Rank the following Dmen:

[RabbinsDuck]

How do you rank:

Stevens
MacInnis
Pronger
Leetch
Niedermayer
Chara

I think that's the order I would have them right now.

Click to read more...

 

[JaysCyYoung]

Thats the order that I would have them ranked as well. It's bizarre too because Stevens was the only one on that list that didn't win a Norris Trophy, but his status as the dominant defenceman (and inspirational leader) on three Stanley Cup champions and ability to alter his game (going from one of the league's premier offensive defencemen to the singularly most dominant shut down defenceman in the game post-1994) is too difficult to overlook. Even if he wasn't as offensively-gifted as some of the other names on the list Stevens was nevertheless the best all-around.

Bourque was better than all of them, however.

 

[tony d]

Stevens
MacInnis
Leetch
Pronger
Niedermayer
Chara

 

[seventieslord]

How do you rank:

Stevens
MacInnis
Pronger
Leetch
Niedermayer
Chara

I think that's the order I would have them right now.

I think that is my order too (maybe MacInnis over Stevens?) but I'm starting to wonder how long I can keep Chara under Niedermayer and Chara.

 

[Hawkey Town 18]

3 close but distinct tiers for me...

MacInnis/Stevens
Leetch/Pronger
Niedermayer/Chara

Not sure who I'd pick first out of each pairing. My gut says MacInnis, Pronger, Niedermayer, but it deserves a closer look.

 

[begbeee]

Only Chara has no Conn Smythe (Pronger has Hart and Conn Smythe Trophy worthy run) - that says a lot about man, who is the weakest member of this group.

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

How do you rank:

Stevens
MacInnis
Pronger
Leetch
Niedermayer
Chara

I think that's the order I would have them right now.

good question. I more or less agree with your order though the results of tomorrow's game definitely influence Chara's
position. I couldn't rank him over Pronger or Leetch, but Chara has to be nipping at Niedermayer's heals by now

 

[RabbinsDuck]

By All Star Team Selections:

1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2 = MacInnis
1, 1, 2, 2, 2 = Stevens
1, 1, 2, 2, 2 = Leetch
1, 1, 1, 2 = Niedermayer
1, 1, 2, 2 = Chara
1, 2, 2, 2 = Pronger

Chara is guaranteed to have one more after this year, but is the only one not to have at least one incredible playoff run. Really impressive that MacInnis has that amount stretched over 15+ years.

 

[Hockey Outsider]

Total Norris trophy votes

Defensemen|Votes
Al MacInnis | 345
Brian Leetch | 284
Chris Pronger | 275
Scott Niedermayer | 238
Scott Stevens | 231
Zdeno Chara | 211

- This is not my personal ranking, this is simply a reflection of how many Norris trophy votes each defenseman received over the course of their careers.

- The Norris trophy is only based on regular season performance. In real life, Stevens is much farther ahead of Chara than it would appear per the above list.

- The list doesn't take quality of competition into account. In Stevens' best years, he was competing for Norris votes against prime Bourque, Chelios, Leetch, MacInnis, etc. Chara's competition for the Norris in recent years has been very weak by historical standards. If Chara wins the Norris this year, he might actually jump to 2nd on this list.

 

[Infinite Vision*]

I think that is my order too (maybe MacInnis over Stevens?) but I'm starting to wonder how long I can keep Chara under Niedermayer and Chara.

I'm stuck on Niedermayer, but you can't keep Chara under Chara for too long.

 

[seventieslord]

I'm stuck on Niedermayer, but you can't keep Chara under Chara for too long.

LOL

I meant Leetch.

 

[Hardyvan123]

3 close but distinct tiers for me...

MacInnis/Stevens
Leetch/Pronger
Niedermayer/Chara

Not sure who I'd pick first out of each pairing. My gut says MacInnis, Pronger, Niedermayer, but it deserves a closer look.

I'm leanign towards this ranking but it's hard with Chara and Pronger still playing and adding to his career.

Also the gap between the top guy MacInnis and the bottom, Chara, for now or Nieds isn't as large as it seems IMO.

Nieds really gets slammed on these boards sometimes, unfairly IMO.

 

[tarheelhockey]

Macinnis

Pronger
Stevens
Leetch


Niedermayer
Chara

 

[Big Phil]

How do you rank:

Stevens
MacInnis
Pronger
Leetch
Niedermayer
Chara

I think that's the order I would have them right now.

I agree for the most part. However, if I was picking it I'd put MacInnis 1st. Just barely, because as we all know Stevens did things that didn't show up on the scoresheet and the intimidation he provided makes up for the lost offense later in his career. But MacInnis had a well rounded game and his own level of intimidation with his shot. I put Big Al #1. Other than perhaps Leetch in 1994, he had the best playoff run out of all of them.

Leetch and Nieds are retired so obviously they can't go up but I think MacInnis and Stevens are a safe #1-2 on that list for a while. Pronger might surpass them, but he'll need another all-star season to do so.

Eventually Chara has got to pass Niedermayer though. Even in Nieds' prime (2003-2007) Chara was right there with him for the most part. Give it time. But will he catch Leetch? I think he can, but that'll take longer

 

[Fredrik_71]

My ranking based on what player I would choose for my team.

Pronger
Leetch
Chara
MacInnis
Stevens
Niedermayer

/Cheers

 

[revolverjgw]

Macinnis

Pronger
Stevens
Leetch


Niedermayer
Chara

That's how I have it too

 

[vadim sharifijanov]

i think niedermayer has become so overrated in the popular imagination that he tends to get a bit underrated here. regular season prime vs. regular season prime, niedermayer and chara are pretty even in terms of norrises and all-star selections, and their primes overlapped so quality of competition isn't really a factor.

but in terms of playoffs, niedermayer's best run ('03) is easily ahead of chara this year. and niedermayer has three other cups, including a(n admittedly weak) conn smythe. to me, it would take either a three more dominant regular seasons or a really outstanding playoff run, or some combination of regular season and playoff success, for me to even consider chara even.

i think there's a very reasonable argument for niedermayer being ahead of leetch, actually.

for me, the tiers are:

stevens, macinnis
pronger
leetch niedermayer
chara

stevens vs. macinnis is very difficult. before '94, it was unquestionably macinnis. by '98, it had turned decisively to stevens, though this was somewhat due to macinnis was so good so early and all those years of "just" being a top ten defenseman made a lot of people forget about him. then both of them added so much to their resumes after '98, which would have seemed unfathomable at the time. now that all is said and done... i lean slightly toward macinnis, but it's hard to discount his average (by the standards of the guys on this list) playoff record in calgary post-'89. those were very strong teams that kept getting bounced in the first round and he should have been their best player, which he rarely was.

 

[Reds4Life]

Stevens tied with Pronger
MacInnis

Leetch

Niedermayer




Chara


(gaps intentional)

 

[RabbinsDuck]

i think niedermayer has become so overrated in the popular imagination that he tends to get a bit underrated here. regular season prime vs. regular season prime, niedermayer and chara are pretty even in terms of norrises and all-star selections, and their primes overlapped so quality of competition isn't really a factor.

but in terms of playoffs, niedermayer's best run ('03) is easily ahead of chara this year. and niedermayer has three other cups, including a(n admittedly weak) conn smythe. to me, it would take either a three more dominant regular seasons or a really outstanding playoff run, or some combination of regular season and playoff success, for me to even consider chara even.

i think there's a very reasonable argument for niedermayer being ahead of leetch, actually.

for me, the tiers are:

stevens, macinnis
pronger
leetch niedermayer
chara

stevens vs. macinnis is very difficult. before '94, it was unquestionably macinnis. by '98, it had turned decisively to stevens, though this was somewhat due to macinnis was so good so early and all those years of "just" being a top ten defenseman made a lot of people forget about him. then both of them added so much to their resumes after '98, which would have seemed unfathomable at the time. now that all is said and done... i lean slightly toward macinnis, but it's hard to discount his average (by the standards of the guys on this list) playoff record in calgary post-'89. those were very strong teams that kept getting bounced in the first round and he should have been their best player, which he rarely was.

Nice thoughts - I can see MacInnis over Stevens though I still edge towards Stevens - largely for those later years where Stevens was a constant immense presence in the playoffs and MacInnis was more of an after thought.

Pronger is a tough one - he reminds me of Potvin but on a lower tier. Underwhelming per season results but always a huge factor when he is on the ice. Strictly peak, at their best, I probably take Pronger out of all that group, but overall I think he is well behind Stevens and MacInnis... Leetch is debatable.

 

[Fire Sweeney]

Stevens
Leetch
Chara
Macinnis
Niedermayer
Pronger

 

[VanIslander]

MacInnis
Pronger
Stevens

Leetch

Niedermayer



Chara

 

[jkrx]

MacInnis
Stevens

Pronger

Chara
Leetch
Niedermeyer

 

[tarheelhockey]

Stevens
Leetch
Chara
Macinnis
Niedermayer
Pronger

You'd put Chara over Macinnis? Why?

 

[Breakfast of Champs]

You'd put Chara over Macinnis? Why?

The fact that his name is tyler seguin and his pic is chara with the cup might be an indication

 

[Epsilon]

i think niedermayer has become so overrated in the popular imagination that he tends to get a bit underrated here. regular season prime vs. regular season prime, niedermayer and chara are pretty even in terms of norrises and all-star selections, and their primes overlapped so quality of competition isn't really a factor.

but in terms of playoffs, niedermayer's best run ('03) is easily ahead of chara this year. and niedermayer has three other cups, including a(n admittedly weak) conn smythe. to me, it would take either a three more dominant regular seasons or a really outstanding playoff run, or some combination of regular season and playoff success, for me to even consider chara even.

i think there's a very reasonable argument for niedermayer being ahead of leetch, actually.

for me, the tiers are:

stevens, macinnis
pronger
leetch niedermayer
chara

stevens vs. macinnis is very difficult. before '94, it was unquestionably macinnis. by '98, it had turned decisively to stevens, though this was somewhat due to macinnis was so good so early and all those years of "just" being a top ten defenseman made a lot of people forget about him. then both of them added so much to their resumes after '98, which would have seemed unfathomable at the time. now that all is said and done... i lean slightly toward macinnis, but it's hard to discount his average (by the standards of the guys on this list) playoff record in calgary post-'89. those were very strong teams that kept getting bounced in the first round and he should have been their best player, which he rarely was.

I would tend to agree with this post. Similar regular season results for Niedermayer and Chara, 4 Stanley Cups for Niedermayer to 1 for Chara, and a significantly better top-end playoff for Niedermayer (2003), and I don't see how people can be putting Chara ahead of him other than lack of perspective because the Cup win is so fresh. Also consider that Niedermayer twice finished 2nd to Lidstrom in Norris trophy voting, including against arguably Lidstrom's best season (2005-06). On the other hand, Chara finished behind Dion Phaneuf in 2007-08 and was beat by Niedermayer multiple times where both finished highly in the voting, including the year Niedermayer won the Norris.

I like your tiers, and would probably go with an absolute ordering of:

1. MacInnis
2. Stevens
3. Pronger
4. Leetch
5. Niedermayer
6. Chara