Red Wings best young player voting - #1

Red Wings best young player ?

  • W - Jonatan Berggren

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • LD - Dennis Cholowski

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • W - Taro Hirose

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • RD - Filip Hronek

    Votes: 32 31.4%
  • LD - Jared McIsaac

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • C - Michael Rasmussen

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • RD - Moritz Seider

    Votes: 43 42.2%
  • C/LW - Joe Veleno

    Votes: 1 1.0%
  • RW - Filip Zadina

    Votes: 26 25.5%

  • Total voters
    102
  • Poll closed .

Henkka

Registered User
Jan 31, 2004
31,077
12,078
Tampere, Finland
So, who's the most POTENTIAL young player ?

Limit for this voting is waiver eligibility.

Taro Hirose, Michael Rasmussen, Filip Zadina, Filip Hronek and Dennis Cholowski have played +25 NHL games, which in many places is the determing factor for NHL prospect.

+25 NHL games is when you lose your NHL rookie status. But we have many of these guys in AHL system, so I'll mix this 5-man group to that prospect voting.

I'll also include that Top4 from the prospect voting, in this voting.
 

HisNoodliness

The Karate Kid and ASP Kai
Jun 29, 2014
3,652
2,022
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Hronek probably deserves it most for his performance in the NHL. The Seider hype is unreal right now so I imagine he'll win.

Personally I'm still hoping for superstar 40 goal scorer Filip Zadina so he got my vote
 
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GettingYourMoms

Registered User
Jun 6, 2018
2,049
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When it comes to potential Zadina Is easily highest on the list. Seider would have to show some elite offensive ability to have him above Zadimples.
 

Frk It

Mo Seider Less Problems
Jul 27, 2010
36,201
14,683
Hronek is currently the best young player on this list, and it's not close. He is at .52 PPG for his young career (almost 100 games, so decent sample size now). Kronwall didn't become a .5 PPG player until he was 27. I don't believe we have seen a defenseman put up .5 PPG for this team under 23 years old since... Lidstrom?

Zadina and Seider have great upside. I give a little edge to Zadina there, because I think he could be more of a game-breaker. But Hronek is the best currently and still has room to get better, he's only 22. I've always said I see him as a Justin Faulk type, but if he can keep getting better defensively then there's no reason he can't be another Letang/Subban. I mean his offensive game is basically already there.
 

Hen Kolland

Registered User
Feb 22, 2018
9,470
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Hronek is currently the best young player on this list, and it's not close. He is at .52 PPG for his young career (almost 100 games, so decent sample size now). Kronwall didn't become a .5 PPG player until he was 27. I don't believe we have seen a defenseman put up .5 PPG for this team under 23 years old since... Lidstrom?

Zadina and Seider have great upside. I give a little edge to Zadina there, because I think he could be more of a game-breaker. But Hronek is the best currently and still has room to get better, he's only 22. I've always said I see him as a Justin Faulk type, but if he can keep getting better defensively then there's no reason he can't be another Letang/Subban. I mean his offensive game is basically already there.

While Hronek is the best young player currently, I think it is only fair to touch on the fact that Zadina has consumed a TON of ground on Hronek this year. It was an absolute landslide in favor of Hronek at the beginning of the year, but in conservative 2nd line minutes, Zadina has played about a quarter of the season showing the elite flashes that had him in the discussion of a top 3 draft eligible prospect and is maintaining a rate that translates to a rounded 20 goals and 43 points (in an 82 game season). He started the season as a 19 year old. Hronek grew a lot through the year last year and even more coming into this season, and my expectation is a lot of the same in Zadina.

With the influx of talent, in the coming years with a top 4 pick this year, Rasmussen, Veleno, Seider, McIsaac, Cholowski, trades, free agency, I think it's more likely that Hronek's usage regresses away from the ~24 minutes he is playing out of necessity, reducing his opportunity and on the other hand, Zadina's will grow. The added talent definitely helps both of them, but I definitely lean towards Zadina in terms of this ranking. Trying to balance present results and projection out a few years.
 

Frk It

Mo Seider Less Problems
Jul 27, 2010
36,201
14,683
While Hronek is the best young player currently, I think it is only fair to touch on the fact that Zadina has consumed a TON of ground on Hronek this year. It was an absolute landslide in favor of Hronek at the beginning of the year, but in conservative 2nd line minutes, Zadina has played about a quarter of the season showing the elite flashes that had him in the discussion of a top 3 draft eligible prospect and is maintaining a rate that translates to a rounded 20 goals and 43 points (in an 82 game season). He started the season as a 19 year old. Hronek grew a lot through the year last year and even more coming into this season, and my expectation is a lot of the same in Zadina.

With the influx of talent, in the coming years with a top 4 pick this year, Rasmussen, Veleno, Seider, McIsaac, Cholowski, trades, free agency, I think it's more likely that Hronek's usage regresses away from the ~24 minutes he is playing out of necessity, reducing his opportunity and on the other hand, Zadina's will grow. The added talent definitely helps both of them, but I definitely lean towards Zadina in terms of this ranking. Trying to balance present results and projection out a few years.

A ton of ground? Hronek is just about a top 30 producer at his position already. Not the potential to be one... like he is that.

Why would his usage regress? Seider might become a big minute muncher, but who do you think is more likely to run the top PP? That's where most defenseman put up points. This kid is doing something on this team that hasn't been done in like 30 years and we are trying to poke holes in it? Why? What if his defensive game keeps getting better? This kid has shown a ton since being drafted and has just continued to get better.

If you asked me how would I want to trade least of everyone on this list, for me it would be Hronek.
 
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The Zetterberg Era

Ball Hockey Sucks
Nov 8, 2011
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I think Seider pushes past Hronek quickly on the right side because of his defensive acumen and we see something similar to the Blues in the Petro and Shattenkirk era of that team. Seider should allow more leverage for Hronek once he reaches his 20s and gets more experience. But I do think he plays top pairing and Hronek is behind him so that is my answer.
 

Hen Kolland

Registered User
Feb 22, 2018
9,470
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A ton of ground? Hronek is just about a top 30 producer at his position already. Not the potential to be one... like he is that.

Why would his usage regress? Seider might become a big minute muncher, but who do you think is more likely to run the top PP? That's where most defenseman put up points. This kid is doing something on this team that hasn't been done in like 30 years and we are trying to poke holes in it? Why? What if his defensive game keeps getting better? This kid has shown a ton since being drafted and has just continued to get better.

If you asked me how would I want to trade least of everyone on this list, for me it would be Hronek.

We aren't poking holes in anything. Quite frankly his defense is a negative, to put it bluntly. He's a net positive, because he puts up points, but he is still not a good defensive player. If he continues to develop, his value will certainly continue to grow. Right now you have a powerplay specialist who would be best served being sheltered defensively.

I think you are right to view him as the best young player right now, but I think your self-admission of Hronek being your favorite player is hurting your argument in this case.
 

Frk It

Mo Seider Less Problems
Jul 27, 2010
36,201
14,683
We aren't poking holes in anything. Quite frankly his defense is a negative, to put it bluntly. He's a net positive, because he puts up points, but he is still not a good defensive player. If he continues to develop, his value will certainly continue to grow. Right now you have a powerplay specialist who would be best served being sheltered defensively.

I think you are right to view him as the best young player right now, but I think your self-admission of Hronek being your favorite player is hurting your argument in this case.

Fair, but I think we have this propensity to overvalue potential on here and overlook what people are doing in the here and now.
 
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MBH

Players Play
Jul 20, 2019
13,497
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Tough to say.
I don't think any of these guys rank even as well as Larkin as potential "franchise" guys.

Hronek's GA/60 is still at 3.5 at FIVE ON FIVE. For all the flack Bowey takes, Hronek's defensive zone work is often just as bad and he seems to get a free pass on things that Bowey gets roasted for.

I have hope he's going to improve. But I don't think his skating is that great. And his size is below average for a defenseman.

I love his tenacity, but I think the physical limitations will always limit his effectiveness in the Dzone.

I think Seider probably passes Hronek on the Red Wings depth chart. He doesn't have Hronek's offensive IQ or playmaking ability. I really don't see him as a PP guy and he doesn't need to be one as long as we have Hronek anyway. But he's going to be the PK, matchup, last minute, hold-the-lead guy.

Zadina looks like a top six winger. How good? Not star level, IMO.

Rasmussen and Veleno are the wildcards here.
I don't believe Ras has a future at center - but maybe I'm wrong. I could see him being a major netfront force and playoff performer who owns board battles - but he's got to increase his intensity.
He works. But he doesn't fight. I want to see him fight (not drop the gloves).

Veleno's having a tough year, but I still think he can be a top 6 C. And top 6 Cs have value. Things have come too easy for Joe for too many years. This year is going to teach him a thing or two about commitment to improvement. I want to see him improve his 1st/2nd stride and, like Rasmussen, increase his intensity.
 
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GettingYourMoms

Registered User
Jun 6, 2018
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We aren't poking holes in anything. Quite frankly his defense is a negative, to put it bluntly. He's a net positive, because he puts up points, but he is still not a good defensive player. If he continues to develop, his value will certainly continue to grow. Right now you have a powerplay specialist who would be best served being sheltered defensively.

I think you are right to view him as the best young player right now, but I think your self-admission of Hronek being your favorite player is hurting your argument in this case.
Dude stick to baseball your argument are seriously flawed. Hronek is significantly better offensively and at least same lvl defensively. Seider is still playing in AHL and his offensive game is lacking. Hronek is great offensive defenseman stuck on horrible NHL team, and he should not be in this poll anyway.
 
Last edited:
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Hen Kolland

Registered User
Feb 22, 2018
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Fair, but I think we have this propensity to overvalue potential on here and overlook what people are doing in the here and now.

That's fair. So where do you want to go from here? Their production rates are actually quite similar. One is a 20 year old forward with about a third of a season under his belt and the other is a 22 year old defenseman with just a little over one full season under his belt. Neither of them are really plus players in their own end at this point.
 

Hen Kolland

Registered User
Feb 22, 2018
9,470
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Dude stick to baseball your argument are seriously flawed. Hronek is significantly better offensively and at least same lvl defensively. Seider is still playing in AHL and his offensive game is lacking. Hronek is great offensive defenseman stuck on horrible NHL team, and he should not be in this poll anyway.

What the f*** are you going on about? Considering your post history, I'm not even sure if you know what you are arguing about.

And...

I can't decide between Seider and Zadina, Veleno is dissapointing.

Your first post about your decision didn't even include Hronek as being one of your two options.
 

Frk It

Mo Seider Less Problems
Jul 27, 2010
36,201
14,683
That's fair. So where do you want to go from here? Their production rates are actually quite similar. One is a 20 year old forward with about a third of a season under his belt and the other is a 22 year old defenseman with just a little over one full season under his belt. Neither of them are really plus players in their own end at this point.

Want to see a bigger sample size from Zadina, personally. Obviously I love the skill set and upside, but I have questions still. Particularly about what he can do at even strength.

I personally would have this as 1) Hronek 2) Zadina 3) Seider and then a pretty sizeable dropoff.
 

Hen Kolland

Registered User
Feb 22, 2018
9,470
8,336
Want to see a bigger sample size from Zadina, personally. Obviously I love the skill set and upside, but I have questions still. Particularly about what he can do at even strength.

I personally would have this as 1) Hronek 2) Zadina 3) Seider and then a pretty sizeable dropoff.

I have no problem with giving Hronek the nod as the best player today. My ultimate point was that the gap between Hronek and anyone on this list in October was massive. Now I don’t think it’s quite as staggering. I think Zadina has closed the gap quite a bit.
 
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GettingYourMoms

Registered User
Jun 6, 2018
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What the **** are you going on about? Considering your post history, I'm not even sure if you know what you are arguing about.

And...



Your first post about your decision didn't even include Hronek as being one of your two options.
Read my previous comment. I said, that Hronek should not be even in voting option, he is elite offensive defenseman playing for horrible NHL team.
 

SirloinUB

Registered User
Aug 20, 2010
4,643
2,121
Canada
We’re really struggling to lock down which players should be included in our propspects/young players list eh?

to me it should be about where they are in the organization. Hronek has been up full time This season and has 95 Career games played. I’m not sure we should include him on this list
 
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GettingYourMoms

Registered User
Jun 6, 2018
2,049
1,819
We’re really struggling to lock down which players should be included in our propspects/young players list eh?

to me it should be about where they are in the organization. Hronek has been up full time This season and has 95 Career games played. I’m not sure we should include him on this list
Finally someone with common sense, after Hen Kolland and Zadina hater MBH
 

Hen Kolland

Registered User
Feb 22, 2018
9,470
8,336
Read my previous comment. I said, that Hronek should not be even in voting option, he is elite offensive defenseman playing for horrible NHL team.

You realize I didn’t set the ground rules right? Maybe aim your disgruntled whining somewhere else
 

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