[QUARTER FINALS] Super Team Tournament Voting

This thread will be used to vote and debate on match-ups for the Quarter Finals. Match-ups are as follows;

MATCH-UP#1

Toronto - @hockeynorth
vs
Colorado - @m0pe


Svechnikov - Malkin - Rust
Gaudreau - Karlsson - Bjorkstrand
Parise - Hischier - Hornqvist
Mangiapane - Henrique - D. Brown

Josi - McAvoy
Theodore - Fox
Dunn - Johnson

Hellebuyck
Crawford

vs



Schwartz - Bergeron - Stone
Zucker - Couturier - Gallagher
Hyman - Danault - Coleman
Bonino - Backlund - Nichsuhkin

Giordano - Pesce
Lindholm - Marino
Pelech - Hamonic

Price
Blackwood

_______________________________________________

MATCH-UP #2

Boston - @FanofBadHockeyTeam
vs
Los Angeles - @Makaveli


Saad - Matthews - W. Nylander
E. Kane - Couture - Tarasenko
Van Riemsdyk - Krejci - Zadina
Haula - Suzuki - Zuccarello

Ekman Larsson - Jones
Fowler - Letang
Vlasic - Faulk

Bobrovsky
Grubauer


vs



B. Tkachuk - Eichel - Pastrňák
Guentzel - Giroux - Fiala
Olofsson - Nugent-Hopkins - Buchnevich
McCann - Eller - Dzingel

McDonagh - Makar
Muzzin - Trouba
Orlov - Shattenkirk

Andersen
Koskinen

_______________________________________________


MATCH-UP #3
Dallas - @LatvianTwist
vs
Columbus - @Blinny


Connor - Seguin - Panarin
Vrana - Hertl - Keller
Kubalik - Cirelli - Gurianov
Pearson - Hayes - Nyquist

Slavin - Dahlin
Lindell - Pulock
Toews - Andersson

Gibson
Varlamov


vs



Laine-Barkov-Voracek
Huberdeau-Monahan-Hoffman
Debrusk-Trochek-Lindholm
Palat-Jenner-Jarnkrok

Brodin-Pietrangelo
Krug-Carlo
Goligoski-Brodie

Bishop
Korpisalo

_______________________________________________

MATCH UP #4

Vegas - @AveryStar4Eva
vs
Vancouver - @Retinalz


Ehlers - Scheifele - R Smith
Kreider - O'Rielly - Pavelski
Bertuzzi - Duchene - Josh Bailey
Beauvillier - Coyle - C Smith

Hedman - S. Weber
Schmidt - Niskanen
Skjei - Manson

Vasilevskiy
Khudobin


vs



Teravainen - MacKinnon - Meier
DeBrincat - J.T. Miller - Reinhart
Duclair - R Strome - Garland
Iaffalo - Hughes - Virtanen

Hughes - Doughty
Edler - DeAngelo
Chariot - Tanev

Binnington
Markstrom
​

 

vs
Why Toronto should win this:

• Elite offensive weapons all throughout lineup
• High end blue line filled with Norris calibre, or near Norris calibre defensemen
• Elite goaltending tandem
• His shut down players can’t check 3 deep lines, and even then my fourth line can either score or be thrown out to counter any offence he tries

My breakdown:
Line 1 vs Line 1: Everyone knows Malkin is one of the most unstoppable players in the NHL when he’s on, and in the playoffs he’s a pure beast. Top this off with one of the most dynamic, yet gritty players in the NHL in Svechnikov and Rust who broke out this year going above a point per game, their shut down players will just have to exert everything they have trying to stop this freight train of a line barreling down on them offensively. Goals win hockey games, and this line shouldn’t struggle even a little bit to win this goal battle. This is an elite offensive line in 2020, against a high end shut down line, ultimately it’d be a chess match watching for the first flinch but Torontos top line just has so much offensive potential + chemistry they’d win this matchup handily in a 7 game series. Favour: Colorado

Line 2 vs line 2: You may not realize it but Bjorkstrand had a Gallagher-esque season this season numbers wise, and really broke out as an elite trigger man. Pair this with Wild Bill down the middle and Jonny Hockey (who still is an elite player) dishing the puck and this line will dominate possession battles. You can’t score without the puck, and regardless of how good Couts is, his defending won’t matter against a line designed to cycle you into the ice. “Karlsson has the puck, passes it to Gaudreau OH MY GOD WHAT A PASS Bjorkstrand SCORESSSS” you’d be hearing this often this series in this matchup, with three elite offensive players (which also has 2 elite 2 way players) going against a couple of solid defensive guys again. Simply put Colorado would get hemmed in and really struggle to score head to head in this matchup. Favour: Toronto

Line 3 vs Line 3: This is where you see the separation, remember Colorado wanted Parise for their top 6. Zach Parise has had a career renaissance playing at near point per game paces, with Hornqvist playing his usual heavy style going for around 50 and Hischier blossoming into a great 2 way player and great offensive weapon himself. The premise here would be for the line to play well positioned hockey until Hornqvist can crash the net and Hischier/Parise can play a dynamic offensive game until Parise unleashes a big goal. This is going against Hyman who while being heavy on the boards isn’t near the calibre of Parise, Danault who’s essentially on par with Hischier but less dynamic and *checks notes… Blake Coleman?*… you can call this a shut down line but Coleman got shelled this year and had horrid possession numbers. As you trudge further down the lineup you really see the edge shifting towards Toronto, with he ability to roll elite players throughout their whole lineup, players who both had great years this year, and/or great numbers throughout their careers. And wether you like the fancy stats or normal ones, Toronto comes ahead. Favour: Toronto

Line 4 vs Line 4: This is pretty close, two heavier lines going head to head, though I feel Mangiapane’s speed is the biggest game breaker here. And don’t forget Henrique put up good numbers in Anaheim this year, same for Brown in LA, two bad teams, as opposed to all on great teams like Colorado. My shut down group can score and defend, and I think that’s the biggest difference here, they won’t simply minute eat. Favour: neutral

D1 vs D1: Last years Norris winner vs this years Norris favourite… Colorado’s top pair is decent but Toronto’s can unleash the offence while dominating puck possession and being at both ends of the ice. I don’t think you can really argue this pair being better as Pesce is a second pair D while McAvoy is a likely Norris winner down the line, and Josi just dominated this year on a sub par Nashville squad. Torontos top pair reallyyy tilts the ice here and can control the puck like no other. Favour: Toronto

D2 vs D2: A tale of the young blue liners… I feel as though people don’t realize the season Shea Theodore had this year, being one of the most dominant NHL Men this year, and he should likely be in Norris contention, scoring big totals, having dominating fancy stats (really no one dominated like him in them) and logging huge minutes in Vegas, while having a wealth of playoff experience already, along with high scoring Adam Fox, who showed he’s already a bonafide NHL defensemen this season in New York. These two going against John Marino, another great rookie blue liner, but he had pretty weak possession numbers in comparison to Fox especially relative to the team. Lindholm lately really doesn’t compare to Theodore, pretty much at all, lower scoring, worse possession numbers, gets scored on a lot, the second pair is just extremely in favour of Toronto. Favour: Toronto

D3 vs D3: yeah yeah Erik Johnson can’t play hockey anymore I heard that argument…
Heres the stats for the dmen on the bottom pairs:
A: 0.32 ppg, +15, 50 hits, 55 corsi, 53.9 Fenwick, 27 pim, 16:16 TOI, 1.2 Pts/60
B: 0.24 ppg, -3, 39 hits, 49.3 corsi, 48 fenwick, 27 pim, 21:12 TOI, 0.7 pts/60
C: 0.27 ppg, +9, 97 hits, 51.2 corsi, 49.9 Fenwick, 20 pim, 21:03 TOI, 0.8 pts/60
D: 0.24 ppg, +4, 81 hits, 44.5 corsi, 45.1 Fenwick, 20 pim, 21:08 TOI, 0.7 pts/60
So in isolation which 2 D do you take? Personally A then C, then B then D… Reveal time:
A = Dunn
B = Hamonic
C = Johnson
D = Pelech
So by this argument if Johnson is done well Hamonic is extremely finished, which he really isn’t the same player he used to be anymore. For a defensive oriented pair they Hamonic + Pelech get completely shelled while Dunn and Johnson are both playing at a very high level. It’s really not even close which pair should win out here, Johnson is still playing really good possession based hockey while Dunn is amazing in St Louis and that’s very well known. Favour: Toronto

Goalies: Did you know Corey Crawford had a .917 SV% and 2.77 GAA this season and had one of the best GSAA… because he did, and he’s Torontos backup, because the MVP for his team this season and should be Vezina winner Hellebuyck is the starter. Toronto has an unreal tandem so any offence this supposed shut down team tries will have a really hard time scoring, whereas Colorado is starting a faltering Carey Price, who hasn’t had great numbers in a long time. And if you want to make the Price in the Playoffs argument, I think you really need to look into what Hellebuyck does for Winnipeg, he’s one of the best goalies in the NHL this year. The goalie matchup in this elite player competition is very much in favour of Toronto. Favour: Toronto

So in summary… Colorado is banking on shutting down Toronto’s unreal amount of elite offensive weapons all while also trying to out score them, even though Colorado loses the goalie matchup and blue line matchup quite easily right now, and Torontos depth (and offensive prowess) is also far greater than Colorados here, with Colorado having 3rd liners mostly in the bottom 6 against Torontos high scoring players mixed throughout. You’re also betting that Malkin doesn’t go playoff beast mode and just annihilates any hope for shutting him down, which he always does. Don’t forget Toronto can also mix and match lines to load up or spread the depth even more to cause problems. Colorado simply doesn’t have the depth to win. Wether you like the eye test, raw numbers, advanced stats or gut intuition, Toronto would beat Colorado in a 7 game series with these rosters.

Vote Toronto over Colorado for this matchup, it’s the obvious outcome.

 

Already have my argument ready.

Vote over

Line 1 - COL
- Malkin and Bergeron is a battle of 2 different top-5/10 C's. One gives you extra offense while one gives you extra defense, overall Malkin might be better but it is close. While Svech and Rust had great years, that aren't NEAR as established as Stone and Schwartz and I don't think a legtimate argument can be made here.

Line 2 - COL
- I love Karlsson. But Couturier is vastly superior on both sides of the ice. Gaudreau is the best winger here, but both Gallagher and Zucker are better than Bjorkstrand. This line is close, but scale tips towards the elite two-way C.

Line 3 - TOR
- While Hischier has more upside, right now him and Danault are both pretty even strong two-way 2Cs. Hyman and Coleman are hard workers, but they may not have quite the offensive upside of vets like Parise and Hornqvist. Bit of an edge to Toronto here I suppose.

Line 4 - COL
- Backlund produces similarly at C to Henrique while being a top defensive C. Bonino is a proven commodity at a great middle-6 two-way scorer that impacts the overall game more than Mangiapane. Brown may have revived his career, but so has Nichushkin as an elite defensive winger. It's close, but the experience and all around play gives this battle to Colorado.

Top Pair - TOR
- Gio won the Norris last year. Josi is a strong contender this year. We are talking about two top D here. Either way, it is close. I will easily admit McAvoy is greater than Pesce, although Pesce is no slouch either and probably better defensively.

Middle Pair - COL
- Fox may have produced more than Marino but it is solely due to playing more games and getting PP time. The ES PPG between these strong two-way rookies is almost identical. Theo vs Lindholm is 2 very different D. Lindholm has been a top pair defensive D for many years, while Theo has recently broken out into a top pair offensive D. Either way, it is close between these 2 minute munchers but edge goes to the more proven Lindholm.

Bottom Pair - COL
- Pelech-Hamonic is a pair of 20+ minute a night, strong defensive D. While Hamonic has fallen off some, he hasn't to the extent of Johnson who kinda sucks now. Dunn currently is a bottom pair offensive D playing 16 minutes a night with soft matchups. I know I would much rather have a rock like Pelech back here than him.

Goalies - TOR
- Look, Price isn't worth 10m...but he is still a top goalie in this league ESPECIALLY playing behind this good of a defense. That being said, Hellebuyck just had a hell of year so I will tip my hat here, but it is closer than some may say and likely a non-factor in a random 7 game series.

So sure, Toronto is a great team and has the better 3rd line, #2 D, and starting goalie by a bit, but the Avs two-way ability while still having lots of scoring will win them this series.

 

I will hear some others feelings on these matchups before voting right now, don't know if I want to give my thoughts on each just year

 

damn... i thought mine was long

 

I could give you line 1 though I think it's neutral or in my favour, but my 2nd line has 2 players better than your #2/3, and Bjork had a great year. Line 4 should also handily tip towards Toronto if we're basing it off right now or in the past, it's just deeper. I think the entirety of D is in Torontos favour though here, Colorado is just a tier below the top 3 teams. I have a feeling this will be a really even matchup though. Its important to remember its the best team this year, which should cleanly tip towards Toronto

 

Toronto and Colorado not playing around

 

I feel like we’ll see closer matchups in round 2. Every team is so damn good.

 

If Colorado manages to (I feel) upset and win this series I'm voting them right through to win, and I had them as about the 5th best team. I just think no team should be able to beat them as easily as Toronto, it's built to outplay a hard defensive team with their puck possession as opposed to some teams heavy run and gun or top heavy styles. I like the premise of the team but I had 3 teams that could out do them based off depth and Toronto is definitely in there

 

I haven’t voted yet, but its hard to ignore Colorado’s 2 way game.

 

I think the blueline and goalies tip this towards Toronto, their two way game is elite but I drafted some of the best puck possession players in the NHL, defending only goes so far

 

Outside of your #2 being better and my bottom pair being better the bluelines aren't much different.

Goaltending is unpredictable and could go either way over the course of a series.

 

Early results showing that @LatvianTwist is in store for another close match-up.

 

I really feel my second pair is really the part that's far ahead, Lindholm just did not have a good year and Fox was better than Marino on a worse team. Bottom pair analytically is way in Torontos favour but I can see the argument for it to be neutral or slightly your way. You should win the first line battle if Malkin isn't beast mode Malkin but the lower you go the more it tips.

Thats true, but that's why I'd take the guy that's better today. I think in general this is just a nasty matchup, the whole top portion of the bracket was just more violent than the bottom. It really depends what you bank on but I prefer the puck possession model to relying on the other team to make a mistake. like you said your guys have history of high level of play, my guys are elite right now

 

He's going to upset and go on a run man. I'd like to se some other peoples thoughts on matchups and then I'll put mine out there.

 

Okay glad you admitted I win 1st line battle.

2nd line Couts is clearly the best player. You talk so much about puck possession; well him and Gallagher are machines in that category. Zucker and Bjorkstrand are similar caliber but I would take Couts-Gallagher over Karlsson-Johnny soft Gaudreau in the playoffs any day of the weak. my top-6 is just straight better.

Marino faced more minutes and harder defensive matchups than Fox. Really, both are underrated rookie D with the main difference in stats being Fox getting PP time. Lindholm on a horrid team being compared to Theo on a great team is also really unfair. Lindholm has a history as a rock solid top pair D. Theo may have had a better year, but is he really any more valuable in a 7 games series where goals are hard to come by and defense is so key? I doubt it.

 

We'll I'm down now

 

VS

First off I wanna say good-luck to my opponent @FanofBadHockeyTeam. You put together a great team, mine is just a little better haha.

While Boston has a great first line, it still can not overcome the duo of Eichel-Pasta. Brady Tkachuk is the perfect fit for these two. Line 2 I’d say is pretty even, they pretty much cancel each other out. I think the 3rd line I take pretty easily but the 4th line is pretty much a wash. In my honest opinion I feel like both our teams defences are great and they match up pretty well. Goalie I would say is also a coin flip at this point. It comes down to my forward depth to tip the scales in my favour.

VOTE

 

Missed the part where I said if Malkin doesn't play beast mode Malkin hockey, which he always does. Malkin is virtually unstoppable when he's on and I gave him a point per game winger beside him and a dynamite winger in Svechnikov. All of my first line outperformed yours this season, but I can see the argument in your favour too, it's not all rose coloured glasses. Svechnikov had near identical numbers to Stone this year, on both ends of the ice. And Rust lit it up beside Malkin. I just understand your argument this time if my line faltered and didn't do what I expect

Bjorkstrand had a Gallagher year, and Gaudreau isn't needed to be the heavy player. Your top 6 is just straight better because I spread out my elite talent to have depth, if I loaded up:
Gaudreau-Malkin-Svechnikov
Parise-Karlsson-Rust
That top 6 flips instantly while still winning bottom 6 battle it'd just be closer.

Thats where you look at relative numbers, Fox blew away relative to NYR, same for Theodore, while Lindholm and Marino really didn't. Theodore can play elite defense, he had a Norris calibre year.

Colorado just cannot touch Torontos depth, and we opted to spread our talent as opposed to loading up. If we're voting for best team today, it has to be Toronto, their players simply outperformed Colorados this year. Goals win hockey games.

 

Toronto vs Colorado
This one is too close to call for me. I am still undecided on this one, but I think the 2 way play of Colorado could tip it in their favour. Colorado in 7

Dallas vs Columbus
Another close match up in my eyes. Both teams match up well. I’m leaning towards Dallas but I’m not 100% sure. Dallas in 7

Vegas vs Vancouver
Both great teams but I think Vegas takes this one pretty easily, not a good match up for the Canucks. Vegas in 5

Boston vs LA
LAs forward depth tips it in their favour for me. Kings top line will be hard to stop. Los Angeles in 6

 

Vote for Vegas. I feel we have the better two way game and are built for playoffs

 

Colorado vs Toronto

Colorado:

• best collection of shutdown or possession-driving forwards
• uninspiring defence
• Price

Toronto:

• good forward set
• very good defence
• Hellbuyck

​

 

Dallas vs Columbus

Dallas:

• rampant number of players playing on the wrong side or out of position
• decent crop of players tho

Columbus:

• top six properly configured and now disgustingly good
• fixed up defence
• just better all around

​

 

Keller is literally the only player out of position

 

Here's mine:
Toronto vs Colorado
I think the winner of this one could likely win the whole thing, two great teams going head to head but ultimately I feel like Torontos depth up front and on the blueline is what tips it Torontos way. Two teams that are just so good and I wish didn't have to match up, but I do take Toronto for the playoffs.
Toronto in 7 (so so close this one)

Boston vs LA
While I don't love LAs bottom 6 (I've made this known to you @Makaveli) or blueline (in comparison to others, it's damn good in its own right obviously) for me what tips this for me is that Bostons depth is not good enough to make up for the scoring prowess of LAs top line, I will vote that line through until they run into one of 2 teams I have that can dethrone them (if they even do) its just too good. Boston, add some support up front and you're through, I love your team.
LA in 6 (Bob and their blueline respectively likely steal 2 games)

Dallas vs Columbus
This ones pretty close to me, but I have Columbus among my top tier while Dallas is just below (for now, I keep tossing it up). I can easily see an upset happening however, and what I would say of this was the real NHL was that this is the matchup that gets Dallas their experience, so the next year they can come back battle hardened and take the cup. I can be swayed either way however as I love both.
Columbus in 7 (but its close man)

Vegas vs Vancouver
Like @Makaveli said this matchup doesn't benefit Vancouver, but it's mostly due to depth as I feel their stars are on par up front. To be honest @Retinalz I prefer this matchup for you than the last overall, because I feel like you win in more places just that ultimately your bottom of roster players are just a tad below. Make some trades at next years deadline, trade that first rounder for a star in the bottom six and you jump a tier. I've learnt to love your team, but I do have to take the Knights based on depth for this.
Vegas in 5