Report: Kolnik would break ranks

[Bicycle Repairman]

Bob Goodenow is most certainly a shining example of a courageous and visionary leader. He stood up to Alan Eagleson who ran that union (and a large part of the hockey industry itself) like a personal piggybank.

Goodenow, when he took office, instituted a policy whereby all NHLPA Agents were required to be certified to prevent the abuses of the past. Often the Agent/Player relationship was one of pimp/prostitute before. His other initiatives also included growing union revenues via joint partnership with the league in regard to product licensing, something Gary Bettman was eager to endorse himself.

Players, the League, and the game itself owe him a debt of gratitude.

Funny, but everyone's darling of the moment, Brian Burke, was and is a close associate of Goodenow. In many ways, Goodenow made Burke.

 

[Bicycle Repairman]

Hopeless.

Nope. I just don't buy in to the pervasive collective Working Class Envy/resentment that overwhelmingly permeates this forum.

 

[struckmatch]

Bob Goodenow is most certainly a shining example of a courageous and visionary leader. He stood up to Alan Eagleson who ran that union (and a large part of the hockey industry itself) like a personal piggybank.

Goodenow, when he took office, instituted a policy whereby all NHLPA Agents were required to be certified to prevent the abuses of the past. Often the Agent/Player relationship was one of pimp/prostitute before. His other initiatives also included growing union revenues via joint partnership with the league in regard to product licensing, something Gary Bettman was eager to endorse himself.

Players, the League, and the game itself owe him a debt of gratitude.

Funny, but everyone's darling of the moment, Brian Burke, was and is a close associate of Goodenow. In many ways, Goodenow made Burke.

That statement, along with your other drivel in this thread are laughable.

 

[Cawz]

Goodenow, when he took office, instituted a policy whereby all NHLPA Agents were required to be certified to prevent the abuses of the past.

Then he proceeded to become a cancer of the NHL, ruining it slowly from the inside. Its one thing to balance the scales, its another to tip it the other way so far that we have no hockey again in order to protect millionaires from making millions.

 

[Cawz]

That statement, along with your other drivel in this thread are laughable.

It is funny though. Deep down, I think he's doing it more for the attention.

 

[Bicycle Repairman]

That statement, along with your other drivel in this thread are laughable.

Why? Were they not Burke and Goodenow partners in a Player Agency at one time?

 

[Vlad The Impaler]

Nope. I just don't buy in to the pervasive collective Working Class Envy/resentment that overwhelmingly permeates this forum.

You should know, you're a big part of that. You and your made up stories of wine cellars, man-servants, and all that sophisticated crap you like to dream about.

For what it's worth, everybody can well envy the players but the issues goes well beyond that for anyone that is smart enough. As you well know, the owners are filthy rich.

If my motives were money envy, I'd side with the players. Who wouldn't?

Many owners are pretty much the real opposite of working class people. Players have much more in common with the fans in this respect (although at an increasingly diminishing rate). So your theory there doesn't hold water.

But nice try.

 

[Bicycle Repairman]

Well, I must say I'm disappointed in you Vladdy.

Here I was expecting some good, vigourous debate on some salient points. I thought you were open minded.

Some of my slings and arrows must indeed hit bullseye I can only speculate.

But if you wish, we shall return this thread to the ramblings of 15 year old illiterates.

 

[The Mighty Duck Man]

I'll agree with BR on one thing, that Bob Goodenow has done his job and he's done it well. It's not his job to lower salaries and bring in the fans, it's his job to get the player's those raises, and he's done that masterfully. Gary Bettman, OTOH, has not done a great job. He approved the system that was used in 1994, and even though it was a decent system, the owner's found some way to make it fail. Bettman has said it himself, they need something so secure that the owner's have no way around it. That doesn't sound like the owner's have alot of confidence in their abilities. It is not Goodenow's job to get this in order, it's Bettman's, and like Goodenow said, they would play if they could. Unfortunately, that wouldn't work under the old system, so Goodenow needs to start trying to solve this work stoppage.

In my opinion, Goodenow should just take the salary cap. These owner's need something foolproof, and a simple salary cap is not foolproof. The owner's will find ways around it, if it were put in effect, that is, and Goodenow has to realize that.

 

[Cawz]

Here I was expecting some good, vigourous debate on some salient points. I thought you were open minded.

Some of my slings and arrows must indeed hit bullseye I can only speculate.

When you lead off discussions with hyperbole and rhetoric, you cant expect vigourus debate.

When you say Goodenow is a courageous leader and the players, the league, and the game itself owe him a debt of gratitude, youre not going to be taken seriously. He's good at what he does. Unfortuinatly, it benefits the players at the expense of the league.

 

[Bicycle Repairman]

When you lead off discussions with hyperbole and rhetoric, you cant expect vigourus debate.

When you say Goodenow is a courageous leader and the players, the league, and the game itself owe him a debt of gratitude, youre not going to be taken seriously. He's good at what he does. Unfortuinatly, it benefits the players at the expense of the league.

I beg to differ. Goodenow in many ways saved the game from itself. What was happening before his tenure? You had a league fighting off a legitimate rival followed by a period in which the game was slowly stagnating, ruled by an old boys club and suffering a severe lack of talent (as indicated by the preposturous goal totals of the time). Goodenow's reform of the Player Agent system helped paved the orderly flow of an influx of new European talent, which in turn led to an explosion of interest in the game throughout the United States. True, he wasn't the only catalyst, but he was an important contributer.

By building up a strong NHLPA, he forced the League itself to become more honest, both with the union and with the public itself. You see this today in such programs as the Pension Plan and various assistance programs (which I may add, were subsequently adopted in the NHL's feeder leagues), and in other areas such as merchandizing.

Bob Goodenow is a man who deserves respect throughout the hockey world. The fact that even his adversaries recognize that as well is testament to the man.

 

[SopelFan*]

Bob, is that you?

 

[I am Jack's Fish]

To get back o the topic on hand...

Kolnik claims he was misquoted or didnt understand the question due to language barriers.

I interviewed the guy two years, his english was fine. I don't know about his Canadian, but his English was fine.

If I am the NHL, I seize this opportunity to publish the league's belief that the minimum salary for a player should be raised a few hundred thousand immediately.

 

[Steve L*]

Can you argue that Bob Goodenow hasn't done a superlative job on behalf of his clients?

You should be so lucky but to have such a champion in your corner.

Yes, hes done such a great job that none of his clients are getting paid.

 

[HughJass*]

New day, new crap. Everyone, just refrain from replying to any of Bicycle Repairman's ridiculous comments. Evidently he strive to be the center of attention with his ridiculously smug comments.

 

[Vlad The Impaler]

Well, I must say I'm disappointed in you Vladdy.

Here I was expecting some good, vigourous debate on some salient points. I thought you were open minded.

I am. But not enough to consider seriously discussing far-fetched positions about Tupac Shakur coming back from the grave or a courageous Bob Goodenow.

Some of my slings and arrows must indeed hit bullseye I can only speculate.

But if you wish, we shall return this thread to the ramblings of 15 year old illiterates.

If there was any chance you might convince many people with those lies, I'd probably make an effort. But there's not even a chance of that happening. So why should I lose my time?

I don't believe you're being serious here. So I'm not going to bite and discuss something seriously. What am I supposed to respond to things like that?

Goodenow in many ways saved the game from itself. What was happening before his tenure? You had a league fighting off a legitimate rival followed by a period in which the game was slowly stagnating, ruled by an old boys club and suffering a severe lack of talent (as indicated by the preposturous goal totals of the time). Goodenow's reform of the Player Agent system helped paved the orderly flow of an influx of new European talent, which in turn led to an explosion of interest in the game throughout the United States.

I mean, next thing you know someone will ask me to demonstrate that the earth is not flat.

There's no point.

 

[pei fan]

"I am sorry. It appears those capitalistic pigs we call reporters are just twisting my words. What I really said was I would support my union even if the owners declared an impasse. What I really said was a 6 million dollar per player cap is totally unreasonable. And what I really said was that I hear daily from my union rep. I can't believe you reporters would take so much out of context."

*to appear in a newspaper close to you soon*

:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol

 

[kenabnrmal]

New day, new crap. Everyone, just refrain from replying to any of Bicycle Repairman's ridiculous comments. Evidently he strive to be the center of attention with his ridiculously smug comments.

Refrain from replying to his comments because they offer a different opinion/pov than the majority of the forum? Thats ridiculous. His opinion may not be favorable or agreeable to you, but he presents his side intelligently and with an aim of healthy debate, which is more than can be said for many of the "majority" opinion holders.

I agree with him on one point. That, while there are many on these boards who represent the "intelligence" of the pro-league side of the debates, unfortunately when you get past these individuals, many of the pro-league opinions appear to be based upon envy. No, people don't resent owners more than players because they are richer. That is because whole the owners got rich from business, the players got rich from "playing a kids game" (as many of the less intelligent pro-league siders love to point out, ignoring the market/economic factors that lead to their level of pay, not to mention the amount of work the players put into getting where they are). Its something many on the pro-league side simply can't seem to get past.

Personally, I'm not siding with either the league or the players, however I lean towards the league ever-so-slightly. However, the stance of much of the "majority", beyond the upper class of debaters who actually formed an intelligent pro-league argument, makes me a bit sick. We're lucky that we have a decent number of intelligent posters on these boards to drive these debates with smart dialogue. BR is one of these individuals, and to attempt to shut him up simply because his views differ greatly from the majority is pretty sad, and damaging to the boards as a whole.

 

[espo*]

I beg to differ. Goodenow in many ways saved the game from itself. What was happening before his tenure? You had a league fighting off a legitimate rival followed by a period in which the game was slowly stagnating, ruled by an old boys club and suffering a severe lack of talent (as indicated by the preposturous goal totals of the time). Goodenow's reform of the Player Agent system helped paved the orderly flow of an influx of new European talent, which in turn led to an explosion of interest in the game throughout the United States. True, he wasn't the only catalyst, but he was an important contributer.

By building up a strong NHLPA, he forced the League itself to become more honest, both with the union and with the public itself. You see this today in such programs as the Pension Plan and various assistance programs (which I may add, were subsequently adopted in the NHL's feeder leagues), and in other areas such as merchandizing.

Bob Goodenow is a man who deserves respect throughout the hockey world. The fact that even his adversaries recognize that as well is testament to the man.

Not sure if the influx of Europeans did anything at all to renew U.S interest in the game.It has to do with how they marketed the game that accounts for that imo.If anything,the game isn't as exciting as it used to be but most fans in the U.S(the new ones) would'nt recognize that.

 

[Cawz]

I beg to differ. Goodenow in many ways saved the game from itself. What was happening before his tenure? You had a league fighting off a legitimate rival followed by a period in which the game was slowly stagnating, ruled by an old boys club and suffering a severe lack of talent (as indicated by the preposturous goal totals of the time). Goodenow's reform of the Player Agent system helped paved the orderly flow of an influx of new European talent, which in turn led to an explosion of interest in the game throughout the United States. True, he wasn't the only catalyst, but he was an important contributer.

By building up a strong NHLPA, he forced the League itself to become more honest, both with the union and with the public itself. You see this today in such programs as the Pension Plan and various assistance programs (which I may add, were subsequently adopted in the NHL's feeder leagues), and in other areas such as merchandizing.

Bob Goodenow is a man who deserves respect throughout the hockey world. The fact that even his adversaries recognize that as well is testament to the man.

Sorry man. No dice. If this was 1990, maybe your arguments would hold water. Right now, he’s pretty much the major reason for the downfall of the league. Please notice that all the "great" things you mentioned he did, happened before he helped engineer 2 work stopages and exploading salaries beyond revenues.

 

[chara]

Kolnik is a little behind the ears and 'accidently' slipped out what a lot of guys are thinking. Time for the players to give Goodenow an ultimatum: Get to the table or get a new job.

 

[shveik]

If my motives were money envy, I'd side with the players. Who wouldn't?

Many owners are pretty much the real opposite of working class people. Players have much more in common with the fans in this respect (although at an increasingly diminishing rate). So your theory there doesn't hold water.

But nice try.

Actually I agree with BR on this. From the tone and the wording of many angry posts get nothing but the envy. This type of envy, towards the people that used to be one of the working class, but who have achieved something through the talent and lots of hard work, is not so "logical". But it is unfortunately one of the not-so-pretty sides of human nature.

 

[Vlad The Impaler]

Actually I agree with BR on this. From the tone and the wording of many angry posts get nothing but the envy. This type of envy, towards the people that used to be one of the working class, but who have achieved something through the talent and lots of hard work, is not so "logical". But it is unfortunately one of the not-so-pretty sides of human nature.

And you think they don't envy the owners?

I have a hard time believing it.

The reality is that, most people have enough common sense to realize at this point that the owners need to win. I'll agree that articulating it by simply pointing out to the salaries and calling them overpaid is oversimplistic.

But I do not think it is the true motive of the people siding with the owners.

The people who truly resent the money factor, IMO, are the couple of clowns who launch internet petitions and call for a boycott of all parties and vow to never again buy some pathetic playstation NHL game, or something equally sad.

 

[littleHossa]

And you think they don't envy the owners?

I have a hard time believing it.

The reality is that, most people have enough common sense to realize at this point that the owners need to win. I'll agree that articulating it by simply pointing out to the salaries and calling them overpaid is oversimplistic.

But I do not think it is the true motive of the people siding with the owners.

The people who truly resent the money factor, IMO, are the couple of clowns who launch internet petitions and call for a boycott of all parties and vow to never again buy some pathetic playstation NHL game, or something equally sad.

What would be the true reason most people are siding with the owners? The envy goes both ways like you said.

 

[kenabnrmal]

Actually I agree with BR on this. From the tone and the wording of many angry posts get nothing but the envy. This type of envy, towards the people that used to be one of the working class, but who have achieved something through the talent and lots of hard work, is not so "logical". But it is unfortunately one of the not-so-pretty sides of human nature.

Said far better than I could.