Question about JML...

[Mess]

Hi all.

Flames fan here, hoping to get some info on John Michael-Liles.

With our captain and #1 D man down for a stretch, there is talk on some Flames boards about acquiring a replacement. One if the names kicked around is Liles.

Some have strong opinions on his game, I'm curious about the Leafs fans perspective?

Is he caught in a numbers game? Has his game fallen off a cliff? Is he a decent defenceman on a lousy contract? I haven't seen him play since he was with the Avs, where he was a top pairing guy with decent offensive chops. What's changed? Any insight would be appreciated.

Bad contract, but the good news is the GM that gave him that contract is now working in your organization.

Leafs should have bought him out last summer, but had too many other players to buyout instead with higher priority to get rid of bad contracts.

Flames organization could have him for future considerations ie. free but that is still too high an asking price for the Leafs.

 

[Punch Drunk Loov]

Good player, but you'd be doing us a favour taking him

 

[AlienWorkShop]

People strongly overstate the dropoff of his play after the concussion.

I'm not so sure that they do considering just how good Liles was playing before that concussion.

In 2011-12, he had 21 points in the 34 games before his concussion and he was actually performing at the level of a legit top pairing defenceman. He had 6 in the 32 games after his return and while he did show he's still a legit NHL defenceman capable of at least third-pairing minutes, he's a long way from two years ago.

At 32 you also have to figure age is starting to be a factor.

I think he would be a great addition to a rebuilding team like the Flames looking for a veteran to fill 18-20 minutes, but it's simply a matter of taking on that contract for that long, as the cap hit starts to look bad when you're trying to squeeze a playoff team under the cap.

 

[Confucius]

He's not one of our top 7 D and was cut. He wasn't really sent down for cap reasons as others on here have said. If he beat out Ranger (for example), they could keep JML and send down Ranger and there'd be no difference on the cap.

That said, he's still NHL caliber, we just have better options with more upside to fill his specific role.

How can you say that? At the start of the year we were right up against the cap all we had was 2 million to offer Franson. Ranger makes 1 million, Liles makes 3.8. It was impossible for us to keep him. Even if we sent Ranger back to the A we would have been 2.8 million over the cap.

 

[MuchoMacho]

How can you say that? At the start of the year we were right up against the cap all we had was 2 million to offer Franson. Ranger makes 1 million, Liles makes 3.8. It was impossible for us to keep him. Even if we sent Ranger back to the A we would have been 2.8 million over the cap.

The way the new CBA works, you can't bury players in the AHL. You can only bury 900k or so of their cap hit, so any player over 900k (or so) only provides 900k (or so) in cap relief. Both Ranger and Liles are over 900k (or so) and so either of them being in the minors provides the same cap relief.

 

[Confucius]

The way the new CBA works, you can't bury players in the AHL. You can only bury 900k or so of their cap hit, so any player over 900k (or so) only provides 900k (or so) in cap relief. Both Ranger and Liles are over 900k (or so) and so either of them being in the minors provides the same cap relief.

Oooops, thanks for the lesson

 

[Leafidelity]

No doubt in my mind he'll be a serviceable defenseman to the next team he goes to.

 

[ITM]

He should be playing over Ranger.

Absolutely.

 

[dfunk]

I really thought that when they called him up before heading out west on the road it was to play him against Calgary to show what he could do. Guess i was wrong

 

[Beleafer4]

not a horrible player, but horrible contact. I wouldn't pick him up if I were the Flames

I would. Its not like the flames are gonna contend any time soon, who cares about the contract.

4-5 defenseman. Safe, good offense, not a lot of grit. Maybe with a bigger role he will excel on your team.

The reason he isnt playing is bc of numbers. Rielly gardiner franson and phaneuf have the offense and puck movement down pat. Theyre also either younger or better or have higher potentials.

The reason he hasnt been picked up is because of his contract. Thats a huge factor. Think about it, the nucks couldnt trade their elite tender bc of the contract... Its a big deal for gms. I would be willing to take off 40% off. For 2-2.5 mil liles is a good deal.

 

[Canada4Gold]

He's a capable NHL defenseman, possibly top 4. He's just really redundant here with our load of puck moving offensive defensemen.

His contract while it's more than it should be under the current cap it's not downright awful. Because he's been pushed out of the lineup however he has negative value to us, not sure his value would be negative to everyone though.

I most certainly would not give up an asset for him if I were you, you could have had him for nothing last month when he was on waivers and probably still could.

If you did acquire him I really could see him turning it around. All he needs is the oppurtunity to play imo.

You have a stud #1C prospect over there that we'd give him to you for. Just give us....Joe Colbourne and you can have him

 

[Rockmorton]

Thanks everyone! Sounds like he'd be a decent pickup. With Giordano out, our top 6 is pretty scary:

Wideman, Brodie, Russell, Butler, O'Brien and Derek Smith

I know the Flames aren't going to be contenders for a few years, but I'd like us to be at least competitive.

Say...you guys wouldn't want to have a do-over on the Stajan/Phanuef deal would ya?