Post-Game Talk: PS #3 - 09/22/18 | RANGERS @ islanders | 7:00 - MSG

[GoAwayPanarin]

I don't think using the above teams was a poor argument at all. None of those teams were expected to do anyrhing just like the rangers. The Devils and Colorado did not make playoffs the previous year and were not expected to make it last year as well by any of the pundits. Colorado had the least points in the league and were an absolute train wreck and turned it around big time. Did you expect Mackinnon or Hall to actually have 90+ point season? Nobody had the expansion Vegas Knights to sniff the playoffs let alone make it to the finals. Did you have any idea that half the team would have career years? How do we know how Chytl, Anderson, ADA, and others are going to play? Maybe Kreider or Zibs or Buch have a breakout year? Maybe we surprise some people? Who knows?

It's a poor argument because you're not taking all of the variables into account.

Saying that those teams were better than expected is true - but when you look at why they exceeded expectations, there really is no comparison to be made to the team we have right now.

We don't have a Hall or Mackinnon on the roster. I'm not even sure we have a Rantanen on the roster. Expecting a half dozen guys to set their career highs (or more than double their career point total like Karlsson did for Vegas) is wildly unrealistic (this is before getting to guys like Tuch and Theodore also having better than expected seasons.)

This is basically saying that if Chytil and Andersson finish 1-2 in the Calder Voting, DeAngelo puts up a 50 point season, KZB all break 70 points,Hayes continues to improve and Hank can at least match his performance from last year then sure, they'll blow past what is expected of them.

Yeah they would if all of that happened, but it's much more likely that none of those things happen then all of them.

 

[Kakko Schmakko]

Either Vesey is a master manipulator to also bewitch Quinn, or at lot of people are laughably wrong again.

Either way he doesn't really belong in NHL the way he's been playing lately.

 

[PuckLuck3043]

It's a poor argument because you're not taking all of the variables into account.

Saying that those teams were better than expected is true - but when you look at why they exceeded expectations, there really is no comparison to be made to the team we have right now.

We don't have a Hall or Mackinnon on the roster. I'm not even sure we have a Rantanen on the roster. Expecting a half dozen guys to set their career highs (or more than double their career point total like Karlsson did for Vegas) is wildly unrealistic (this is before getting to guys like Tuch and Theodore also having better than expected seasons.)

This is basically saying that if Chytil and Andersson finish 1-2 in the Calder Voting, DeAngelo puts up a 50 point season, KZB all break 70 points,Hayes continues to improve and Hank can at least match his performance from last year then sure, they'll blow past what is expected of them.

Yeah they would if all of that happened, but it's much more likely that none of those things happen then all of them.

I didn't say all of that has to happen but there is the possibility that if some of those players outperform expectations we could be more of a bubble team than a bottom 5.

 

[Inferno]

Teams I think the rangers are better than.

Islanders
Senators
Canadiens
Canucks
Red wings

Teams that I think are probably around the rangers level
Coyotes
Sabres
Hurricanes
Devils

This is why I see them more of a 7 to 9 team. I can see a few of the teams I think are worse being better..but I can also see a few of the teams in the same range being worse


Injuries will play the biggest role. If we're healthy all year..probably 9 to 11 from the bottom. Injured all year...more like 3 to 5.

Hence my 7 to 9 guess.

 

[ReggieDunlop68]

Either way he doesn't really belong in NHL the way he's been playing lately.

Damn this Russian bias!!!

This is 1940 all over

 

[Kakko Schmakko]

Teams I think the rangers are better than.

Islanders
Senators
Canadiens
Canucks
Red wings

Teams that I think are probably around the rangers level
Coyotes
Sabres
Hurricanes
Devils

This is why I see them more of a 7 to 9 team. I can see a few of the teams I think are worse being better..but I can also see a few of the teams in the same range being worse


Injuries will play the biggest role. If we're healthy all year..probably 9 to 11 from the bottom. Injured all year...more like 3 to 5.

Hence my 7 to 9 guess.

I think Rangers are about 9th best team in the East( I view Devils, Hurricanes, Sabres, Senators, Islanders, Red Wings, Canadiens looking worse than Rangers on paper) , so just outside of the playoff spot, of course injuries can strike some teams and they fall out of the playoff picture then we are possibly in the playoffs.

 

[ReggieDunlop68]

I think Rangers are about 9th best team in the East( I view Devils, Hurricanes, Sabres, Senators, Islanders, Red Wings, Canadiens looking worse than Rangers on paper) , so just outside of the playoff spot, of course injuries can strike some teams and they fall out of the playoff picture then we are possibly in the playoffs.

Fair enough. Making the playoffs in the current NHL consists of not having too many injuries and having those on the roster maintain a body temperature around 98 degrees faranheit.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

that's like me asking; have you even played the f'n game, punk...

Zuccarello playing with Chytil isn't going to magically transform us into a playoff team.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Either Vesey is a master manipulator to also bewitch Quinn, or at lot of people are laughably wrong again.

Or coaches are human and affected by personal feelings when judging layers they work with on a daily basis.

 

[ReggieDunlop68]

Or coaches are human and affected by personal feelings when judging layers they work with on a daily basis.

Why would two completely different professionals have completely identical opinions about one player let alone in Quinn’s case, as someone hypothetically stated, would be so bamboozled by a player making one good play that all their prior professional training, instinct, and care for their job in the NHL be cast into the wind unless...A.V. we’re behind it?

Well played Gordie Clark...

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Why would two completely different professionals have completely identical opinions about one player let alone in Quinn’s case, as someone hypothetically stated, would be so bamboozled by a player making one good play that all their prior professional training, instinct, and care for their job in the NHL be cast into the wind unless...A.V. we’re behind it?

Well played Gordie Clark...

Well, if you want to know my honest opinion: Coaches are probably looking at other things than fans, when evaluating players, but at the same time are also setting line-ups based on other factors, like contract status.

A guy like Marc Staal will play because it would be a waste not to, despite him not being able to keep up for the last 3 years. He is the 2nd highest paid D-man on the team and that does factor in a bit, I think

 

[Ori]

We finished in the last 8 a year ago...and that was after we moved most of our marquee players at the deadline. Yes, we might have Chytil, Andersson, and Shattenkirk for full seasons...but that hardly makes up for losing McDonagh, Nash and Grabner. And that's before they deal off more assets during the season. I would be surprised if this team is not picking in 4 to 8 range next June.

Rick Nash in his last two last seasons with Rangers has been meh barely 36 and 38 pts also based on concussion injuries. Grabner 31 pst last season, but he only had 5 pts in 21 games for NJD, Ryan Mc. was partly injured and did not play very well last season - the whole team had a poor year with AV.
But I think it`s possible for Chytil & Lias to achieve similar numbers compare to Nash & Grabner in their first full NHL season.

 

[egelband]

Rick Nash in his last two last seasons with Rangers has been meh barely 36 and 38 pts also based on concussion injuries. Grabner 31 pst last season, but he only had 5 pts in 21 games for NJD, Ryan Mc. was partly injured and did not play very well last season - the whole team had a poor year with AV.
But I think it`s possible for Chytil & Lias to achieve similar numbers compare to Nash & Grabner in their first full NHL season.

You are very optimistic.

And I love it!

 

[nyr2k2]

Rick Nash in his last two last seasons with Rangers has been meh barely 36 and 38 pts also based on concussion injuries. Grabner 31 pst last season, but he only had 5 pts in 21 games for NJD, Ryan Mc. was partly injured and did not play very well last season - the whole team had a poor year with AV.
But I think it`s possible for Chytil & Lias to achieve similar numbers compare to Nash & Grabner in their first full NHL season.

I don't think it's impossible to replace the offense of Nash and Grabner, but they were both good defensive players who excelled on the PK. That, I don't think we have guys ready to replace.

Also, I think McDonagh is diminished, and more of a 2, but I still doubt anyone can step into his minutes and play them at his level.

 

[Ori]

Yes true coach Quinn will try Kreider in a PK role since he has speed similar to Grabner, and it will be interesting to see how successful he can be in that role.

 

[Ghost of jas]

Teams I think the rangers are better than.

Islanders
Senators
Canadiens
Canucks
Red wings

Teams that I think are probably around the rangers level
Coyotes
Sabres
Hurricanes
Devils

This is why I see them more of a 7 to 9 team. I can see a few of the teams I think are worse being better..but I can also see a few of the teams in the same range being worse


Injuries will play the biggest role. If we're healthy all year..probably 9 to 11 from the bottom. Injured all year...more like 3 to 5.

Hence my 7 to 9 guess.

At the risk of sounding ‘petty’, I really think you’re giving this team far too much credit. I don’t think the Islanders are worse. They’ll likely outs ore tge Rangers, and Trotz is more likely to have an immediate impact than Quinn, especially defensively. Looking at the teams you have the Rangers grouped with, the Rangers don’t have the defense that Carolina does, the Coyotes and Sabres look to me to be teams with the arrow pointing up, and while I think the Devils will regress, the Rangers don’t have a player as good as Taylor Hall. The only two teams I am confident that the Rangers are better than are Ottawa and Montreal. But, if we are to assume Henke will inflate the Ranger win total, why shouldn’t we assume the same for a Price? I think we are more likely to see the arrow point straight up next year than we are this season. We saw what could happened last when injuries hit, and not much has been done to address the issue of depth (which I am okay with Gorton’s approach.). I am very happy with just about everything Gorton has done. But, as your yourself agreed, there is so much un-AVing that has to be done, and that’s not happening overnight.

 

[TheTakedown]

For real , people had him as a middle 6 at best. No one was projecting him to be a star.

Casual fans were. Then when the Rangers signed him every fan from other teams was like "wtf why do the rangers always get top free agent talent out of colleges?!" which only further drove the hype.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Casual fans were. Then when the Rangers signed him every fan from other teams was like "wtf why do the rangers always get top free agent talent out of colleges?!" which only further drove the hype.

This!

 

[Rangers in 7]

I don't know how you can be so certain of that. Hockey is very tough to predict because of the emotion involved. That's the one thing hockey has that other sports lack. Emotion can really propel teams to be a lot better than they are on paper. Especially during the regular season.

Edited to add: I don't know how a losing team can be fun to watch. I don't understand the mentality of wanting to see your team lose.

I don't want to see my team lose ever, but we don't have the pieces to contend, and im tired of being not good enough to win a cup....they will be fun because of the young players being able to showcase what they can do

we are two years away from contending, thats just a fact. also hockey isn't the only sport that has emotion, that is just wrong