Quebec still in discussions.

[Fatass]

Right, women are only 52% of the potential customer base, why would the NHL care about that demographic? 35% of women don't even manage the budget of their own households; Their spending decisions are meaningless to the NHL!

I agree to a point. Of those 52%, how many are sport’s fans? How many women drag their significant others out to hockey games? Sure, the NHL should encourage women to be both players and fans, but men drive sports viewing.

 

[KevFu]

I agree to a point. Of those 52%, how many are sport’s fans? How many women drag their significant others out to hockey games? Sure, the NHL should encourage women to be both players and fans, but men drive sports viewing.

The key stat wasn't actually the 52% of population, it's the second stat (although I wrote it as the inverse to be cheeky).

65% of women control the finances of their households. So you're not trying to get the wife to DRAG her husband and the kids to a hockey game...

You're trying to get mom to work hockey into the family budget and your chances are much greater if she's a fan, too.

You're trying to get NHL games on the family TV and not just in a man cave; you're trying to get Christmas and birthday shopping done on nhl.com, etc.

 

[Fatass]

The key stat wasn't actually the 52% of population, it's the second stat (although I wrote it as the inverse to be cheeky).

65% of women control the finances of their households. So you're not trying to get the wife to DRAG her husband and the kids to a hockey game...

You're trying to get mom to work hockey into the family budget and your chances are much greater if she's a fan, too.

You're trying to get NHL games on the family TV and not just in a man cave; you're trying to get Christmas and birthday shopping done on nhl.com, etc.

Good point, but women don’t really tend to put being a sport’s fan as a priority like men do. Although in Quebec there will be way more women hockey fans than Arizona. So if the Coyotes do move to Quebec, the league will have more female fans there for sure.

 

[Headshot77]

I agree because I don't think we have any markets really worth giving up on. The Coyotes have been a nightmare, but nothing a new arena in a centralized location couldn't fix. If anyone relocated, I would think Florida to Atlanta (or long-shot legacy shopping: Hartford). You don't need teams in Miami, Phoenix, Dallas, or hypothetically Houston being top 10 in revenue, winning 75% of Cups, selling out every night. You just need them as teams in the league that function like other healthy teams in the league: Good years, down years, win a Cup every 30 years or so. Basically what Dallas has been.

I think that at certain times in NHL history, many teams have been 'worth giving up on', but eventually rebounded. For many years when the Islanders had that horrible lease and were the 30th in NHL attendance despite playing in NYC, I thought that they were a PRIME relocation candidate. There really isn't a need to have three teams in the greater New York area and there is no WHA to compete with anymore. But they have stabilized, they have a new arena coming soon and their team is looking great; they aren't going anywhere.

Likewise, there isn't really a need to have two teams in Florida. In the early 90's it seemed like the Panthers were the more stable and up-and-coming Florida franchise while Tampa was (rumored to be) owned by the Yakuza and floundering. They are only about 250 miles from one another. Now that Tampa is a consistent cup contender and the Panthers have mired in mediocrity for 30-ish years, it would likely be the Panthers that would be relocation fodder. They are a franchise that if they were removed, wouldn't completely alienate an entire fanbase as NHL hockey would still be nearby.

The success of Hockey in Las Vegas would help to alleviate the pain of an Arizona relocation. The NHL can still have their hockey in the desert, alienated Coyotes fans would have a nearby franchise that they could still support.

But I think this line of thinking is why a Quebec relocation is very unlikely. Moving a fledgling franchise to Montreal doesn't really expand hockey's footprint, but would just take fans away from Montreal/Colorado. Now, I think a Quebec franchise would hold it's own and be perfectly fine in the NHL, like the Jets. But I can see why the NHL is hesitant to have Quebec be anything except an eastern conference emergency landing spot for a team.

Arizona to Houston however, that absolutely should happen.

 

[Bondurant]

But I think this line of thinking is why a Quebec relocation is very unlikely. Moving a fledgling franchise to Montreal doesn't really expand hockey's footprint, but would just take fans away from Montreal/Colorado. Now, I think a Quebec franchise would hold it's own and be perfectly fine in the NHL, like the Jets. But I can see why the NHL is hesitant to have Quebec be anything except an eastern conference emergency landing spot for a team.

I would wager taking away fans from Colorado is not on anyone's list of reasons not to return hockey to QC. Including Colorado.

 

[KevFu]

I think that at certain times in NHL history, many teams have been 'worth giving up on', but eventually rebounded. For many years when the Islanders had that horrible lease and were the 30th in NHL attendance despite playing in NYC, I thought that they were a PRIME relocation candidate. There really isn't a need to have three teams in the greater New York area and there is no WHA to compete with anymore. But they have stabilized, they have a new arena coming soon and their team is looking great; they aren't going anywhere.

Likewise, there isn't really a need to have two teams in Florida.
They are a franchise that if they were removed, wouldn't completely alienate an entire fanbase as NHL hockey would still be nearby.

The success of Hockey in Las Vegas would help to alleviate the pain of an Arizona relocation. The NHL can still have their hockey in the desert, alienated Coyotes fans would have a nearby franchise that they could still support.

You're spot on with the Islanders thing, but I think you rode it off the rails on the later points about "losing a team in the state/region doesn't alienate anyone." It most certainly does alienate people, and it's not a thing you can actually project. The idea that "if the Panthers/Coyotes move, all their fans would become Tampa/Vegas fans" is just bonkers.

You expect someone from St. Louis is a Cardinals and Blues fan... But NBA? there's no "wrong" answer there. NFL there's no wrong answer either. If they're 40, they might like the Bulls because they were on TV and had Jordan. Or maybe they hated Chicago in all the other sports, so they picked OKC when the Thunder arrived. Or maybe Memphis because Cardinals had the baby birds there in Triple A baseball. But then you get to NFL and their team just LEFT THEM. It's an "all bets are off" situation. Maybe they stuck with the Cardinals when they moved to Arizona? Maybe they are going to follow the Rams in Los Angeles? Maybe they pick a new team? You would have a very fractured fan base of how they handled the situation.

 

[Headshot77]

You're spot on with the Islanders thing, but I think you rode it off the rails on the later points about "losing a team in the state/region doesn't alienate anyone." It most certainly does alienate people, and it's not a thing you can actually project. The idea that "if the Panthers/Coyotes move, all their fans would become Tampa/Vegas fans" is just bonkers.

You expect someone from St. Louis is a Cardinals and Blues fan... But NBA? there's no "wrong" answer there. NFL there's no wrong answer either. If they're 40, they might like the Bulls because they were on TV and had Jordan. Or maybe they hated Chicago in all the other sports, so they picked OKC when the Thunder arrived. Or maybe Memphis because Cardinals had the baby birds there in Triple A baseball. But then you get to NFL and their team just LEFT THEM. It's an "all bets are off" situation. Maybe they stuck with the Cardinals when they moved to Arizona? Maybe they are going to follow the Rams in Los Angeles? Maybe they pick a new team? You would have a very fractured fan base of how they handled the situation.

Of course it would alienate fans to have their team ripped away. I wasn't implying that every single Isles fan would jump to the Rangers or Devils. I was just saying that theoretically those are hockey markets that had alternatives that are accessible. A person in Miami could theoretically become a Bolts fan, if the games are available to watch, and go to a game every now and then. A person in Arizona can become a Knights fan, if the games are available to watch, and go to a game every now and then. They are cities where the NHL can serve them with a nearby product. It would still alienate fans though. I guess my word choice was poor.

 

[BKIslandersFan]

A person in Miami could theoretically become a Bolts fan, if the games are available to watch, and go to a game every now and then.

Do you know how far Miami/Ft.Lauderdale is from Tampa?

 

[Headshot77]

Do you know how far Miami/Ft.Lauderdale is from Tampa?

About 250 miles. Again, I'm not saying those people would get season tickets. But if the television rights can broadcast Bolts games in Miami, you'd make some fans because 250 miles would be a lot closer than the 1000+ miles the nearest team would be (I'm guessing Nashville)

 

[KevFu]

Of course it would alienate fans to have their team ripped away. I wasn't implying that every single Isles fan would jump to the Rangers or Devils. I was just saying that theoretically those are hockey markets that had alternatives that are accessible. A person in Miami could theoretically become a Bolts fan, if the games are available to watch, and go to a game every now and then. A person in Arizona can become a Knights fan, if the games are available to watch, and go to a game every now and then. They are cities where the NHL can serve them with a nearby product. It would still alienate fans though. I guess my word choice was poor.

Oh, yeah, I followed you. Without the Islanders/Devils most the NEW FANS in the market that are created would probably end up as Rangers fans. I think the time element would steer things in that direction.

EVENTUALLY, would the NHL fans in Miami be Tampa fans? Probably. But

(A) that's going to take a couple generations
(b) the NHL is far less likely to create new fans in that market
(c) the NHL would be losing lots of the former Panthers fans who may not follow the league at all if their team was ripped away.

There's really no situation in which a team leaving a market is a good thing. It's always going to have negative consequences for the league compared to an alternative. Sure the new market might create more fans than the old market, but just expanding to the new market would create the same amount of fans while losing none.

 

[TheLegend]

Good point, but women don’t really tend to put being a sport’s fan as a priority like men do. Although in Quebec there will be way more women hockey fans than Arizona. So if the Coyotes do move to Quebec, the league will have more female fans there for sure.

I’m always amazed how people know so much information about cities they don’t even live in.

 

[Pandemonia]

I’m always amazed how people know so much information about cities they don’t even live in.

It's called the internet. U find stuff on it.

 

[TheLegend]

It's called the internet. U find stuff on it.

But the stuff you find isn't always accurate.

 

[branch]

As someone that lives in Quebec, I can't imagine Bill 101 being too attractive of an environment for the NHL as an American corporation to conduct an Anglophone business in.

 

[Pandemonia]

But the stuff you find isn't always accurate.

U check several sources. When most of them match, you discard the wrong ones, trust the rest. Not that hard.

 

[Pandemonia]

As someone that lives in Quebec, I can't imagine Bill 101 being too attractive of an environment for the NHL as an American corporation to conduct an Anglophone business in.

Whats the bill for, please?

 

[branch]

Whats the bill for, please?

Charter of the French Language - Wikipedia

It has its roots in good intentions and I totally get it, but it left the door open for a lot of interpretation.

 

[Laveuglette]

As someone that lives in Quebec, I can't imagine Bill 101 being too attractive of an environment for the NHL as an American corporation to conduct an Anglophone business in.

Montréal Canadiens are doing well, and Bill 101 is also applicable in Mtl. Also Bill 101 existed when the Nordiques existed the whole time. It's been here for over 40 years and we're doing fine. It even improved our standards of living despite all the BS anglos were saying about it in the 70s. And before that there was the same story with Bill 63. We've heard that crap for 40+ years, please stop bringing our linguistic situation against us. This has been debunked 1000000000000000 times. Bill 101 has no impact on hockey. PKP (CEO of Quebecor), who would likely be the owner of the Nordiques should they come back, 100% approves that law by the way. Government is currently talking about reinforcing it by the way, not the other way around.

 

[Pandemonia]

Charter of the French Language - Wikipedia

It has its roots in good intentions and I totally get it, but it left the door open for a lot of interpretation.

Much obliged! Something short and to the point for a change.

 

[branch]

Montréal Canadiens are doing well, and Bill 101 is also applicable in Mtl. Also Bill 101 existed when the Nordiques existed the whole time. It's been here for over 40 years and we're doing fine. It even improved our standards of living despite all the BS anglos were saying about it in the 70s. And before that there was the same story with Bill 63. We've heard that crap for 40+ years, please stop bringing our linguistic situation against us. This has been debunked 1000000000000000 times. Bill 101 has no impact on hockey. PKP (CEO of Quebecor), who would likely be the owner of the Nordiques should they come back, 100% approves that law by the way. Government is currently talking about reinforcing it by the way, not the other way around.

To compare Quebec City and Montreal in the context of Bill 101 is not very useful. All I'm saying is that the presence of bill 101 is definitely not a net positive for an Anglo business. I speak French, live in Quebec, and have French heritage so you don't need to extoll the virtues of the law to me it's very apparent and it's very off topic to do so.

 

[Laveuglette]

To compare Quebec City and Montreal in the context of Bill 101 is not very useful. All I'm saying is that the presence of bill 101 is definitely not a net positive for an Anglo business. I speak French, live in Quebec, and have French heritage so you don't need to extoll the virtues of the law to me it's very apparent and it's very off topic to do so.

Well your point makes no sense at all in the context of bringing back the Nordiques. The businesses around that project are well established in Québec and Québécor Media has more market power and partners than you can imagine. And yes, it's absolutely the same in Montréal or Québec. Bill 101 has absolutely no impact on this.

 

[TheLegend]

U check several sources. When most of them match, you discard the wrong ones, trust the rest. Not that hard.

You'll find many posters on HF use a different method.

 

[Pandemonia]

You'll find many posters on HF use a different method.

LOL, you got that right.

 

[mouser]

With respect to Quebec's chances....

It seems very clear that, excepting some sort of crisis situation, NHL has no need for Quebec in the league. I think that much could be readily agreed on by most here.

The question is: What kind of a crisis could move NHL to open itself to the possibility of Quebec coming in?

I think that history is a good indicator that, regardless of what happens in Phoenix, the Yotes are NOT going to Quebec. There were plenty of times when that could have happened, perhaps most clear when COG cancelled IA's lease.

Would pandemic-induced financial issues for Florida do it? I don't know, but I do know that Broward County has them under lease through 2023, if Broward County continues to want them. I can't see the pandemic immediately changing that. There is nothing else to do with the property on which BBT Center sits that would make it better for Broward right now. However, the pandemic surely is affecting Viola. So, perhaps the end result is that the long term effects of the pandemic are such that a move becomes more likely.

If so, where does the franchise move? I don't know of a better place in the ETZ than Quebec. In fact, I don't know of a better spot in North America. Unless, someone with Atlanta ties sees a way to go back there. I feel that to be very unlikely. But, perhaps NOT impossible. And, if that were an option, NHL would go there before QC for sure.

If for some reason any ETZ team had to relocate I highly doubt placing said team in another ETZ city would be towards the top of the NHL’s priority list. If a relocation subsequently required another team to move from Central to Eastern to balance conferences I suspect the league would easily find a willing candidate. Nashville the most likely, but not only team that could be interested. The league could also take time before deciding on a realignment as we saw with Winnipeg.

 

[crobro]

If hockey continues as a covid consequence bubble sport ie: based on local Tv Ratings Wuebec should definately be the front runner for a relocation team. If for example Florida or Phoenix go deep into the red without paying fans to balance things out Quebec is the best choice followed by either Saskatoon or Halifax