Red Wings Sell Out Their Brand (New Presenting Sponsor)

[Fugu]

People whining that the Wing's did this need to get a grip with themselves. Wah, who really cares about this? Will their be a crest of it on their jersey? No. So who really cares? They can make some extra money and we, as fans, can pray they KEEP costs of everything at the Joe the same for once. For all this organization has done to our lives, quit the *****in.

Ah, since Ilitch has managed to build a great organization over the past 30 yrs --- and never had a presenting sponsor before --- now that Wilson has brought this blight on hockeytown, we're just supposed to be happy about it? Yeah, right, Z40.

The ONLY reason this name isn't going to be on the Jerseys is because NHL rules don't allow it. If it were up to Wilson, I'm sure the Wings jerseys would be completely plastered by now.

You also ignore the point that a heck of a lot of people are not comfortable with the choice of sponsor. Maybe you don't care, but this is a business that is all about public perception. This helps Amway. This drags down the Wings brand--- in my opinion.

Keep costs down? Hahahaha

Exactly. Lower bowel seats are pricing out at $125-135 (quick check I just did). A couple years ago, these were $76, and held at that level from 2002-2008 or 09. Welcome to Wilson's World.

 

[5lidyzer19]

As an aspiring CPA, I integrity comes above all. The Detroit Red Wings partnering with a company like Amway is a disgrace.

 

[GBFP]

I don't care about the sponsorship really, I care about the sponsor chosen. A garbage brand pyramid scheme trying to get the rub by associating itself with the Red Wings positive brand value. And the Wings allowed it for a mere six figure deal.

 

[5lidyzer19]

I don't understand why this upsets people so much

Say you have a sister. You hold her in high regard and want the best for her. She could pick anyone to be her husband, but she picks a low life scum. He has a horrible reputation, manners, and no integrity, and now he's brought into the family. Are you upset, or do you wish she would have went in a different direction? The Red Wings deserve better and could have easily gotten it. Sure we recognize they will marry someone (go after ad revenue), but they could at leats partner with someone who shares the same....standards.

 

[Dolemite]

If people had looked a bit further into this, they would have found that this isn't Amway's first deal with pro sports:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amway#Commercial_sponsorships

http://www.amwaycenter.com/

Say you have a sister. You hold her in high regard and want the best for her. She could pick anyone to be her husband, but she picks a low life scum. He has a horrible reputation, manners, and no integrity, and now he's brought into the family. Are you upset, or do you wish she would have went in a different direction? The Red Wings deserve better and could have easily gotten it. Sure we recognize they will marry someone (go after ad revenue), but they could at leats partner with someone who shares the same....standards.

Devil's Advocate rebuttal - This is 100% hearsay. Gotta back that statement up with facts or else that argument is not valid. Having an opinion about this is one thing and that's fine. Making statements like this without any facts to back it up is just silly.

 

[Hero]

So it's more an issue with the sponsor than the sponsoring itself? That's perfectly understandable.

Well, even with how they're being sponsored. The Red Wings have tied their name to theirs. It seems like a start down a slippery slope for the NHL.

 

[DaveG]

You also ignore the point that a heck of a lot of people are not comfortable with the choice of sponsor. Maybe you don't care, but this is a business that is all about public perception. This helps Amway. This drags down the Wings brand--- in my opinion.

Bingo. It may not matter to the diehard fan, but to the casual fan it means a good bit as to who the team is partnered with. And Amway is about as bad as you can get for this, it's one of the few brands that actually has negative value of association. Put a Bell's Brewery (to use another Michigan company) logo next to the Red Wings logo, and nobody gives a damn aside from a few people in the MADD crowd.

Not that Bell's is a huge company, just using that since it's the first Michigan company that popped into my head, can we tell I could use a cold one... or five.

Back on topic, as it stands Amway benefits from having itself associated with a brand that has huge positive brand recognition not just in the US and Canada, but even worldwide. That has a reputation over the past two decades as being the best in its field. But what do the Red Wings get out of this? From a business perspective is having yourself tied in with a company with the reputation of Amway even close to the sub-million value that they're paying the Red Wings? It's a decision that just doesn't make sense to me.

 

[Shwag33]

I just went to the website to see what they offered. I'm actually amazed they make money. There isn't anything there that you couldn't buy on Amazon.com, for example, at least judging from my quick look. It would seem that it's a model that would have worked in the pre-Internet age. I either go to a specific store where I know I can find X, or I use Google.

It's because it has nothing to do with the products. It's about scamming people into thinking they can 'have their own business'.

When really they are just creating amway sheep that buy their overpriced products. I've had friends say that i'm starting my own business, then its amway.... i just want to punch them in the head.

 

[Dolemite]

Quick question for Wings fans....

Did you know Amway was a sponsor last season?

http://redwings.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=587621&navid=DL|DET|home

The new agreement is built upon last season’s initial partnership, which was highlighted by the Amway logo featured on the Wings’ official practice jerseys and pucks.

“Last year, we kind of put our toes in the water here by having some minor involvement; very positive,†said Steve Lieberman, vice president and senior director for Amway North America. “The Red Wings are an iconic franchise. We believe that we’re an iconic business. So that was really the beginning tie that bound us together.

 

[Hasbro]

UGH!

Could no one get it through Illitch's Mike Brady hair that this was is a bad idea.

Maybe you can adopt St Ide's as the official Malt Liquor or hire Tom Wu as the team's presenter.

 

[Eaglepride*]

Hate it, hate it and oh did I mention how much I hate that crap?

This to me has some sort of "selling out a traditional brand" which is not acceptable, period.

I know you NA guys hate comparision with european hockeystyle but be careful what you wish for, this is just the beginning. We had the same thing in the SEL and now look at some of our "cool" jerseys..

Do you really want jerseycrap like that?

hell even our ice is full with sponsor crap.

Mark my words if you guys accept stuff like that, its only the beginning and will get worse.

 

[Hasbro]

Do you really want jerseycrap like that?

You know, I've been hearing about jersey ads for like 20 years and it still hasn't happened. And we are talking about a group who won't turn down an extra nickle. So I'm thinking the jersey manufactures have impressed upon the American leagues what a bad idea that would be and don't want any compitition for their swooshes and Addidas pot leaf.

 

[Fugu]

If people had looked a bit further into this, they would have found that this isn't Amway's first deal with pro sports:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amway#Commercial_sponsorships

http://www.amwaycenter.com/

Yes, and are you aware about the ownership of the NBA's Orlando Magic?

Also, Tom Wilson was president at Palace Sports (former Pistons owner). The connection is very clear.

Quick question for Wings fans....

Did you know Amway was a sponsor last season?

http://redwings.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=587621&navid=DL|DET|home

Yup, and many people weren't too happy about that, but that's a far cry from a "presenting sponsor" that gets its logo next to the Winged Wheel no matter where the Wings put it. In fact, everywhere the Winged Wheel is used promotionally, you'll now get Amway next to it. If that doesn't cheapen the team and logo, I don't know what does.

 

[Fugu]

You know, I've been hearing about jersey ads for like 20 years and it still hasn't happened. And we are talking about a group who won't turn down an extra nickle. So I'm thinking the jersey manufactures have impressed upon the American leagues what a bad idea that would be and don't want any compitition for their swooshes and Addidas pot leaf.

I think it's simply a matter of time. Here's a blurb from an industry consultant:

Bill Chipps, senior editor at Chicago-based IEG, a company that consults on sponsorship deals, said he expects any backlash over the deal to be short-lived, even though Amway can be controversial.
“I think the public has grown to accept and acknowledge the role of sponsorship,†Chipps said. “Most people recognize that sponsorship dollars are vital to a team’s existence if not a team’s on-field performance.â€
...
Presenting sponsorships are common and even more overt in European and other international leagues. The National Basketball League's Detroit Pistons in June renewed a presenting sponsorship with PNC Bank. The practice also has been used in the National Football League and Major League Baseball, though the extent of the relationships vary from deal to deal.
Chipps expects the practice to spread.
“I think most sports organizations definitely want the right to sell presenting status or sell sponsorships to jerseys,†Chipps said. “There are holdouts. But the trend is definitely gaining steam. At the same time, it still has to be done right.â€

http://www.mlive.com/business/west-michigan/index.ssf/2011/09/amway_describes_tangible_intan.html


I think what's holding it back is the league, not necessarily the owners and their minions.

I would also speculate that it would need to be done at a league level, imo. If you allowed individual teams to do it, you'd have the disparity in income/popularity become glaringly obvious. The Leafs would have every square nanometer covered, while newer teams might struggle to attract a 'sufficient' number of sponsors. Or do you just allow one? I think that's what is meant by it being done slowly and the 'right' way.

 

[Jesus Vitale]

I would be fine with something like this if it meant keeping my team. like if it was a choice between:

The Pittsburgh Penguins presented by Herbalife

and

the Kansas City Penguins

i'd take the presented by any day.

but unless i'm missing something, the Red Wings presented by Amway aren't that strapped for cash? so this may qualify as selling out.

 

[Dolemite]

Yes, and are you aware about the ownership of the NBA's Orlando Magic?

Yes, but I don't see Amway sponsorship on the Magic's webpage or logos.

Also, Tom Wilson was president at Palace Sports (former Pistons owner). The connection is very clear.

Yeah, he's going to teach the Red Wings how to make the team as profitable as the Pistons.

Yup, and many people weren't too happy about that, but that's a far cry from a "presenting sponsor" that gets its logo next to the Winged Wheel no matter where the Wings put it. In fact, everywhere the Winged Wheel is used promotionally, you'll now get Amway next to it. If that doesn't cheapen the team and logo, I don't know what does.

I can appreciate how Wings fans feel about this but something like this was inevitable in the NHL.

 

[PeterSidorkiewicz]

Ah, since Ilitch has managed to build a great organization over the past 30 yrs --- and never had a presenting sponsor before --- now that Wilson has brought this blight on hockeytown, we're just supposed to be happy about it? Yeah, right, Z40.

The ONLY reason this name isn't going to be on the Jerseys is because NHL rules don't allow it. If it were up to Wilson, I'm sure the Wings jerseys would be completely plastered by now.

You also ignore the point that a heck of a lot of people are not comfortable with the choice of sponsor. Maybe you don't care, but this is a business that is all about public perception. This helps Amway. This drags down the Wings brand--- in my opinion.




Exactly. Lower bowel seats are pricing out at $125-135 (quick check I just did). A couple years ago, these were $76, and held at that level from 2002-2008 or 09. Welcome to Wilson's World.

I bought tickets for the Sens-Wings opener and I thought I was going to pay a lot less than I did, as I remember Wings tickets being much cheaper. I wanted upper level, but more up close to the action, rows 1-10 or so. Ended up being $80 a ticket for upper level row 10 after ticketmaster fees and taxes. I don't ever remember Wings tickets costing that much for upper level, I was kinda shocked.

 

[Killion]

Amway isnt a business, its a cult. The poster citing precedences' of Amways munificence in sponsoring buildings, leagues & teams' is missing the point. You cant buy integrity & you cant dress up your lack of honor in a teams colors. There is actually very little difference between a Pyramid and a Ponzi Scheme. Both are predatory, one we know is completely illegal, the other existing in a gray world of borderline legality & appallingly immoral indifference to the 10's of 1000's who buy into its'brainwashing philosophies & practices. When they fail, as roughly 98% of those who sign up ultimately will, their pitched an endless stream of often pricey workshops and conferences, rah rah rah, sent home to fail yet again in varying degree's on an elevator that just keeps descending despite their best efforts. When it crashes at the bottom of the shaft, the Amway boys & girls at the top simply look down at the carnage, telling the disciples they missed floors 46, 39, 6 & 2 and will have to sign up again for the workshops & conferences at those levels. Its their fault they missed them first, second, third, ninth, twenty second or whatever time up. They just keep pushing their buttons until all the nickles run out.

 

[5lidyzer19]

Amway isnt a business, its a cult. The poster citing precedences' of Amways munificence in sponsoring buildings, leagues & teams' is missing the point. You cant buy integrity & you cant dress up your lack of honor in a teams colors. There is actually very little difference between a Pyramid and a Ponzi Scheme. Both are predatory, one we know is completely illegal, the other existing in a gray world of borderline legality & appallingly immoral indifference to the 10's of 1000's who buy into its'brainwashing philosophies & practices. When they fail, as roughly 98% of those who sign up ultimately will, their pitched an endless stream of often pricey workshops and conferences, rah rah rah, sent home to fail yet again in varying degree's on an elevator that just keeps descending despite their best efforts. When it crashes at the bottom of the shaft, the Amway boys & girls at the top simply look down at the carnage, telling the disciples they missed floors 46, 39, 6 & 2 and will have to sign up again for the workshops & conferences at those levels. Its their fault they missed them first, second, third, ninth, twenty second or whatever time up. They just keep pushing their buttons until all the nickles run out.

I couldn't agree more.

 

[Fugu]

Yes, but I don't see Amway sponsorship on the Magic's webpage or logos.



Yeah, he's going to teach the Red Wings how to make the team as profitable as the Pistons.

The Wings are more profitable than the Pistons if you count what the locals control. The difference in income is solely from the NBA's league-wide share, not their gate receipts or local TV money (which should be similar from Fox Sports given the Wings' higher ratings over the past decade, excepting the lockout year and the immediate boon from the Piston's championship). Wings gate has done better than the Pistons for the past few years.

 

[Dolemite]

Wings gate has done better than the Pistons for the past few years.

Seeing how broken the NBA is at the moment, I would be shocked if the Pistons made more money than the Red Wings.

 

[Xelebes]

Amway isnt a business, its a cult. The poster citing precedences' of Amways munificence in sponsoring buildings, leagues & teams' is missing the point. You cant buy integrity & you cant dress up your lack of honor in a teams colors. There is actually very little difference between a Pyramid and a Ponzi Scheme. Both are predatory, one we know is completely illegal, the other existing in a gray world of borderline legality & appallingly immoral indifference to the 10's of 1000's who buy into its'brainwashing philosophies & practices. When they fail, as roughly 98% of those who sign up ultimately will, their pitched an endless stream of often pricey workshops and conferences, rah rah rah, sent home to fail yet again in varying degree's on an elevator that just keeps descending despite their best efforts. When it crashes at the bottom of the shaft, the Amway boys & girls at the top simply look down at the carnage, telling the disciples they missed floors 46, 39, 6 & 2 and will have to sign up again for the workshops & conferences at those levels. Its their fault they missed them first, second, third, ninth, twenty second or whatever time up. They just keep pushing their buttons until all the nickles run out.

I can agree with this assertion. They have similar roots to Synanon and are very key in financing upstart therapeutic boarding schools like Hyde Schools (known for using Synanon techniques.)

 

[Killion]

They have similar roots to Synanon and are very key in financing upstart therapeutic boarding schools like Hyde Schools (known for using Synanon techniques.)

Wow. That particular brand of Behavioural Modification is just plain scary.

 

[Brodie]

Well, every time you see the Wings logo now in any medium, you will see the other company's name under it. It cheapens it. I don't like the association.

You may not care, and that's fine. Your opinion is yours and you're free to state it. I think it sucks.

In what way does it "cheapen it"? Do board ads "cheapen" your game experience? Do corporate arena names "cheapen" the arena experience? It's a logo that will appear around the arena and on tickets. It means absolutely nothing except to the moralist crowd and the usual "WAAAAH CORPORATIONS WAAAAH" folks.

My favorite soccer team is currently the only one in the EPL without a shirt sponsor and you know what? I'd trade the clean kit look for the money in a heartbeat. Sports is a business, pretending otherwise in 2011 is just silliness.

 

[Xelebes]

Wow. That particular brand of Behavioural Modification is just plain scary.

There are a one or two institutions that use it in Canada. The most well known one is Alberta Adolescent Recovery Centre.