Rielly vs Ranger (Who should be scratched)?

[Confucius]

Don't really get why some of our fanbase has unrealistic expectations of certain players and their role. Again, the obvious weak link on our defense is not Mark Fraser--who's been injured for weeks and had to deal with the Bruins his first game back. He cannot be blamed for the entire team being hemmed in their own zone...hopefully our fanbase will start to understand the game, and certain players in our line up and what their roles are.

The obvious weak link is Paul Ranger who is simply not an NHL calibre d-man. Will he ever be? I don't think so, maybe some of you want to overrate him but I would say he's weaker than Kostka, Finger, Exelby--and Fingerby had Toskalol in nets, meaning, they would be doing a better job with a Reimer than whatever Ranger is doing right now.

We are going backwards by employing him. The best example of how to sum him up in a nutshell is the second goal boston scored. His hockey IQ had him check a bruin ontop of Reims, hold the bruin player and reims down allowing boston to shoot at an empty net.

I don't know what else could be said other than Ranger either needs to be sent to the Marlies or perhaps the KHL might be a better fit for him. This player makes players around him worse, and is responsible for some of the most disappointing goals scored against us. Plain and simple he needs to go.

Rielly and Liles should be full time with the big club and Ranger should be sent down. I believe our D just needs one really solid, physical dman and everything would even itself out back there.

Maybe there is a team looking for a puck moving dman and willing to exchange a solid, physical reliable dman like a boychuck.

Gee I saw a Bruin on Ranger, sandwich Ranger between the Bruin and Riemer. That's how I remember it anyway but I'll look at it again.

 

[bunjay]

Gee I saw a Bruin on Ranger, sandwich Ranger between the Bruin and Riemer. That's how I remember it anyway but I'll look at it again.

Eriksson did in fact hold him down. But the goal could have still been prevented if any of the THREE players on the other side of the net within range had thought to cover Bergeron.

 

[Durrr]

Rielly is a rookie.... needs to prove something before given something, although he is playing better than some vets he needs to earn it.

How is playing better then bets not earning time? lol...

 

[crazyaces**]

reilly!

 

[phillipmike]

People complaining about Ranger have no clue what they're talking about. As rogie said, Ranger wasn't on the ice for a goal since the Columbus game yet people never **** about him being some sort of liability on the ice. The guy has saved the Leafs countless times. Like breaking up 2 on 1s, break aways and saving one timers but people never bring it up because they just want something to complain about. Like last night

The puck hasn't touched Bergeron's stick yet, how on earth do you say this is Ranger's fault?

Because he is sitting on our goalie. If he was standing up he probably could have cleared the puck.

Ranger is an NHL player but he is a 7th defensemen. Rielly and Fraser can give us more effective minutes as our 3rd pairing and i am confident that Ranger can fill in when needed. But the question is; does her deserve to start over Phaneuf, Gunnarsson, Gardiner, Franson. Rielly or Fraser? I believe the correct answer is no like most Leaf fans but clearly Carlyle disgarees. I dont think Ranger is horrible just that when healthy we have 6 possibly 7 with Liles better defensemen.

 

[Kyle Doobas*]

Rielly shouldn't be scratched for anyone. He makes his rookie mistakes, but on the whole he's more effective than at least three or four of the guys in the lineup right now have been.

 

[PuckMagi]

I think that Rielly, Ranger and Fraser should all rotate. Two of them play, one sits.

That way, each player will only play about 2/3rds of a full season.

Rielly and Ranger are not used to playing a full NHL season (plus pre-season and post-season). Fraser is just coming back from an injury.

If we play Rielly and Ranger every game, we might burn them out by playoff time. This straetgy will keep everyone rested and hopefully make the transition into the NHL for Rielly and Ranger a little easier.

 

[TieClark]

Next game? Gardiner.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

With Carlyle you never know who might be scratched.

All I know is Dion will be in. As for the rest, I wouldn't be surprised if any one of the other 6 are scratched.

 

[bunjay]

Because he is sitting on our goalie. If he was standing up he probably could have cleared the puck.

Ranger is an NHL player but he is a 7th defensemen. Rielly and Fraser can give us more effective minutes as our 3rd pairing and i am confident that Ranger can fill in when needed. But the question is; does her deserve to start over Phaneuf, Gunnarsson, Gardiner, Franson. Rielly or Fraser? I believe the correct answer is no like most Leaf fans but clearly Carlyle disgarees. I dont think Ranger is horrible just that when healthy we have 6 possibly 7 with Liles better defensemen.

What that picture actually shows is Ranger being held down on top of Reimer by Eriksson, while neither Raymond nor Fraser covering the guy in scoring position in front of a gaping empty net.

It's popular to **** on Ranger but he's not at fault there, and after some rough games to start his first NHL season in three years he's actually been good in his limited role. Franson has been a whole lot worse at everything but racking up undeserved assists.

 

[Diatomic]

Next game? Gardiner.

I'd hate to see Gards scratched, and I don't think it'll happen anytime soon but last game in Boston he gave up like 3 odd man rushes, it was brutal to watch. He did however have many scoring chances and had 7 shots on the night!

 

[MoeMoney]

Aforementioned stats disagree with you as well as coach Carlyle apparently. Perhaps he's not as bad as everyone makes him out to be, but rather just the current whipping boy.

Ask Reimer how he feels about Ranger on top of him.

 

[MoeMoney]

What that picture actually shows is Ranger being held down on top of Reimer by Eriksson, while neither Raymond nor Fraser covering the guy in scoring position in front of a gaping empty net.

It's popular to **** on Ranger but he's not at fault there, and after some rough games to start his first NHL season in three years he's actually been good in his limited role. Franson has been a whole lot worse at everything but racking up undeserved assists.

You're delusional, making petty excuses for Ranger, blasting Franson, "undeserved assists"? Franson is as solid as it gets back there.

 

[trellaine201]

I'd rather both sit and get Liles in there

Gunnar Phaneuf
Gardiner Franson
Fraser Liles

Agreed! Time to get Liles in and sit the other two for a few games. Cant be any worse.

 

[zeke]

yeah, I guess you never get a second chance to make a first impression, because Ranger's been quite good since the 5gm mark or so.

he's a far, far better dman than Fraser. it's not remotely close.

 

[34]

I think Ranger should be out before Reilly. Yes, Reilly is young but has a huge upside.

 

[Jer416]

Because he is sitting on our goalie. If he was standing up he probably could have cleared the puck.

Ranger is an NHL player but he is a 7th defensemen. Rielly and Fraser can give us more effective minutes as our 3rd pairing and i am confident that Ranger can fill in when needed. But the question is; does her deserve to start over Phaneuf, Gunnarsson, Gardiner, Franson. Rielly or Fraser? I believe the correct answer is no like most Leaf fans but clearly Carlyle disgarees. I dont think Ranger is horrible just that when healthy we have 6 possibly 7 with Liles better defensemen.

He was sitting on our goalie, but he was being pinned down, and also, why was Reimer down in the first place on that play...

Ranger doesn't get credit for the times he saves goals (breaking plays up) but gets bashed whenever a goal is scored when he's on the ice...feel bad for the guy.

 

[Jer416]

You're delusional, making petty excuses for Ranger, blasting Franson, "undeserved assists"? Franson is as solid as it gets back there.

You're delusional, Franson has been under-performing throughout the whole season so far... I'm not saying he's bad, but his performance isn't where it should be right now, he's capable of doing better.

 

[Cap'n Flavour]

You're delusional, making petty excuses for Ranger, blasting Franson, "undeserved assists"? Franson is as solid as it gets back there.

Franson is also slow and has been making some poor plays on D. However he also scores and moves the puck well, unlike Ranger, who certainly doesn't score and is at best mediocre at getting the puck out of the zone.

Ranger is okay as a 6-7 guy. He's probably better than Fraser at this point. But Rielly shouldn't be sitting just to keep veteran 6-7 guys happy.

 

[Celly Hard]

I'm tired of the whole "we need to play ranger or else he won't get better" argument. If you aren't playing well enough you should sit! Rielly is way better than ranger and has a much higher ceiling. We shouldn't be negatively affecting the kids progression over Paul ****ing ranger.

 

[TheTotalPackage]

I'd definitely have Rielly in over Ranger. But I'd want Ranger in over Fraser, who I can't buy into his worth at all.

 

[rimshot]

Without question Ranger. Easily been our worst defender this season.

I disagree!! He maybe our worst defender this year, but it wasn't easy. Not easy at all. He has had different challengers every night. Some nights Gunnerson looks like the worst and other nights it is Franson or Gardiner. It hasn't been an easy competition at all.

 

[phillipmike]

What that picture actually shows is Ranger being held down on top of Reimer by Eriksson, while neither Raymond nor Fraser covering the guy in scoring position in front of a gaping empty net.

It's popular to **** on Ranger but he's not at fault there, and after some rough games to start his first NHL season in three years he's actually been good in his limited role. Franson has been a whole lot worse at everything but racking up undeserved assists.

http://video.mapleleafs.nhl.com/videocenter/console?catid=802&id=481103&lang=en&navid=DL|TOR|home

Look at the 4:10 mark.

Look at the video as opposed to a screenshot. I see Ranger skating into Reimer stumbling on him and fell as a result of being off balanced. Erkisson was about to stumble too and braced himself on Ranger. If Eriksson was "pinning" Reimer as clear as you claim then i am sure the refs would have called goalie interference. But the ref saw what everyone else - that Ranger ran into his own goalie. I would admit that he had good intentions to block Eriksson out but he made a blunder and fell; normally i would say so be it but this time he feel on our goalie preventing him from making the 2nd save leading to a goal. Ranger was still sitting on Reimer for a few seconds after the goal was scored when Eriksson was no where around. Fraser blocked the first shot and was trying to stop the pass across but failed. I agree Raymond missed his guy but Ranger was sitting on Reimer; if he wasnt then Reimer has a better shot of making a save and probably saving a goal.

I am not ******** on Ranger because it is the fun thing to do. In fact you hear it a lot from other fans hence why you defend him which must mean that not a lot of people see it your way. And as you can see from the poll it is quite obvious that you are the minority.

Others maybe ******** on Ranger and saying he sucks but like the rational Leaf fans like myself we see that the Leafs have 6 maybe even 7 defensemen who are better. Nothing wrong with that; i still think Ranger is an NHL calibre defender but the majority of us think that we have 6 better guys than him when healthy that is all. And guess what we are healthy and i prefer to see Rielly and Fraser play over Ranger. I think Ranger and Fraser offer similar games it just so has it i think Fraser is better than Ranger as a tough, stay at home D man as he is a bit quicker and can make the smart play. And Rielly is the puck mover with speed; Rielly and Fraser should compliment each other.

And i will agree with you that Franson is having a bad season defensively. But overall i think Franson is much better than Ranger. Ranger plays a sheltered role against less talented players hence why it looks like he is better than Franson defensively. I like Franson's overall game more because he can contribute offensively and still provide us with some defence.

 

[rimshot]

I'm tired of the whole "we need to play ranger or else he won't get better" argument. If you aren't playing well enough you should sit! Rielly is way better than ranger and has a much higher ceiling. We shouldn't be negatively affecting the kids progression over Paul ****ing ranger.

Playing Rielly over Ranger on back-back on the road would be pure genius. Where else but Boston would it be easier to find out if he can survive hits from behind into the boards or a stick to the face or an elbow to the nose. Carlyle just doesn't appreciate the big picture like the peanut gallery does.

 

[Jer416]

http://video.mapleleafs.nhl.com/videocenter/console?catid=802&id=481103&lang=en&navid=DL|TOR|home

Look at the 4:10 mark.

Look at the video as opposed to a screenshot. I see Ranger skating into Reimer stumbling on him and fell as a result of being off balanced. Erkisson was about to stumble too and braced himself on Ranger. If Eriksson was "pinning" Reimer as clear as you claim then i am sure the refs would have called goalie interference. But the ref saw what everyone else - that Ranger ran into his own goalie. I would admit that he had good intentions to block Eriksson out but he made a blunder and fell; normally i would say so be it but this time he feel on our goalie preventing him from making the 2nd save leading to a goal. Ranger was still sitting on Reimer for a few seconds after the goal was scored when Eriksson was no where around. Fraser blocked the first shot and was trying to stop the pass across but failed. I agree Raymond missed his guy but Ranger was sitting on Reimer; if he wasnt then Reimer has a better shot of making a save and probably saving a goal.

I am not ******** on Ranger because it is the fun thing to do. In fact you hear it a lot from other fans hence why you defend him which must mean that not a lot of people see it your way. And as you can see from the poll it is quite obvious that you are the minority.

Others maybe ******** on Ranger and saying he sucks but like the rational Leaf fans like myself we see that the Leafs have 6 maybe even 7 defensemen who are better. Nothing wrong with that; i still think Ranger is an NHL calibre defender but the majority of us think that we have 6 better guys than him when healthy that is all. And guess what we are healthy and i prefer to see Rielly and Fraser play over Ranger. I think Ranger and Fraser offer similar games it just so has it i think Fraser is better than Ranger as a tough, stay at home D man as he is a bit quicker and can make the smart play. And Rielly is the puck mover with speed; Rielly and Fraser should compliment each other.

And i will agree with you that Franson is having a bad season defensively. But overall i think Franson is much better than Ranger. Ranger plays a sheltered role against less talented players hence why it looks like he is better than Franson defensively. I like Franson's overall game more because he can contribute offensively and still provide us with some defence.

You cannot put blame on Ranger for a mistake by Reimer. Reimer was out of position, which caused Ranger to fall on him. If Reimer hadn't overplayed the play, he would have had a better chance to make the save, while Ranger would have been playing his man. Also, Ranger and Fraser don't seem to offer similar games. Ranger plays a more offensive game and is the better skater whereas Fraser is the stay at home Dman.

Franson didn't take a 3 year hiatus from the NHL, nor is he the current scapegoat.