Realignment II: Well, why not, we've got another year to kill

[kdb209]

Roman Numerals

Continued from: NHL maps out major changes (Realignment to 4 divisions?)

I have to admit, with 4 divisions, the idea of eliminating conferences, really appeals to me. Or at the very least, maintain the conferences for the purposes of regular season scheduling, but have a no conference playoff system. Division winners with the top four seeds, and the next best 12 teams from around the league. I think it'd be INCREDIBLE for east coast teams to play west coast teams in the opening rounds of the playoffs. Think about it, there's only an hour difference between teams in the Eastern time zone and the Central time zone...so it's not going to be a huge difference if east and west coast teams meet in the opening rounds, seeing as how it already happens between teams in the Pacific and Central time zones. What's one hour? Besides, I think any two teams in the league should have the opportunity to face one another in the final. The fact that say, the Rangers could never ever face Boston in the Stanley Cup final...or Chicago and Detroit...Edmonton and Calgary....is just garbage.

If they go with 4 divisions with a home & home against teams outside the division, conferences become pretty much irrelevant for scheduling.

7 team division: 6 games vs each team in division (6*6=36) and a home & home against everyone else (2*23=46) - for a total of 82 games.

8 team divisions: 5 or 6 games vs each team in division (4*5 + 3*6 = 38) and a home & home against everyone else (2*22=44) - for a total of 82 games.

Click to read more...

 

[Retail1LO*]

Awesome. Then let's dispense with conferences so we can draw up a 16 team bracket tournament for the playoffs!

Or let 12 teams in, and let 8 teams have play-ins for the final four spots. But again, I think it'd be awesome having a playoff structure where any two teams could meet at any time.

 

[MoreOrr]

- Re-alignment
- Number of Divisions and Division size with 30 teams
- Scheduling
- Playoffs format (how are the Playoffs spots determined, how are the matchups determined, and for how many Rounds)
- Which team moves East (if you even want East and West)
- How many Divisions, How many Conferences
- Minimum number of games against Division opponents, Conference opponents (should be an even number)
- Minimum number of games against other Conference opponents

What do you want?

 

[Jumptheshark]

I like the nuking of the conferences and making it 30 team division with the top 16 making the playoffs

 

[Up the Irons]

i would prefer the top 4 from each div make the playoffs. just like years ago, there is a divisional championship, a conference championship, then the finals.

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

THE ONLY thing we know of is WPG plays this year in the SE, THE QUESTION IS who of the current Western teams replaces them, and does Dallas leave the Pacific to fill that slot?

 

[Fugu]

Roman Numerals

Continued from: NHL maps out major changes (Realignment to 4 divisions?)

Noooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!



LS will win and achieve her dream "one thread" BOHB-- all in Roman Numerals.

 

[LadyStanley]

Noooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!



LS will win and achieve her dream "one thread" BOHB-- all in Roman Numerals.

At which point Fugu will end up in the mods-dont-live-here house.

 

[Skarjak]

I want to propose the following so we do not get another handful of small minded western market fans/DET fan trying to ruin the NHL:


1) PIT and PHI must be together (if not, then PIT must be with WAS, under no circumstance is PIT separated from both rivals).
2) PHI must be with all NY teams
3) All NY teams must be together
4) CHI and STL must be together

5) If possible, NY and BOS are together
Uh yes, it is a deal breaker when it idoitocally seperates PIT-PHI, PHI-NY, NY-BOS.


Why?
-You want to be the only sport with no NY to PHI or BOS rivalry, just so Winnipeg is slotted to be moderately less isolated than they deserve given their location?
Fine, it's that thinking which is why the NHL is and always will be 4th.


I have an idea, from now on NO STUPID PROPOSALS.

The following rules are in place for proposed realignments:

-IF YOU CAN NOT DO THIS, DO NOT EVEN BOTHER TO SUBMIT A PROPOSAL BECAUSE IT WOULD DO FAR MORE HARM THAN GOOD.

-Christ, keep it simple, Nashville to SE, Nashville to SE, Nashville to SE and DET QUIT WHINNING!
-Moving you east would upset far more rivalries (including your's with CHI), so shut up already!

MTL-BOS is a far bigger rivalry than NY-BOS. I don't think it would be right to separate them.

 

[Noldo]

MTL-BOS is a far bigger rivalry than NY-BOS. I don't think it would be right to separate them.

The fact is that if East is constructed out of teams on ETC (as would be quite logical due current distribution of teams),
even though current Atlantic is perfect for PHI (NY area teams + PIT), there isn't really three teams that could be logically added to the
division without creating some geographically funky divisions or destroying other rivalries (like BOS-MTL, BUF-TML, MTL-TML).

Logically the divisional alignment would begin eithre from North (Canadian teams + Boston + Buffalo + 3) or from South (Florida teams + Carolina + 5).

 

[CanadianHockey]

Hate to say it, but the easiest solution divides PIT/PHI from NY teams.

Clean, simple divisions. Line has to be drawn somewhere, it's better to just split NY from Pennsylvania than try to divide the Canadian teams or NY teams. You can always try to rectify the divisional split by having more inter-division games.

Divisions are Pacific, Central. Northeast, and Southeast.
Any of Detroit, Nashville, or Columbus could be included in the SE. Colorado could go in either the Pacific or Central divisions.

 

[Noldo]

Hate to say it, but the easiest solution divides PIT/PHI from NY teams.

Clean, simple divisions. Line has to be drawn somewhere, it's better to just split NY from Pennsylvania than try to divide the Canadian teams or NY teams. You can always try to rectify the divisional split by having more inter-division games.

Divisions are Pacific, Central. Northeast, and Southeast.
Any of Detroit, Nashville, or Columbus could be included in the SE. Colorado could go in either the Pacific or Central divisions.

And if you don't mind having 14 team in West and 16 in East, you can even put Columbus to Southeast to begin with.

 

[Nashvols]

I want to propose the following so we do not get another handful of small minded western market fans/DET fan trying to ruin the NHL:


1) PIT and PHI must be together (if not, then PIT must be with WAS, under no circumstance is PIT separated from both rivals).
2) PHI must be with all NY teams
3) All NY teams must be together
4) CHI and STL must be together

5) If possible, NY and BOS are together
Uh yes, it is a deal breaker when it idoitocally seperates PIT-PHI, PHI-NY, NY-BOS.


Why?
-You want to be the only sport with no NY to PHI or BOS rivalry, just so Winnipeg is slotted to be moderately less isolated than they deserve given their location?
Fine, it's that thinking which is why the NHL is and always will be 4th.


I have an idea, from now on NO STUPID PROPOSALS.

The following rules are in place for proposed realignments:

-IF YOU CAN NOT DO THIS, DO NOT EVEN BOTHER TO SUBMIT A PROPOSAL BECAUSE IT WOULD DO FAR MORE HARM THAN GOOD.

-Christ, keep it simple, Nashville to SE, Nashville to SE, Nashville to SE and DET QUIT WHINNING!
-Moving you east would upset far more rivalries (including your's with CHI), so shut up already!

So, it's OK to separate Nashville from all of its rivals, but Pit should remain with its rivals at all costs.

Got it.

 

[tp71]

I want to propose the following so we do not get another handful of small minded western market fans/DET fan trying to ruin the NHL:


1) PIT and PHI must be together (if not, then PIT must be with WAS, under no circumstance is PIT separated from both rivals).
2) PHI must be with all NY teams
3) All NY teams must be together
4) CHI and STL must be together

5) If possible, NY and BOS are together
Uh yes, it is a deal breaker when it idoitocally seperates PIT-PHI, PHI-NY, NY-BOS.


Why?
-You want to be the only sport with no NY to PHI or BOS rivalry, just so Winnipeg is slotted to be moderately less isolated than they deserve given their location?
Fine, it's that thinking which is why the NHL is and always will be 4th.


I have an idea, from now on NO STUPID PROPOSALS.

The following rules are in place for proposed realignments:

-IF YOU CAN NOT DO THIS, DO NOT EVEN BOTHER TO SUBMIT A PROPOSAL BECAUSE IT WOULD DO FAR MORE HARM THAN GOOD.

-Christ, keep it simple, Nashville to SE, Nashville to SE, Nashville to SE and DET QUIT WHINNING!
-Moving you east would upset far more rivalries (including your's with CHI), so shut up already!

So pretty much they don't matter then? The only teams that matter are the Atlantic division and a select few?

Sorry, what matters is what's best for ALL 30 teams. Not what's best for 5 or 6. New rivalries can be formed, just as old ones can be lost, but we shouldn't hinder the betterment of the league to keep 5 groups of fans happy whilst flipping the bird to the rest of them.

 

[Buck Aki Berg]

Awesome. Then let's dispense with conferences so we can draw up a 16 team bracket tournament for the playoffs!

Or let 12 teams in, and let 8 teams have play-ins for the final four spots. But again, I think it'd be awesome having a playoff structure where any two teams could meet at any time.

If you did this, the matchups for the first round of the playoffs would have 2108 different possibilities. Good luck ever seeing your favourite playoff rivalries ever again.

 

[Retail1LO*]

So, it's OK to separate Nashville from all of its rivals, but Pit should remain with its rivals at all costs.

Got it.

I know you're a Nashville homer, but much like Detroit gets 1st dibs moving east, because it's wanted to do so since before Columbus was even a team...Pittsburgh has been around just a TAD longer than the mustard wearin' meanies of Nashville. Nashville hasn't even been around long enough TO have rivals. :-p

Nashville would look great in the southeast with all the other teams that are south of the mason-dixon line. Tampa was once in the Central too, and they've done well in the southeast.

 

[Retail1LO*]

If you did this, the matchups for the first round of the playoffs would have 2108 different possibilities. Good luck ever seeing your favourite playoff rivalries ever again.

Yeah, but those possibilities go down drastically when you consider the same teams almost always make the playoffs. LOL And...I see your point. But at least you'd see your rivals all season long.

Your explanation however is exactly why I really am behind the idea of returning to 4 divisions, with divisional playoffs.

 

[TruthDeliveryVehicle*]

How about this idea with only minor tweaks to current division alignment?

3 conferences, but very similar division structure.

Eastern or Atlantic Conference

New York
New York
New Jersey
Philadelphia
Pittsburgh

Washington
Carolina
Florida
Tampa Bay
Nasville


Central or Eastern Conference

Boston
Montreal
Ottawa
Toronto
Buffalo

Detroit
Columbus
Chicago
St Louis
Minnesota


Western Conference

Winnipeg
Colorado
Edmonton
Vancouver
Calgary

Dallas
Phoenix
Los Angeles
Anaheim
San Jose

Each team plays division rivals 6 times=24 games
...conference rivals 4 times=20 games
out fo conference teams 2 times=40 games
Total=84 games

Playoffs
All teams seeded 1-16, you could give the conference/division winners 1-3/6 seeds or just guarantee division winners a playoff spot.

Pros
-perfectly balanced schedule
-keeps most current division rivals together, without separating any major rivalries.
-allows midwest teams (Detroit, Columbus, Chicago, St Louis, Minnesota) to avoid travelling out west moreso than games in the east.
-puts 5 original six teams in one conference
-versatile for possible future relocations.

Cons
-Dallas, Winnipeg, Montreal, Boston, Ottawa get screwed to varying degrees regarding travel costs.
-Boston separated from New York area teams.
-Nashville is separated from all current division rivals, but gets some new southeastern rivals including Ovechkin/Stamkos.

 

[Buck Aki Berg]

This is almost exactly the alignment that I'm hoping for, with the exception of either moving Columbus into the "Southeast" division, or moving Colorado into the "Pacific" division to take the "Central" division down to two time zones. Personally, I'd take the former over the latter.

 

[Crayton]

EDIT: Reattached after a total of 35 downloads.

This is a realignment program.

You can now choose from 7 alignments and 2 basic schedule formats (the Current schedule and Bettman's proposed), and even switch teams around for a new alignment of your own.

The regular season can be simulated. The game-simulator has not been finessed, but it does produce realistic season-ending stats.

The playoffs and playoff-qualification have not yet been programmed, although the future options are shown on the opening page.

The purpose of this program is to see how different realignment scenarios might play-out. The skill input for each team is based off of this past regular season.

 

[Nashvols]

I know you're a Nashville homer, but much like Detroit gets 1st dibs moving east, because it's wanted to do so since before Columbus was even a team...Pittsburgh has been around just a TAD longer than the mustard wearin' meanies of Nashville. Nashville hasn't even been around long enough TO have rivals. :-p

Nashville would look great in the southeast with all the other teams that are south of the mason-dixon line. Tampa was once in the Central too, and they've done well in the southeast.

Might I add in "from your perspective"?

Being in the Central for 13 seasons is certainly long enough to make some rivalries...and Detroit is most certainly one of them. Unfortunately, almost every scenario I see splits us up from Detroit. I would say that we have a healthy rivalry with the other teams in the division.

What I don't get is why Nashville supposedly looks so great in the Southeast. Just because we're a Southeastern US city? The closest city in the NHL SE is Raleigh, which is about the same distance as Detroit, our current farthest in the Central. Columbus is actually closer to Raleigh than we are, and significantly closer to Washington...and they aren't THAT much farther to Tampa and Miami than we are (you have to consider how far west we are compared to the other teams in the SE). Just to note, we're closer to Dallas than we are to Tampa...and Dallas is almost the same distance for us as Washington is.

I will tell you that the only way I would've been fine with moving to the SE is if Atlanta was still in it. I just don't buy into the idea that Nashville is a "perfect fit" for the Southeast, without Atlanta in it.

 

[MTaylorJ1]

Might I add in "from your perspective"?

Being in the Central for 13 seasons is certainly long enough to make some rivalries...and Detroit is most certainly one of them. Unfortunately, almost every scenario I see splits us up from Detroit. I would say that we have a healthy rivalry with the other teams in the division.

What I don't get is why Nashville supposedly looks so great in the Southeast. Just because we're a Southeastern US city? The closest city in the NHL SE is Raleigh, which is about the same distance as Detroit, our current farthest in the Central. Columbus is actually closer to Raleigh than we are, and significantly closer to Washington...and they aren't THAT much farther to Tampa and Miami than we are (you have to consider how far west we are compared to the other teams in the SE). Just to note, we're closer to Dallas than we are to Tampa...and Dallas is almost the same distance for us as Washington is.

I will tell you that the only way I would've been fine with moving to the SE is if Atlanta was still in it. I just don't buy into the idea that Nashville is a "perfect fit" for the Southeast, without Atlanta in it.

I tend to agree with you, I think people associate Nashville with Southeastern because of the SEC. Except that other than the loose affiliation Tampa has with Gainesville (>2 hours apart) there aren't any other SEC cities in the NHL now that Atlanta left. Raleigh and Sunrise are ACC cities with almost zero affiliation with Nashville.

Nashville belongs in the central (time zone wise) and with cities it's much closer to.

In terms of Detroit and Columbus, I'd guess one would get to finally move to the east, but I wouldn't construct divisions around them, if they want to be in the East so badly, they can be a +1.

For the Eastern divisions, I'd keep the Canadian Teams, Buffalo, and Boston together (the NE division) and the old Patrick division together (Atlantic plus Washington). I'd tend to associate Carolina with the Patrick division, and I'd add the Florida teams with the Northeast. At that point, depending on who gets moved to the East, I'd put Detroit in the Adams or Columbus in the Patrick. Detroit because of proximity to Toronto, and Columubs because of it's proximity to Pittsburgh.

For the West, I understand Winnipeg wanting to be with the other Western Canadian teams, but that messes up the time zones (they'd be the only NHL team 2 time zones ahead of some divisional opponents). Colorado could probably go either way, most likely whichever division made for less travel.

Adams - MON, TOR, OTT, BUF, BOS, TB, FL, DET*
Patrick - NYR, NYI, NJ, PIT, PHI, WASH, CAR, CBJ*

Norris - CHI, NSH, STL, DAL, MIN, WPG, DET/CBJ*, COL*
Smythe - VAN, EDM, CGY, SJ, LA, ANA, PHX, COL*

Just my thought though.

 

[tarheelhockey]

So based on last year's results, the SE Division would have been:

Washington 107
Philadelphia 106
Pittsburgh 106
Detroit 104
Tampa Bay 103
Carolina 91
Florida 72


Um, can we get a re-do on that? I'd like to make the playoffs someday

 

[edog37]

So, it's OK to separate Nashville from all of its rivals, but Pit should remain with its rivals at all costs.

Got it.

Pens have been around over 40 years, Preds have not....I believe the Pens get more consideration accordingly....

 

[Nashvols]

Pens have been around over 40 years, Preds have not....I believe the Pens get more consideration accordingly....

Neat, but they aren't talking about the Pens moving to a different conference. I'd say the situation is somewhat different here.