Prospect Info: Prospects and Marlies Thread: Marlies Calder Cup Champions Edition

[X66]

I hope it's not out of the question to revert Gordeev back to forward if anything.

Ideally he pans out as a D, but his physical tools with his size would make him a nice looking forward as well.

 

[saltming]

I hope so

I think people overestimate how much certain guys can improve defensively even with the best training and development staff but I hope the kids proves me wrong

Size plus tools is a very tantalizing package

I don't think it's easy for a kid to learn defense but imo it's just like learning anything; some people get it easy, some get it hard and some don't get it.
My thought is he has a good head for hockey offensively, so it he can use that to learn the defensive side, we might have a winner.
If we get a more mobile franson out of him that's a huge win. If he turns into a monster 2 way defenseman,

 

[Kiwi]

I don't think it's easy for a kid to learn defense but imo it's just like learning anything; some people get it easy, some get it hard and some don't get it.
My thought is he has a good head for hockey offensively, so it he can use that to learn the defensive side, we might have a winner.
If we get a more mobile franson out of him that's a huge win. If he turns into a monster 2 way defenseman,

I think it's a balancing act with a lot of guys are lot of the time

He's got some offensive talent but how much does he need to give up defensively to produce offensively?

The really good two way players don't but a lot of the other guys do which takes a decent amount of game and situational awareness

I'm not sure that's development, hockey IQ or a mix of both

Gordeev is going to be an interesting case study because we have the development team

 

[saltming]

I think it's a balancing act with a lot of guys are lot of the time

He's got some offensive talent but how much does he need to give up defensively to produce offensively?

The really good two way players don't but a lot of the other guys do which takes a decent amount of game and situational awareness

I'm not sure that's development, hockey IQ or a mix of both

Gordeev is going to be an interesting case study because we have the development team

I see it as he has hockey IQ but he sees the game on the offensive side.
Can he reverse his view? Figure out how to stop what he would do on offense?
For sure it should be fun to watch him grow and agreed that we have the development team that can help him and a good coach in the A to also contribute to his growth.
I think of Dermott who said he thought of himself as an offensive defenseman when he joined the Marlies and now he's a great 2 way defenseman (that said I always thought Dermott was sound defensively and Gordeev is not as sound as Dermott was at the same age). Hoping we can do something very close to what we've done with Dermott to Gordeev

 

[Judas Tavares]

Didn't see it mentioned here, but Pronman is putting out his org prospect rankings in the Athletic. We are ranked 19th, which is more than fair.

His love for small skilled guys shows, as SDA is ranked 3rd. And even stranger, SDA is ranked 8th on our org top 10 23 and under, which just looks weird. But hey you never know.

 

[zeke]

Josh Leivo had one good 13 game stint 2 seasons ago.

He had a 16 game stint last season were he looked replacement level.

He’s at a 31 point pace per 82 games in his career.


Josh Leivo is going to be Richard Panik 2.0, where people are going to be upset when he eventually gets moved, and he may even have a good initial season or two with a new club but he’s not going to be anything we regret

Panik is the opposite, really - a guy who got chance after chance after chance despite never actually earning it through performance. Leivo has been much better than he ever was, but can't get any chances to play.

By Age 24:

Panik: 181gms, ES (C- qoc), 1.16p60, 0.91p160, 48.0cf% (-0.7), 46.8xgf% (-0.2)
Leivo: 57gms, ES (D+ qoc), 1.97p60, 1.62p160, 51.1cf% (+2.0), 52.7xgf% (+7.5)

both played in easy usage, but Leivo has dominated that easy usage - producing like a 1st liner and dominating possession, while Panik produced like a 4th liner and was a negative possession player.

but panik kept getting chance after chance after chance and finally turned himself into a 40pt guy in a cushy situation. if Panik can do that, Leivo can likely do much more, but just can't get a chance to play.

Leivo could be more comparable to guys like yanni gourde, who had greqt metrics but couldn't get q chance due to coach's bias.

 

[acrobaticgoalie]

I hope it's not out of the question to revert Gordeev back to forward if anything.

Ideally he pans out as a D, but his physical tools with his size would make him a nice looking forward as well.

I wonder how Dubas values him. I just rewatched his highlights vid from this season. He definitely is intriguing

 

[Obliviate]

Didn't see it mentioned here, but Pronman is putting out his org prospect rankings in the Athletic. We are ranked 19th, which is more than fair.

His love for small skilled guys shows, as SDA is ranked 3rd. And even stranger, SDA is ranked 8th on our org top 10 23 and under, which just looks weird. But hey you never know.

It’s funny - in these rankings you aren’t penalized for having Young contributing players in your lineup - at that point their not prospects.

I think we should start looking at these things holistically as organizational youth. Otherwise it’s conoletely misleading.

Or, who gives a shit. I can be convinced either way.

 

[Walshy7]

So Rasmus Sandin is playing in Sweden this year then? playing pre season at Rogle right now, I didn't know he went back there was it reported a while ago I must have missed it

 

[LeafsOHLRangers98]

So Rasmus Sandin is playing in Sweden this year then? playing pre season at Rogle right now, I didn't know he went back there was it reported a while ago I must have missed it

He has a contract there, but OHL camps havent even started yet, probably just getting some ice time to get a jump on his season before coming over.

 

[Joey Hoser]

So Rasmus Sandin is playing in Sweden this year then? playing pre season at Rogle right now, I didn't know he went back there was it reported a while ago I must have missed it

He's actually been under contract with Rogle the whole time. They had just loaned him to the OHL last year. The SHL season starts earlier than we do in NA, so makes sense for him to be there. This doesn't really have anything to do with where he will be in the fall.

 

[Walshy7]

He's actually been under contract with Rogle the whole time. They had just loaned him to the OHL last year. The SHL season starts earlier than we do in NA, so makes sense for him to be there. This doesn't really have anything to do with where he will be in the fall.

I did forget that he had a contract, but still is it normal for a player to appear in pre season SHL games only to then move back to the OHL? seems like a waste for the SHL team they could be getting a younger player up to speed to get ready for the season ahead, unless they think playing sandin might convince him to want to stay in the SHL for the season

 

[Joey Hoser]

I did forget that he had a contract, but still is it normal for a player to appear in pre season SHL games only to then move back to the OHL? seems like a waste for the SHL team they could be getting a younger player up to speed to get ready for the season ahead, unless they think playing sandin might convince him to want to stay in the SHL for the season

No, it isn't normal. But that's because the Swedes that play here, usually don't have contracts in Sweden. Rogle loaning him to the OHL is an unusual move. I'm sure they have a reasonable explanation as to way it made sense for them to do that, but I don't know what it is.

 

[Kiwi]

I did forget that he had a contract, but still is it normal for a player to appear in pre season SHL games only to then move back to the OHL? seems like a waste for the SHL team they could be getting a younger player up to speed to get ready for the season ahead, unless they think playing sandin might convince him to want to stay in the SHL for the season

The way Sandin has been talking Walshy I'm of the belief that he wants to stay in Europe and play in the SHL this season

I'd be surprised if he ends up in the CHL this season unless the Leafs have a real desire for him to play there

 

[Walshy7]

The way Sandin has been talking Walshy I'm of the belief that he wants to stay in Europe and play in the SHL this season

I'd be surprised if he ends up in the CHL this season unless the Leafs have a real desire for him to play there

id prefer him stay there too I think. can learn to play against men without being in the tighter NA style rink. Only issue would be ice time

 

[Walshy7]

No, it isn't normal. But that's because the Swedes that play here, usually don't have contracts in Sweden. Rogle loaning him to the OHL is an unusual move. I'm sure they have a reasonable explanation as to way it made sense for them to do that, but I don't know what it is.

Alex Nylander was loaned too, but he went straight to Rochester after draft didn't he? so I guess there wasn't an opportunity where he ended up back in Sweden after his loan.

 

[Kiwi]

id prefer him stay there too I think. can learn to play against men without being in the tighter NA style rink. Only issue would be ice time

The only reason I'd want him on smaller ice surfaces is he needs to learn techniques to help him stop getting hit by forecheckers which was a bit of an issue last season and he's more likely to get that in the CHL on smaller ice

Playing against men and getting big minutes in a pro league like the SHL is more beneficial imo but the forecheck thing is the only reason I can come up with for the CHL instead of the SHL

 

[TML1967]

The only reason I'd want him on smaller ice surfaces is he needs to learn techniques to help him stop getting hit by forecheckers which was a bit of an issue last season and he's more likely to get that in the CHL on smaller ice

Playing against men and getting big minutes in a pro league like the SHL is more beneficial imo but the forecheck thing is the only reason I can come up with for the CHL instead of the SHL

Agreed, but only if he is getting the minutes.
Frequently young guys on SHL teams get played sparingly and I think it really hurts the development curve.

If he is a #5-6 guy playing bottom pairing minutes and not on the PP or PK, id rather him be in the OHL playing top pair near 25 minutes a game in all situation on NHL sized ice.

 

[Kiwi]

Agreed, but only if he is getting the minutes.
Frequently young guys on SHL teams get played sparingly and I think it really hurts the development curve.

If he is a #5-6 guy playing bottom pairing minutes and not on the PP or PK, id rather him be in the OHL playing top pair near 25 minutes a game in all situation on NHL sized ice.

He played a bit in the SHL last season so he's probably a decent chance to play in a top 4 role this season

I'd agree with you on the minutes thing if he's not in the top 4 though
The kid needs to play and if he's not going to get that in Sweden he needs to be in the Soo, full stop

 

[BertCorbeau]

I hope it's not out of the question to revert Gordeev back to forward if anything.

Ideally he pans out as a D, but his physical tools with his size would make him a nice looking forward as well.

TBH reminds me of Buff out there

 

[lifelonghockeyfan]

Sandin because he owned by the Swiss team, they could loan him to the Greyhounds, or even the Marlies.
SHL might be the best spot for him (and the Leafs). Looks like a crowded Marlie defence this season.
If they want to give Gordeev Dman minutes it could be in the ECHL.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

Sandin because he owned by the Swiss team, they could loan him to the Greyhounds, or even the Marlies.
SHL might be the best spot for him (and the Leafs). Looks like a crowded Marlie defence this season.
If they want to give Gordeev Dman minutes it could be in the ECHL.

Gordeev is not old enough. He's going back to the OHL.

 

[Kiwi]

Sounds like Sandin had a really good game today over in Sweden
He was on the ice for all 6 goals his team scored apparently

 

[lifelonghockeyfan]

Gordeev is not old enough. He's going back to the OHL.

Thanks,

 

[DraftGuru]

Sounds like Sandin had a really good game today over in Sweden
He was on the ice for all 6 goals his team scored apparently

Yup 2 assists and on the ice for all 6 goals for.