RD Timothy Liljegren - Ex-Rogle BK, SHL (2017, 17th, TOR) III

[firstemperor]

The sample is quite small, its a virus that affects people differently and I would assume getting it very early in the year to the extent it causes you to miss training camp, is a big deal.

It can affect everyone differently in regards to their energy levels. Your body is essentially fighting off an active infection for a prolonged period of time.

Marner is also a possible example, although I'm unsure if it is a confirmed case. He didn't look like the same player in the playoffs, just didn't have the same zip in his game. He fought hard shift->shift, like he always does, but he didn't have anywhere near the same bounce or explosiveness. It could have been a LBI.

Take the Leafs Hype away and you realize no neither is up for blue chip status the way Charlie McAvoy is but both have a strong chance to be point producing #1 defensemen.

Depends what you define as a blue-chip but I have held Liljegren in high-enough regard that I am optimistic enough that he can track the same way McAvoy did in his D+1 (easily a top 5 drafted D prospect in the league and a player who completely leapfrogged against comparable prospects around draft-time- i.e. Bean, Fabbro at BU, Cholowski).

I'd much rather hear analysis on how well he is playing, not where he "should have" been drafted.

That should be the case in a idealized environment, but it's not. But there is meaningful discussion about his play/highlights at the WJSS, unfortunately, you have to sift through this thread for it.

 

[Gaunce4gm]

As a Canucks fan I wanted nothing to do with Liljegrin because we were drafting 5th overall, however at 17th he's an absolute no brainer. Personally I didn't have a defender in my top 8 but he was my first choice at D as my list read;

N.Patrick
N.Hischier
G.Vilardi
E.Pettersen
C.Mittlesadt
C.Glass
M.Necas
N.Suzuki
T.Liljegrin
M.Heiskanen


And for anyone wondering where Makar was I had him at 34th overall.
Wouldn't trust his stats coming from such a poor league and his defensive play is rather iffy

 

[4thline]

Nylander was a top 10 pick who didn't slide dramatically in his draft year. not comparable situations at all aside from both being drafted by the leafs.

Let's see

Top 3 challenging for 1st going into the year - check
Had "sub-par*' draft seasons split between several Swedish teams *relative to expectation, but on second glance still damn strong relative to historical comparables -Check

Fell relative to pre-season standing- Check
Strong chance reason for fall was untrue/aberration- check
People scoffing at Leaf fans having player above lower ranked players that GM's took with a reach check

 

[Pyromaniac]

As a Canucks fan I wanted nothing to do with Liljegrin because we were drafting 5th overall, however at 17th he's an absolute no brainer. Personally I didn't have a defender in my top 8 but he was my first choice at D as my list read;

N.Patrick
N.Hischier
G.Vilardi
E.Pettersen
C.Mittlesadt
C.Glass
M.Necas
N.Suzuki
T.Liljegrin
M.Heiskanen


And for anyone wondering where Makar was I had him at 34th overall.
Wouldn't trust his stats coming from such a poor league and his defensive play is rather iffy

That's fair. It would have been risky for any team taking him as high as #5 even if they really liked him. I think the Canucks got a good one in Petersson.

 

[biotk]

Marner is also a possible example

Marner's poor play, poor decision making and the reality that he looked like a very different player, during the weeks after he returned from mono must have been caused by something other than mono as mono doesn't cause those things. The timing is simply a coincidence. This is something we have learned in Liljegren threads.

 

[WTFMAN99]

Marner's poor play, poor decision making and the reality that he looked like a very different player, during the weeks after he returned from mono must have been caused by something other than mono as mono doesn't cause those things. The timing is simply a coincidence. This is something we have learned in Liljegren threads.

Yes it does. You're fatigued and can't think great. He had mono and it hurt him quite a bit. He didn't recover until the World Championships.

Source for mono info? Me.

 

[djames]

Let's see

Top 3 challenging for 1st going into the year - check
Had "sub-par*' draft seasons split between several Swedish teams *relative to expectation, but on second glance still damn strong relative to historical comparables -Check

Fell relative to pre-season standing- Check
Strong chance reason for fall was untrue/aberration- check
People scoffing at Leaf fans having player above lower ranked players that GM's took with a reach check

It is so funny when those posters keep making themselves look ignorant.

 

[TDK67]

Yes it does. You're fatigued and can't think great. He had mono and it hurt him quite a bit. He didn't recover until the World Championships.

Source for mono info? Me.

biotk was being sarcastic. Obviously post-mono effects impacted Marner's play.

 

[Menzinger]

Nylander was a top 10 pick who didn't slide dramatically in his draft year. not comparable situations at all aside from both being drafted by the leafs.

The two guys were taken less than 10 spots apart. Meaningless to create an arbitrary tier between them.

Plenty of folks in here turned out to be dead wrong about Nylander. I expect the same to be for Liljegren.

And regardless, draft position becomes absolutely meaningless the second after the players name is called

 

[zharkenby]

Let's see

Top 3 challenging for 1st going into the year - check
Had "sub-par*' draft seasons split between several Swedish teams *relative to expectation, but on second glance still damn strong relative to historical comparables -Check

Fell relative to pre-season standing- Check
Strong chance reason for fall was untrue/aberration- check
People scoffing at Leaf fans having player above lower ranked players that GM's took with a reach check

So much of this post is blatantly false or completely irrelevant

 

[4thline]

So much of this post is blatantly false or completely irrelevant

Top 3 challenging for 1st going into the year
http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showpost.php?p=71271321&postcount=6

http://http://www.tsn.ca/mckenzie-s-pre-season-ranking-the-nolan-patrick-draft-1.567410
that still stack up well
Had "sub-par*' draft seasons split between several Swedish teams
Nylander- Dominated the U18 offensively (top 10 performance all time)
His Sodertalje fragment is the highest U18 Allvenskan ppg of all time, Rogle 6th, Modo 18th for SHL U18 all time
Liljegren- 7th all time U18 SHL ppg, (beaten by his own U17)

Fell relative to preseason standing
~6th and ~12th vs 3rd and 2nd

...
...

By all means, show me the "blatant falsehoods"

 

[zharkenby]

Top 3 challenging for 1st going into the year
http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showpost.php?p=71271321&postcount=6

http://http://www.tsn.ca/mckenzie-s-pre-season-ranking-the-nolan-patrick-draft-1.567410
that still stack up well
Had "sub-par*' draft seasons split between several Swedish teams
Nylander- Dominated the U18 offensively (top 10 performance all time)
His Sodertalje fragment is the highest U18 Allvenskan ppg of all time, Rogle 6th, Modo 18th for SHL U18 all time
Liljegren- 7th all time U18 SHL ppg, (beaten by his own U17)

Fell relative to preseason standing
~6th and ~12th vs 3rd and 2nd

...
...

By all means, show me the "blatant falsehoods"

You have no reason to say the reasons he fell weren't true, and where he was ranked at the beginning of the year legitimately is irrelevant.

 

[Atomos2]

Apparently it wasn't universal for the guys who get paid big bucks to do it for a living.

He is the same tier prospect as Kylington at this point.

Lol this sounds familiar...

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showpost.php?p=88221269&postcount=72

 

[Team Cozens]

Let's see

Top 3 challenging for 1st going into the year - check
Had "sub-par*' draft seasons split between several Swedish teams *relative to expectation, but on second glance still damn strong relative to historical comparables -Check

Fell relative to pre-season standing- Check
Strong chance reason for fall was untrue/aberration- check
People scoffing at Leaf fans having player above lower ranked players that GM's took with a reach check

Agreed. Still think he should have gone in the 10-14 range. Guaranteed #3-5# D for the Leafs

 

[zeke]

Lol this sounds familiar...

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showpost.php?p=88221269&postcount=72

heh.

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

Lol this sounds familiar...

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showpost.php?p=88221269&postcount=72

This is tremendous. Kudos to you, good sir.

 

[zharkenby]

Geez... Never knew a Devil's fan could blindly hate a Leafs prospect so much. I'd expect this kind of behaviour from at least 10 other fan bases before the Devils, lol.

I honestly wonder what the point of it all is. If you post this much negativity about a prospect and turn out to be wrong, you're gonna look like a really big fool a few years down the line.

Example a) all the people who thought Marner and Nylander were busts immediately after they were drafted by the Leafs and "overhyped" by Leafs fans.

Like honestly, who cares if people hype/overhype their teams prospects. Let them have their fun, and maybe engage in hyping your own teams prospects once in awhile instead of sh*tting on others.

P.S.

Liljegren is gonna be a hell of a player. Hirschier will be RNH 2.0.

Was actually a huge fan of both marner and Nylander, was praying marner somehow slipped to us. And I'm aware of how bad it'll look if I'm wrong about TL, but as you can tell I'm pretty sure I won't be.

 

[TimeZone]

Lol this sounds familiar...

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showpost.php?p=88221269&postcount=72

Well that's embarrassing.

 

[zeke]

, but as you can tell I'm pretty sure I won't be.

no you're not.

 

[zharkenby]

no you're not.

Again, I wouldn't just be saying it for ***** and gigs. Glaring similarities to runblad, but a bit better of a skater. Not saying he won't crack the NHL. But he's likely a 4-5D

 

[Morgs]

Again, I wouldn't just be saying it for ***** and gigs. Glaring similarities to runblad, but a bit better of a skater. Not saying he won't crack the NHL. But he's likely a 4-5D

1. Both are RHD
2. Both are Swedish
3. Both went #17 OA

List ends there, so I don't really get the "glaring similarities" except for the fact that one busted and you want the other one to bust.

 

[NarcoPolo]

Again, I wouldn't just be saying it for ***** and gigs. Glaring similarities to runblad, but a bit better of a skater. Not saying he won't crack the NHL. But he's likely a 4-5D

likely a good 3rd pairing dman? Him and Rundblad have next to no similarities. Runbland had bad feet and couldn't defend. What I've seen from Liljegren is the opposite.

 

[WTFMAN99]

This is tremendous. Kudos to you, good sir.

Making absolute/AINEC statements only make you (not you specifically) look like an idiot. No one knows where 18-19 year old kids end up. I mean outside of McDavid or Crosby type picks, no one is a sure bet to end up how you think.

 

[zeke]

Again, I wouldn't just be saying it for ***** and gigs. Glaring similarities to runblad, but a bit better of a skater. Not saying he won't crack the NHL. But he's likely a 4-5D

you wouldn't be posting endlessly about it if you were confident in your opinion.

and he has very little similarity to rundblad, actually. rundblad was a poor skater, liljegren an elite one. at 17, liljegren had played 2yrs in the senior men's division in sweden, while rundblad was still in junior with only one 6gm cup of tea. there's nothing similar about them other than their nationality.

if you did want to compare him to swedes with similar skillsets and performance at the same age, you'd be forced to use names like karlsson and oel.

 

[4thline]

Agreed. Still think he should have gone in the 10-14 range. Guaranteed #3-5# D for the Leafs

Yup, I'd say 8-13 but that's quibbling .

The risk that it wasn't the after affects of mono dragging his game down would make it a seriously ballsy pick to go any higher than that. I don't doubt that the odd team would have though.