Reevaluating the “terrible” 2012 draft class

Discussion in 'National Hockey League Talk' started by NoName, Sep 3, 2019.

  1. NoName

    NoName Bringer of Playoffs!

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    I remember seeing a lot of down comments over the years about this draft class, with some people citing it as one of the weakest draft classes in history. However once you get past the abysmal 1st overall pick (Remember “Fail for Nail”?). it actually is a pretty talented draft class: Morgan Rielly (5th) put up over 70 points this year and looks like a Norris contender in the next few years, Hampus Lindholm (6th OA) is an elite 2-way defender, Matt Dumba (7th) is already all-star caliber and is set to take over as Minnesota's 1D after Suter slows down, Jacob Trouba (9th) has developed into a top-2 Defender at this point. Filip Forsberg (11th) is a legitimate star you can build a contending forward corps around. Tomas Hertl (17th) scored at nearly a point-per-game pace last season. Last but certainly not least, Andrei Vasilevskiy (19th)is the reigning Vezina winning goalie. On top of all those guys there are lots of solid picks later in the draft that have played valuable roles in the NHL like Olli Maata (22nd) and Brady Skjei (28th). Even Galchenyuk (3rd) who has not met his lofty expectations is still a legit top 6 forward who has scored 30 goals before, and Ryan Murray (2nd) hasn’t been “bad” so much as hobbled by injuries (as we saw this past season).

    Overall, this “historically weak” draft class looks pretty stacked with talent, especially on the blue-line.
     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2019
  2. Viqsi

    Viqsi where we're going we don't need draft picks

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    Forsberg's a winger, not a center. But otherwise yeah.

    "Solid picks later in the draft" outside of the first round include guys like Chris Tierney, Damon Severson, Shayne Gostisbehere, Erik Gustafsson, Josh Anderson, Andreas Athanasiou, Jaccob Slavin, Connor Hellebuyck, and possibly a few others that deserve mention that I just overlooked.

    (And if Murray could only get over his injuries he'd be a solid, reliable #1 as promised... alas, so far he can't be considered "reliable". :( )
     
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  3. Voight

    Voight #winning

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    People called Brian Burke crazy for saying Rielly was #1 on his draft list and he would have picked him first overall.

    Pretty legitimate argument now that he's the best player from that draft class.
     
  4. WhiskeyYourTheDevils

    WhiskeyYourTheDevils yer leadin me astray Sponsor

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    It's a still a pretty weak draft. There are some nice defenseman but it lacks any try superstar forwards (FF, TT, and Hertl are all top line players but not all that close to franchise players).

    Also, Filip Forsberg is a winger.
     
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  5. DRW204

    DRW204 Registered User

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    i feel like the D and G talent of this draft turned out to be quite good. Fwds on the other hand :help:

    Goalies:
    F. Andersen
    C. Hellebuyck
    M. Murray
    A. Vasilevskiy

    is there another draft that has a comparable group of goalies? 2005 is better but idk other than that (05 had Price, quick, rask, bishop)

    as you mentioned on D

    Rielly, Trouba, Lindholm, Dumba, Slavin, Severson, Parayko, Gostisbehere, Murray, Lindell, Skjei, Maatta. Matheson, Pelech, C. Miller, Gustafsson.....Ceci (fwiw :))
     
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  6. BruinsBtn

    BruinsBtn Registered User

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    It's still terrible.
     
  7. Filthy Dangles

    Filthy Dangles Playing puck on a pond somewhere

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    You find gems later on in every draft. People remember it as bad because the top-4 picks, players who should have provided the most value, flopped

    Yakupov - somehow stuck around for 350 games, total dud. One of the biggest flops in recent history

    R.Murray - a solid but not spectacular D who can't stay on the rink, usurped by players like Werenski and Jones and possibly others in the 'Bus

    Galchenyuk - 1 noteworthy season, very disappointing player otherwise, a meh complimentary scoring winger

    G.Reinhart - don't need to say much.
     
  8. Viqsi

    Viqsi where we're going we don't need draft picks

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    The "possibly others" is inaccurate. Savard and Nutivaara are both good guys, but Murray's a top-pairing guy when healthy. (Of course, "when healthy" is a huge caveat with him. :( )
     
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  9. tarheelhockey

    tarheelhockey Highest Boss

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    When a draft is stacked with defensemen talent, it's hard to see that early in the process. It's going to be several years before the defensemen hit their stride, and anything could happen in the meantime -- injuries, development snags, players lost in a numbers game, etc. You really just don't know what you have with the defensemen group until about 5 years out from the draft. Easy to understand why people would look at that draft as a whole, and see weak forwards with a bunch of defensive wildcards, and conclude that it's a weak group.
     
  10. TakinMaattaOnMyRide

    TakinMaattaOnMyRide Praspek pools !!1

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    Historically weak = 1995 and 1999

    2012 is alright-meh. Like 2014. 2013 depth sucks too.
     
  11. Trap Jesus

    Trap Jesus Registered User

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    I think it was one of those things where you couldn't really make any argument for Rielly over Yakupov or Murray (as a D-man comparable) at the time but it just ended up working out that way. Burke did say that he removed Yakupov from his draft list entirely after a really poor interview where Yakupov seemed completely disinterested to be interviewed by someone picking at 5, although how much merit there is to that, I'm not sure.
     
  12. HanSolo

    HanSolo Vegas Strong

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    I felt like the only one around here who didn't see anything special about Reinhart. I think his physical tools around age 17-18 fooled a lot of people into thinking he'd become good but to me I saw a guy with a passive approach to everything, offense and defense. I just couldn't imagine he'd be as bad as he was. I felt like he was a very risky pick at 4 but I thought he'd at least cut it as a bottom pairing defenseman.

    Then I watched him with Vegas and learned that even bottom pairs need some degree of talent. Griffin has none. At least none that works in the NHL.
     
  13. NoName

    NoName Bringer of Playoffs!

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    If anything it’s depth is what makes it so solid. I only mentioned the guys in the first round but take a look what gens were found in later rounds:

     
  14. tony d

    tony d HFBoards Sponsor Sponsor

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    It had some good goalies and defensemen but IMO it's the worst draft of the decade.
     
  15. thestonedkoala

    thestonedkoala Everyone! PANIC!

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    Pretty homerish comment there. He might not even be the best defensemen, much less the best player from the draft.

    Defenseman A: 342 GP, 56 goals, 94 assists for 150 points or .44 points per game. Goals per game? .16
    Defenseman B: 470 GP, 51 goals, 192 points for 243 points or .52 points per game. Goals per game? .11

    Defenseman A: 8.6 shot percentage
    Defenseman B: 5.2 shot percentage

    Defenseman A: + 34 career, 184 pims, 426 hits and 336 block shots
    Defenseman B: -46 career, 103 PIMs, 407 hits and 635 block shots

    Defenseman A had only 8 goals less than Defenseman B, while playing 50 games less.
     
  16. Voight

    Voight #winning

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    Lest we forget Chia thought he was worth a 1st + 2nd even as he was on the verge of bust territory. :laugh: :facepalm:

    As for Trouba, I wouldn't say he's a top pairing defenseman. Last year was a good start but he hasn't shown enough to be considered one yet IMO.
     
  17. Brockon

    Brockon Cautiously optimistic realist when caffeinated.

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    Either you got you GP numbers wrong, or the math needs some review... Especially if you aren't going to name the Dmen (presumably one is Rielly) those stats need to be right.
     
  18. Brockon

    Brockon Cautiously optimistic realist when caffeinated.

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    Jordan Schmaltz hasn't really played much in the NHL, 42 GP - 7 years after his draft... Saying he's played a role in the NHL is a stretch, saying it was a valuable role is an outright lie.

    Part of that is that he was competing for minutes behind Parayko and Pietrangelo on the right side in St Louis, and it was believed playing top AHL minutes would be better for his development. But, he's not shown enough to be considered an NHL regular or he would have forced Gunnarson/Bortuzzo to the pressbox and been the 3 RD.
     
  19. jetsforever

    jetsforever Registered User

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    Great year for D and G but pretty weak on forwards
    All drafts have some good players though
     
  20. 57special

    57special HFBoards Sponsor Sponsor

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    Dumba had 32 gp last year with great offensive production, and had an upward trend in earlier years after a rocky start, but calling him a #1 is WAY premature. How about he puts in a solid 3/4 years of actual production plus some decent defense before we crown him?
     
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  21. Fig

    Fig Why so serious? Let's put a smile on that face!

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    Although I want Jankowski to succeed. It does bug the hell out of me that there aren't as many nails in the coffin of the, "Best player of the draft in 10 years comments." It further bugs me that even if he isn't the best, he still has a chance to be within the top 10 forwards of that draft. Again, I want Janko to succeed, but I also really want Weisbrod to be revealed as a blowhard...

    It's up there with the 2013 collection jokes. 7 of 30 first rounders once were Flames property... that's just bonkers.
     
  22. blankall

    blankall Registered User

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    Still pretty Meh IMO.

    Yes some great d-men in there, but no truly top tier talented d-men. Combine that with an atrocious forward pool, and it a pretty Meh draft.

    If Rielly hadn't had a good year, we probably wouldn't be discussing this.
     
  23. Viqsi

    Viqsi where we're going we don't need draft picks

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    That math needs some review. The other stats are accurate.

    Defenseman A is Matt Dumba. Defenseman B is, indeed, Morgan Rielly. I checked mostly because I was half-expecting A to be Gostisbehere (it is, after all, a largely offense-based comparison of defensemen), but it turns out he hasn't played that many games.
     
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  24. tfriede2

    tfriede2 Registered User

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    No.
     
  25. Sir Savage the 21st

    Sir Savage the 21st Oy Mate, you having a giggle?

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    If the guys highlighted in the OP are the best players from a draft, it was a weak draft, especially in comparison to how stacked most drafts have been the last decade. 12 and 17 stick out like sore thumbs
     

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