rank the following players from best to worst based on raw natural talent and skill

[Big Phil]

Always thought him more impressive in flashy moments than the trenches. He'd look so-so in a game but on the 6 o'clock news his two best moments stood out. In 15 years of ATDing i have never drafted Denis Savard because he never drops to where my eyes told me he belongs.

Serge Savard, by the way, originated the "Savard Spinorama". Everyone my age knows that. Some youngum in the 1990's uploaded erronously a Denis video of it and generations have been googling it since.

Denis wasn't a stitch better than Larmer but he was riskier, less committed to responsible play, more likely to go north-south, even if Mess would strip the puck and go straight the other way to score. Mess owned Savard.

There were different "spinoramas" that both Serge and Denis Savard did. Serge was a master at faking a shot at the point, having a defender over-commit to it and doing a spinorama around him. He did this while standing still, it was poetic no doubt. But Denis did his on rushes at high speed. To me that was more impressive to watch. Here is the Denis Savard I remember, and come on, the guy was clearly a step up on Larmer, no offense to Larmer or anything, but Savard carried that Hawks team for a long time.

 

[gotyournose]

Hmmmm, good one.

Savard
Perreault
Oates
Dionne
Ratelle
Hawerchuk
Thornton
Sittler
Nieuwendyk

Between Savard and Perreault, heck, it is a coin flip. There are maybe as many players on one hand that were as pretty and elegant to watch as Perreault and few who could skate so fluidly like him. On the other hand Savard could do spinoramas on NHL defensemen mid-rush and beat them. It is really hard to say.

Maybe some are wondering why Oates is so high. His sweet hands and those playmaking skills alone make up this high. I don't know if the guy ever made a bad pass in his life. I thought of putting Nieuwendyk higher based on the ability from his lacrosse days to deflect the puck from a hand/eye perspective.



Doughty
Niedermayer
Weber
Keith
Blake

I just don't think Niedermayer showed us this raw talent enough. Way too much holding back early in his career for him to be #1. I think Weber's shot has to be taken into account here as well.

Side question, did Savard ever play wing? How well did he do on faceoffs and what was his defensive game like? Also for the defenceman, where would Guy Lapointe fit in the rankings?

 

[vadim sharifijanov]

of those dmen, drew doughty had th e most raw talent. when you say a guy is a natural, doughty is the kind of player you mean. he could do everything and everything looked like it came easy to him.

of that group, he was the best skater with the puck on his stick, best hockey sense, best stretch passer, and on top of all that he also is the best defensively of them too. keith is the only one i would even entertain as a rival.

 

[Sentinel]

I was thinking Blake and Weber kind of stood out because of their size, hitting, and big shots. Niedermayer and Keith a little more nuanced in positioning and smarts though obviously lots of skill, too.

My Best-Carey

But Blake is dead last when it came to hockey IQ. Sometimes defensemen are expected to, you know, play defense.

 

[frisco]

But Blake is dead last when it came to hockey IQ.

That might be true but I was interpreting the OP as asking who stands out with the most obvious talent. Hockey IQ is pretty nuanced.

My Best-Carey

 

[Staniowski]

I'm not going to rank them but I like the talent of Perreault and Hawerchuk the best among the forwards.

Perreault is one of the most beautiful hockey players of all-time, and was somewhere close to being Team Canada's most elite and best forward in both the '76 Canada Cup and the '81 Canada Cup.

Hawerchuk was at least very good at everything, and great at many things.

 

[Staniowski]

Side question, did Savard ever play wing? How well did he do on faceoffs and what was his defensive game like? Also for the defenceman, where would Guy Lapointe fit in the rankings?

Guy Lapointe was an excellent hockey player, and probably one of the most complete players of all-time.

In many respects he was the best offensively of Montreal's Big 3. He had great vision, very talented with the puck, smooth passer, and an excellent shot from the point (one of the very best in the NHL). Great on the PP.

He was also great defensively - smart positionally, loved to hit, aggressive, blocked shots all the time.

Ken Dryden said that, when the team needed a lift, needed some emotion, needed a spark, Lapointe was the guy on the team who was most likely to provide it.

In the '76 Canada Cup, Lapointe was superb. Of all the Habs on that Team Canada (I think there were 7), Lapointe was the best.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

1. Perreault
2. Dionne
3. Savard
4. Hawerchuk
5. Oates
6. Ratelle
7. Sittler
8. Thornton
9. Nieuwendyk

1. Doughty
2. Weber
3. Niedermayer
4. Keith
5. Blake

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

Guy Lapointe was an excellent hockey player, and probably one of the most complete players of all-time.

In many respects he was the best offensively of Montreal's Big 3. He had great vision, very talented with the puck, smooth passer, and an excellent shot from the point (one of the very best in the NHL). Great on the PP.

He was also great defensively - smart positionally, loved to hit, aggressive, blocked shots all the time.

Ken Dryden said that, when the team needed a lift, needed some emotion, needed a spark, Lapointe was the guy on the team who was most likely to provide it.

In the '76 Canada Cup, Lapointe was superb. Of all the Habs on that Team Canada (I think there were 7), Lapointe was the best.

Excellent post.

Based on Dryden's book, Lapointe was also a bigger influence in the locker room than either Robinson or Savard.

 

[Big Phil]

Side question, did Savard ever play wing? How well did he do on faceoffs and what was his defensive game like? Also for the defenceman, where would Guy Lapointe fit in the rankings?

Not sure if he did, not that I ever remember. I don't remember him being great, or poor, on faceoffs. I don't think it was part of his game that he worked on. Maybe someone else can specify. Defensively he was okay, not a Selke winner or nothing but Savard could be surprisingly chippy at times.

Guy Lapointe would belong on that list for sure. He could have been pretty successful as a forward back int he day.