robert actually is, it’s almost impossible to get a read on a rookie who gets played way beyond his capabilities.

I think I’m going to give him a clean slate to start the year and hope he gets comfortable playing reliable defense for 13MPG.

I really would appreciate if he didn’t suck.

 

[MacDonald4MVP]

Hagg is officially new Manning.

 

[deadhead]

I don't really worry about Hagg, he's a depth player, like Folin with more upside.
The real question is how Sanheim plays this year, and when Myers cracks the lineup.
It's easy to play for Hakstol, play hard, play smart, and limit the mind farts. Just ask Provorov.

These issues are resolved on the ice, Gudas was pretty bad as a rookie, about as bad as Hagg:

Gudas 13-14: 0.68 pp/60, 0.36 P1/60, Corsi 49.06, CorsiRel -3.43, GF 52.22, xGF 48.1, xGFrel -4.37
Hagg 17-18: 0.49 pp/60, 0.38 P1/60, Corsi 46.01, CorsiRel -5.73, GF 52.27, xGF 48.15, xGFrel -3.21

So it makes sense for Ron to invest in a two year, low cost contract to see if Hagg can improve.

 

[TB87]

Hagg is officially new Manning.

That’ll be Christian Folin...

 

[Captain Dave Poulin]

I wonder how good or bad Robert actually is, it’s almost impossible to get a read on a rookie who gets played way beyond his capabilities.

I think I’m going to give him a clean slate to start the year and hope he gets comfortable playing reliable defense for 13MPG.

I really would appreciate if he didn’t suck.

That sounds like a good plan, Fart, and is pretty much where I am, too. I don't want to hate the poor bastard. Fire Hakstok.

 

[Striiker]

I wonder how good or bad Robert actually is, it’s almost impossible to get a read on a rookie who gets played way beyond his capabilities.

I think I’m going to give him a clean slate to start the year and hope he gets comfortable playing reliable defense for 13MPG.

I really would appreciate if he didn’t suck.

Nothing wrong with that mentality, of course, but the reason I'd bet against that is the player we saw last year is the same player I watched for years in the AHL.

He wasn't hopeless with the puck and insanely passive because of his usage. That's just Hagg in both leagues.

 

[TB87]

That sounds like a good plan, Fart.

Only on the Internet will you see sentences like the one above. I love it!

 

[Captain Dave Poulin]

Only on the Internet will you see sentences like the one above. I love it!

@JojoTheWhale tells me that I routinely write sentences that no one ever has and no one ever should have uttered before.