Rangers Prospect Poll (Summer 2018): #15 Prospect

#15 Prospect


  • Total voters
    75
  • Poll closed .

The Crypto Guy

Registered User
Jun 26, 2017
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32,812
Ranger's Summer 2018 Prospect Poll

1. Filip Chytil (F) (2017 Draft - 1st round) (66%)
2. Igor Shestyorkin (G) (2014 Draft - 4th round) (59%)
3. Vitali Kravtsov (F) (2018 Draft - 1st round) (52%)
4. Lias Andersson (F) (2017 Draft - 1st round)
5. Libor Hajek (D) (2016 Draft - 2nd round) (44%)
6. Brett Howden (F) (2016 Draft - 1st round) (47%)
7. K'Andre Miller (D) (2018 Draft - 1st round) (55%)
8. Neal Pionk (D) (Undrafted) (56%)
9. Nils Lundkvist (D) (2018 Draft - 1st round) (60%)
10. Ryan Lindgren (D) (2016 Draft - 2nd round) (41%)
11. Alexander Georgiev (G) (Undrafted) (50%)
12. Yegor Rykov (D) (2016 Draft - 5th round)
13. Ty Ronning (F) (2016 Draft - 7th round) (28%)
14. Vinni Lettieri (F) (Undrafted) (28%)

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*Anthony DeAngelo played 6 too many NHL games is no longer eligible*
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Added: Ragnarsson

Please post who you want added, eligible prospects that can be add:

Bernhardt, Daniel LW/L
Bigras, Chris D/L
Crawley, Brandon D/L
Fogarty, Steven D/L
Fontaine, Gabriel C/L
Gettinger, Tim LW/L
Gilmour, John D/L
Gropp, Ryan LW/L
Gross, Nico D/L
Halverson, Brandon G/L
Hughes, Riley RW/R
Huska, Adam G/L
Keane, Joey D/R
Kjellberg, Simon LW/L
Lakatos, Dominik C/L
Leedahl, Dawson LW/L
Lindqvist, Michael RW/R
Nanne, Tyler D-F/R
Nell, Chris G/L
Nieves, Boo C/L
O'Gara, Rob D/L
Pajuniemi, Lauri RW/R
Pedrie, Vince D/L
Reunanen, Tarmo D/L
Sjalin, Calle D/L
Wall, Tyler G/L
 

The Crypto Guy

Registered User
Jun 26, 2017
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Went with Meskanen, Could be a nice surprise. Had a fantastic season in Finland and apparently played very well at the prospect camp.

Don't have any interest voting for Virta at this time who will be 23 this season and still hasn't stepped foot in NA to play hockey, instead opting to sign in the KHL from the Finnish league.

Add Lindqvist
 
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nyr2k2

Can't Beat Him
Jul 30, 2005
45,660
32,732
Maryland
Went with Meskanen, Could be a nice surprise. Had a fantastic season in Finland and apparently played very well at the prospect camp.

Don't have any interest voting for Virta at this time who will be 23 this season and still hasn't stepped foot in NA to play hockey, instead opting to sign in the KHL from the Finnish league.
Meskanen will be 23 right about the start of the season, Virta will be 23 near the end of it.

In terms of last year, one of them at times played on the first line and later played on lower lines as he was playing for a really good, deep team with former NHL players (Virta), while the other was a PP specialist for his team (9 goals on the PP), a team that was not deep and missed the playoffs. In terms of who had a more impressive year, it's kind of a toss up. Virta was definitely asked to be a more well-rounded player by his team.

As far as prospect camp, that's just a glorified series of scrimmages.

I don't really care if people want to vote Meskanen ahead of Virta, but I can't imagine any circumstance where there's a chasm between them.
 

pblawr

Registered User
Jul 16, 2016
495
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Ragnarsson. I don't think it's broadly appreciated how impressive his performance in the Allsvenskan was.

First of all, the Allsvenskan is a legit pro league. Rob Vollman has found that the Allsvenskan is comparable to the AHL in terms of how tough it is to score in (Re-approaching the methodology of NHLe).

Secondly, Ragnarsson's 13 points is the most by any U19 defenseman in the Allsvenskan other than OEL and is tied with Mattias Ekholm and Rasmus Andersson. OEL and Ekholm are two of the best defensemen in the NHL today. Andersson is now a top prospect for the Flames who scored almost a ppg in the AHL at 21 last year. (The year after Andersson posted 13 points in the Allsvenskan, he went to the OHL and scored a ppg. As a point of comparison, that's a higher rate than Day just scored at in his overage year).

Ragnarsson played solid defense against pros at 18 and profiles well in that regard too.

I don't think we have any prospects remaining who profile comparably to guys that turned into top caliber NHL players the way that Ragnarsson does. There's a reason he's one of the highest drafted players remaining on this list. Even if there is more risk to Ragnarsson making the NHL than a guy like Meskanen, I'll take the chance on a guy who has a higher likelihood of becoming more than a bottom line player.

Add Pajuniemi. If he was born 4 days later, I think he would have been compared to Kotkaniemi and Kupari in this draft.
 

The Crypto Guy

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Jun 26, 2017
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Meskanen will be 23 right about the start of the season, Virta will be 23 near the end of it.

In terms of last year, one of them at times played on the first line and later played on lower lines as he was playing for a really good, deep team with former NHL players (Virta), while the other was a PP specialist for his team (9 goals on the PP), a team that was not deep and missed the playoffs. In terms of who had a more impressive year, it's kind of a toss up. Virta was definitely asked to be a more well-rounded player by his team.

As far as prospect camp, that's just a glorified series of scrimmages.

I don't really care if people want to vote Meskanen ahead of Virta, but I can't imagine any circumstance where there's a chasm between them.

Yes, but one is coming to north America in hopes to get closer to the NHL and to play in our system, one is signing a contract for who knows how long in Russia. When is he going to make is NA debut? 24-25 years old..if at all? I wouldn't put him anywhere near my top 20 at the moment.

Yes prospect camp are scrimmages, but that is still something i can use since nobody here watches any of these players enough to give a good report on them.
 

GeorgeKaplan

Registered User
Dec 19, 2011
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Ragnarsson. I don't think it's broadly appreciated how impressive his performance in the Allsvenskan was.

First of all, the Allsvenskan is a legit pro league. Rob Vollman has found that the Allsvenskan is comparable to the AHL in terms of how tough it is to score in (Re-approaching the methodology of NHLe).

Secondly, Ragnarsson's 13 points is the most by any U19 defenseman in the Allsvenskan other than OEL and is tied with Mattias Ekholm and Rasmus Andersson. OEL and Ekholm are two of the best defensemen in the NHL today. Andersson is now a top prospect for the Flames who scored almost a ppg in the AHL at 21 last year. (The year after Andersson posted 13 points in the Allsvenskan, he went to the OHL and scored a ppg. As a point of comparison, that's a higher rate than Day just scored at in his overage year).

Ragnarsson played solid defense against pros at 18 and profiles well in that regard too.

I don't think we have any prospects remaining who profile comparably to guys that turned into top caliber NHL players the way that Ragnarsson does. There's a reason he's one of the highest drafted players remaining on this list. Even if there is more risk to Ragnarsson making the NHL than a guy like Meskanen, I'll take the chance on a guy who has a higher likelihood of becoming more than a bottom line player.

Add Pajuniemi. If he was born 4 days later, I think he would have been compared to Kotkaniemi and Kupari in this draft.
I’m just nitpicking here, but that wasn’t Day’s overage season last year
 

nyr2k2

Can't Beat Him
Jul 30, 2005
45,660
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Maryland
Yes, but one is coming to north America in hopes to get closer to the NHL and to play in our system, one is signing a contract for who knows how long in Russia. When is he going to make is NA debut? 24-25 years old..if at all? I wouldn't put him anywhere near my top 20 at the moment.

Yes prospect camp are scrimmages, but that is still something i can use since nobody here watches any of these players enough to give a good report on them.
There were reports on Meskanen when he signed from some of our posters and other posters as well. I provided reports that I found on Virta throughout the year as well as from the Champions League. There were other reports as well. Even just a couple in-game report or overall progress report should be worth ten times what you glean from a prospect camp scrimmage.

As far as the North America thing--Virta opted out of his Liiga deal to play in the KHL because his deal had a clause allowing him to do so. It didn't allow him to opt out to play here. So, he made what's probably a good choice for his development and is jumping to the KHL instead of staying in Finland. Seems wise.

I mean we have no guarantee that someone like Rykov will come over. We have no guarantee that any of the overseas guys will come over. Do we have any reason to doubt Virta will come over? Not at this time. He's just one of a bunch of "when will he come over?" guys we have. I don't think uncertainty over when a guy will come should make him less valuable.
 

The Crypto Guy

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Jun 26, 2017
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There were reports on Meskanen when he signed from some of our posters and other posters as well. I provided reports that I found on Virta throughout the year as well as from the Champions League. There were other reports as well.

As far as the North America thing--Virta opted out of his Liiga deal to play in the KHL because his deal had a clause allowing him to do so. It didn't allow him to opt out to play here. So, he made what's probably a good choice for his development and is jumping to the KHL instead of staying in Finland. Seems wise.

I mean we have no guarantee that someone like Rykov will come over. We have no guarantee that any of the overseas guys will come over. Do we have any reason to doubt Virta will come over? Not at this time. He's just one of a bunch of "when will he come over?" guys we have. I don't think uncertainty over when a guy will come should make him less valuable.

Yes so we are just going on reports. Just like I went on a report of how he played well and was one of the standouts at the Prospect Week.

Whatever the reason is, one is coming to NA, one isn't. They will both be 23 years old. Rykov just turned 21 and this will likely be his final season in the KHL. When he is 23 and if he still hasn't come over then sure, I will be dropping him from the top 20 as well.

Truth be told, it's unlikely either player is going to carve out an NHL career, but i'm going with the guy who has the better shot at this moment..
 

The Crypto Guy

Registered User
Jun 26, 2017
26,065
32,812
Ragnarsson. I don't think it's broadly appreciated how impressive his performance in the Allsvenskan was.

First of all, the Allsvenskan is a legit pro league. Rob Vollman has found that the Allsvenskan is comparable to the AHL in terms of how tough it is to score in (Re-approaching the methodology of NHLe).



Add Pajuniemi. If he was born 4 days later, I think he would have been compared to Kotkaniemi and Kupari in this draft.

You're telling me you think he is a future 1st liner?
 

nyr2k2

Can't Beat Him
Jul 30, 2005
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Maryland
Yes so we are just going on reports. Just like I went on a report of how he played well and was one of the standouts at the Prospect Week.

Whatever the reason is, one is coming to NA, one isn't. They will both be 23 years old. Rykov just turned 21 and this will likely be his final season in the KHL. When he is 23 and if he still hasn't come over then sure, I will be dropping him from the top 20 as well.

Truth be told, it's unlikely either player is going to carve out an NHL career, but i'm going with the guy who has the better shot at this moment..
...right, but again, I'm telling you there are plenty of good reports from reputable places about how they played this year, including from me. In actual games. You want to use a report from what equates to a pickup basketball game. If you value those the same, okay.

I just think they're really close in terms of their value and will rank them as such. To me, uncertainty over when a kid will come over doesn't make him a lesser prospect. But, that's just me. I'll leave it there.
 

nyr2k2

Can't Beat Him
Jul 30, 2005
45,660
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Maryland
He's still a prospect so Nieves should be on there. Most of the remaining guys won't have the career that Nieves already has.
 

The Crypto Guy

Registered User
Jun 26, 2017
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...right, but again, I'm telling you there are plenty of good reports from reputable places about how they played this year, including from me. In actual games. You want to use a report from what equates to a pickup basketball game. If you value those the same, okay.

I just think they're really close in terms of their value and will rank them as such. To me, uncertainty over when a kid will come over doesn't make him a lesser prospect. But, that's just me. I'll leave it there.
I mean, a major criteria people use is likelihood to make the NHL, sorry but one of the 2 players isnt exactly screaming with confidence of that, has nothing to do with making him any lesser of a prospect, but others will be ranked ahead of him. One also has an NHL contract, one doesnt. This shouldnt be much of a suprise.
 

kovazub94

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Aug 5, 2010
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I don’t get the love fest AT THIS POINT IN RANKING with Virta, Meskanen and Lindqvist. They are kind of in between two extremes: those older prospects but closer to their NHL potential (Gilmour, Nieves) or younger, further away (Day, Barron, Gettinger). The other thing is two of these Scandinavians already being voted in while one is still not even a choice. Very likely they all struggle just like Stramwall (sp) when they will be tested at the AHL. But this is just me.

Barron. Gilmour.
 
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nyr2k2

Can't Beat Him
Jul 30, 2005
45,660
32,732
Maryland
I mean, a major criteria people use is likelihood to make the NHL, sorry but one of the 2 players isnt exactly screaming with confidence of that, has nothing to do with making him any lesser of a prospect, but others will be ranked ahead of him. One also has an NHL contract, one doesnt. This shouldnt be much of a suprise.
I just don't subscribe to the idea that their respective contract statuses make either more or less likely to make it. If it was reported that Virta is unlikely to come play, or he signs a three year deal in Russia, sure, I'll change my tune. Until then it's a case of a guy who is basically a "season older" also being a year ahead in terms of getting to NA.

"Likelihood of making the NHL" to me means likelihood of making the NHL based on level of ability. Not uncertain contract status.

Seriously though, I don't care about this anymore. Everyone can use whatever wacky criteria they'd like. You can have the last word here.
 
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pblawr

Registered User
Jul 16, 2016
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You're telling me you think he is a future 1st liner?

No. I think that's unlikely.

What I meant in saying that Pajuniemi would have been compared to Kotkaniemi and Kupari is that he would have been in the discussion with them about the best Finnish prospects coming out the Liiga this year. I think Kotkaniemi and Kupari would have been ranked ahead of Pajuniemi, but I think Pajuniemi would have been brought up in the discussion. Here are their scoring rates in the Liiga last year:

Kotkaniemi - 0.47 ppg
Kupari - 0.31 ppg
Pajuniemi - 0.27 ppg

Particularly compared to Kupari, Pajuniemi isn't that far behind. Kupari is probably a more skilled player, but Pajuniemi is a very good skater who made some professional hockey players look foolish a couple times last year. It's not like he lacks skill.

I think Pajuniemi gets dismissed a little bit because he was in his second year of draft eligibility, but he only qualified for the 2017 draft by 4 days. It seems arbitrary to me. He's only 4 days older than Brady Tkachuk. That could just have been one doctor deciding to do a c-section and another deciding to wait. It's entirely possible possible that Tkachuk was conceived before him. The date of conception would probably be a better benchmark for someone's physical development than their birth date. It just doesn't entirely make sense to me to act like there's this big bright line separating prospects who were eligible for different drafts because of as little as 4 days.

Pajuniemi is only 6 months older than Kupari and put up basically the same numbers in the same league. Does that make Pajuniemi a worse prospect than Kupari? Probably a little bit, but only a little bit. Does Kupari have more skill and higher upside? I think so. But I don't think they are in an entirely different class of prospect just because Pajuniemi was born 4 days ahead of some arbitrary cut off date.
 

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