Preseason Stats

Ghost of Ethan Hunt

The Official Ghost of Space Ghosts Monkey
Jun 23, 2018
8,733
5,092
Top Secret Moon Base
Thru 4 games:

OFFENSE


RankNAMETEAMGPTOIGAPTS+/-PTS/GSOGGWGFWFLFW%
[TBODY] [/TBODY]

93 Gustav Nyquist, RW DET 2 18:23 1 3 4 1 2.0 3 0 1 0 100.00
93 Dennis Cholowski, D DET 3 22:43 1 2 3 1 1.0 4 0 0 0 0.00
93 Michael Rasmussen, C DET 3 18:16 2 1 3 2 1.0 14 1 0 6 0.00
93 Andreas Athanasiou, LW DET 2 20:34 2 0 2 1 1.0 6 0 17 15 53.13
93 Luke Glendening, RW DET 2 15:33 0 2 2 2 1.0 1 0 10 10 50.00
93 Dylan Larkin, C DET 2 22:18 0 2 2 0 1.0 5 0 28 17 62.22
93 Libor Sulak, D DET 3 20:37 0 2 2 1 0.7 11 0 0 0 0.00
93 Evgeny Svechnikov, RW DET 3 12:48 2 0 2 1 0.7 4 2 4 3 57.14
93 Joseph Veleno, C DET 3 14:08 0 2 2 0 0.7 3 0 18 19 48.65
93 Filip Zadina, RW DET 3 17:02 1 1 2 -2 0.7 4 0 0 1 0.00
93 Trevor Daley, D DET 2 18:17 1 0 1 1 0.5 2 1 0 0 0.00
93 Danny DeKeyser, D DET 2 16:46 0 1 1 1 0.5 6 0 0 0 0.00
93 Christoffer Ehn, C DET 2 13:04 0 1 1 0 0.5 2 0 10 15 40.00
93 Matt Ford, RW DET 1 12:35 0 1 1 1 1.0 0 0 0 1 0.00
93 Trevor Hamilton, D DET 1 17:52 1 0 1 0 1.0 4 0 0 0 0.00
93 Filip Hronek, D DET 2 19:22 0 1 1 0 0.5 5 0 0 0 0.00
93 Nick Jensen, D DET 2 17:05 0 1 1 0 0.5 3 0 0 0 0.00
93 Jussi Jokinen, LW DET 2 16:06 1 0 1 1 0.5 8 0 1 2 33.33
93 Niklas Kronwall, D DET 1 18:48 0 1 1 1 1.0 2 0 0 0 0.00
93 Anthony Mantha, RW DET 2 18:47 0 1 1 3 0.5 9 0 1 1 50.00
93 Dylan McIlrath, D DET 1 16:52 0 1 1 -1 1.0 1 0 0 0 0.00
93 Vili Saarijarvi, D DET 2 17:40 1 0 1 2 0.5 4 0 0 0 0.00
93 Givani Smith, RW DET 2 13:51 0 1 1 0 0.5 2 0 0 0 0.00
93 Thomas Vanek, LW DET 1 17:27 1 0 1 0 1.0 2 0 0 0 0.00
[TBODY] [/TBODY]
 

Ghost of Ethan Hunt

The Official Ghost of Space Ghosts Monkey
Jun 23, 2018
8,733
5,092
Top Secret Moon Base
~3.5 GF/G & ~2.3 GAA for team. Sateri looks legit, maybe he bumps Howard next year?

Zadina the only rookie -2. Everyone else is 0 +/- or better. (not including McIlrath, as he's not condtending for a spot or current established NHL vet). I wish they'd list stats for others who aren't on the scoresheet, i.e. Turgeon etc.

Cholo leads TOI. FO% pretty good overall.
 

Ghost of Ethan Hunt

The Official Ghost of Space Ghosts Monkey
Jun 23, 2018
8,733
5,092
Top Secret Moon Base
Forwards & Defensemen
PlayerPosGPGAP+/-PMTOI/GPGPASGSASHSO%GWFO%SG-A
Gustav NyquistC2134+109:020100333.30100.00-0
Dennis CholowskiD21230211:470000425.000.00-0
Evgeny SvechnikovLW2202+125:490000366.7233.30-0
Michael RasmussenC2112+228:3700001010.010.00-0
Libor SulakD2022+109:54000070.000.00-0
Luke GlendeningC2022+207:37000010.0037.50-0
Givani SmithRW2011056:51000020.000.00-0
Joe VelenoC2011-127:36010030.0050.00-0
Dylan LarkinC1011-1221:43000030.0063.20-0
Filip HronekD10110219:00010020.000.00-0
Filip ZadinaRW2101-208:061000333.300.00-0
Vili SaarijarviD2101+209:030000425.000.00-0
Thomas VanekLW11010017:271000250.000.00-0
Jussi JokinenLW1101+1014:530000425.00100.00-0
Trevor HamiltonD11010017:520000425.000.00-0
Andreas AthanasiouC11010017:360000333.3042.90-0
Dylan McIlrathD1011-100:00000010.000.00-0
Niklas KronwallD1011+100:00010020.000.00-0
Nick JensenD10110018:43000020.000.00-0
Matthew FordRW1011+1012:35000000.000.00-0
Christoffer EhnC1011+1013:41000020.0046.70-0
Luke WitkowskiD2000+145:19000010.000.00-0
Joe HickettsD3000-1014:26000060.000.00-0
Dominic TurgeonC2000006:50000030.0044.40-0
Chris TerryLW2000+106:06000020.000.00-0
Darren HelmC2000+209:14000030.00100.00-0
Matt PuempelLW10000011:25000020.000.00-0
Frans NielsenC1000+1015:53000010.0064.30-0
Wade MeganC1000+1010:23000000.0060.00-0
Anthony ManthaRW1000+1020:23000030.000.00-0
Axel HolmstromC10000010:11000000.000.00-0
Jonathan EricssonD1000+2019:11000010.000.00-0
Danny DeKeyserD10000019:22000040.000.00-0
Trevor DaleyD1000+1016:41000000.000.00-0
Jake CheliosD1000-1021:25000020.000.00-0
Carter CamperC1000000:00000000.000.00-0
Tyler BertuzziLW1000-2019:05000030.000.00-0
Justin AbdelkaderLW1000-2015:46000010.00100.00-0
Patrik RybarG10000030:19000000.000.00-0
Jonathan BernierG10000029:41000000.000.00-0
Harri SateriG10000032:08000000.000.00-0
Jimmy HowardG20000045:33000000.000.00-0
Totals 311193002161:0524009711.3353.80-0
Opponents 37132002361:051200798.9046.20-0
[TBODY] [/TBODY]
Goalies
PlayerPosGPGSTOIGAASVSV%GASAWLOTSOSHG-A
Jimmy HowardG2291:062.6437.90244110000-0
Harri SateriG1032:081.8814.93311510000-0
Jonathan BernierG1129:414.0011.84621300000-0
Patrik RybarG1030:190.00101.00001010000-0
Totals 33183:142.3072.91177930000-0
Opponents 33183:143.6186.887119701200-0
[TBODY] [/TBODY]
Edit: found it.
 

Shaman464

No u
May 1, 2009
10,211
4,420
Boston, MA
~3.5 GF/G & ~2.3 GAA for team. Sateri looks legit, maybe he bumps Howard next year?

Zadina the only rookie -2. Everyone else is 0 +/- or better. (not including McIlrath, as he's not condtending for a spot or current established NHL vet). I wish they'd list stats for others who aren't on the scoresheet, i.e. Turgeon etc.

Cholo leads TOI. FO% pretty good overall.

No, Sateri hasn't shown this level in the NHL or even AHL and unless things go badly off the rails he very unlikely to get many looks in the NHL. Don't read too much into preseason games.
 

ShelbyZ

Registered User
Apr 8, 2015
3,795
2,556
I was thinking the same. Probably one of them going to get traded. Seteri Bernier or Howard

When? Trading one of them now wouldn't make much sense because it would leave GR with two first year NA pros in Rybar and Fulcher, and the NHL team would have to rely on one of them if/when whichever two don't get traded get hurt.

Realistically, there's probably no market for Sateri or Bernier. If a team wants Sateri, they can wait until the Red Wings waive him and put in a claim on waivers. Given that Michael Hutchinson just cleared, there's probably not much interest out there for a guy like Sateri for more than just an AHL vet starter. Bernier on the other hand is arguably overpaid and has a year too much term for a guy that is at best a #1B.

Howard might have some market eventually, but it probably won't be until around the trade deadline.

I really am curious why we signed Bernier

I get the signing of Bernier, but the contract really makes little sense to me, especially considering they're already open to extending Howard even with Bernier in the fold. They threw out the most total money and tied for highest AAV and term for a goalie signed this past summer, and yet he isn't even expected to be a starter... Once they missed out on Hutton, if they were just after a warm body, why not go with a Ward, Halak or Khudobin, who took less money and/or term?

Much like the last time Howard had a year left before unrestricted free agency and the Red Wings brought in a former failed Leafs "goalie of the future", there seems to be some risk to go along with the signing:

-Bernier finished last season missing a good chunk of time through the second half of February and a lot of March with various injuries (including a concussion), and then was hurt for the Avs last two playoff games.

-Bernier's "consistency". In the last 3 seasons where Bernier played more as a #2 or #1B, he consistently started each year with mediocre to bad numbers before ending the season much better. In those season, from the start of the year to New Years Day, he posted SV%'s under .90 (.889 in 15/16, .897 in 16/17 and .898 in 17/18), before he does a Jekyll and Hyde when the ball drops to finish the season (.92 in 15/16, .926 in 16/17, .922 in 17/18 (.939 in January alone)).

I have a feeling this ends up another bad contract.
 
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sully6one

Unregistered User
Aug 6, 2011
1,596
66
Michigan
For those who aren’t happy with the Bernier signing, which prospect do you want to put in the NHL? Larsson, Petruzzeli? Brattstrom? None of them are ready and won’t be for 3+ years, we have no one close to ready so what’s the problem with signing another veteran guy? There aren’t any other options really
 

Lazlo Hollyfeld

The jersey ad still sucks
Mar 4, 2004
28,134
26,430
When? Trading one of them now wouldn't make much sense because it would leave GR with two first year NA pros in Rybar and Fulcher, and the NHL team would have to rely on one of them if/when whichever two don't get traded get hurt.

Realistically, there's probably no market for Sateri or Bernier. If a team wants Sateri, they can wait until the Red Wings waive him and put in a claim on waivers. Given that Michael Hutchinson just cleared, there's probably not much interest out there for a guy like Sateri for more than just an AHL vet starter. Bernier on the other hand is arguably overpaid and has a year too much term for a guy that is at best a #1B.

Howard might have some market eventually, but it probably won't be until around the trade deadline.



I get the signing of Bernier, but the contract really makes little sense to me, especially considering they're already open to extending Howard even with Bernier in the fold. They threw out the most total money and tied for highest AAV and term for a goalie signed this past summer, and yet he isn't even expected to be a starter... Once they missed out on Hutton, if they were just after a warm body, why not go with a Ward, Halak or Khudobin, who took less money and/or term?

Much like the last time Howard had a year left before unrestricted free agency and the Red Wings brought in a former failed Leafs "goalie of the future", there seems to be some risk to go along with the signing:

-Bernier finished last season missing a good chunk of time through the second half of February and a lot of March with various injuries (including a concussion), and then was hurt for the Avs last two playoff games.

-Bernier's "consistency". In the last 3 seasons where Bernier played more as a #2 or #1B, he consistently started each year with mediocre to bad numbers before ending the season much better. In those season, from the start of the year to New Years Day, he posted SV%'s under .90 (.889 in 15/16, .897 in 16/17 and .898 in 17/18), before he does a Jekyll and Hyde when the ball drops to finish the season (.92 in 15/16, .926 in 16/17, .922 in 17/18 (.939 in January alone)).

I have a feeling this ends up another bad contract.

All good points.

On the surface the Bernier deal looks like Kenny hedging his bets and could work out. But this definitely becomes a bad contract if Holland re-signs Howard, which is a real possibility given his overly loyal tendencies with aging Wings players.
 

Ghost of Ethan Hunt

The Official Ghost of Space Ghosts Monkey
Jun 23, 2018
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Top Secret Moon Base


I think it'll be Hicketts as 7th Dman & Sulak as 6th. Hicketts has Zero pts. in preseason, all others are at least .5pg or better. Sulak is 24 yrs. old, so they wanna see what they have in him before potentially losing him to KHL/Europe. Also allows Hronek & Cholo to refine their games a bit & log 20+min in AHL. Lastly, it is probably best for our draft position that Hronek & Cholo are in AHL for some/most of the year. Hicketts ceiling is probably #5 Dman, or #4b with a miracle.
 

Henkka

Registered User
Jan 31, 2004
31,077
12,078
Tampere, Finland
Blashill is just selling the "right decision" for the fanbase.

In reality, Hicketts/Jensen as 7th D will hurt least in the big picture.

Some other guy will be on the Top6.
 
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Pavels Dog

Registered User
Feb 18, 2013
19,736
14,704
Sweden
Bwaaa?

Based on all the feedback here, Hicketts might be the most steady, but definitely not the best.

I'm starting to wonder if Blashill would rather own a solar powered calculator than a computer, specifically because the calculator has a lower chance of crashing.
I wouldn’t say he’s any steadier than the others. I don’t agree with Blash but I do like Lil’Joe and think he could be a good NHLer.
 

Martinez

Go Blue
Oct 10, 2015
6,654
2,139
I knew hicketts would be first in line (not that I agree with it). Hopefully Sulak makes the team. Give cholo and Hronek big minutes in GR
 

Heaton

Moderator
Feb 13, 2004
22,548
925
Auburn Hills
I didn't think Cholo or Hronek either had a realistic chance to make the team even if they were far and away better than all other defensemen. Makes sense to let them stay in the minors for this year, but both need to be on the team next season.

IMO, this should be the last season we go into thinking the team will be terrible. If next year is more of the same the development has stalled.
 

Flowah

Registered User
Nov 30, 2009
10,249
547
IMO, this should be the last season we go into thinking the team will be terrible. If next year is more of the same the development has stalled.
Do you really think Sulak, Cholo, Hronek are enough of a difference compared to our current d-group for that?

Who would they replace? Jensen okay. Daley and Green seem like tradebait and Green is our bet d-man. Are any of those 3 capable of replacing Green? Kronwall retiring probably.

It mostly seems like a minor improvement at best. We'd be counting on one or both of our young groups on forward/defense to make MAJOR strides to not be a terrible team. Let's not forget we still lost one of our best players this season in Zetterberg and we were still terrible with him on the squad all last season. Losing Green is gonna hurt too.

I think next year being more of the same is highly possible even if development hasn't stalled but is just as "expected."
 

Hammettf2b

oldmanyellsatcloud.jpg
Jul 9, 2012
22,489
4,610
So California
Do you really think Sulak, Cholo, Hronek are enough of a difference compared to our current d-group for that?

Who would they replace? Jensen okay. Daley and Green seem like tradebait and Green is our bet d-man. Are any of those 3 capable of replacing Green? Kronwall retiring probably.

It mostly seems like a minor improvement at best. We'd be counting on one or both of our young groups on forward/defense to make MAJOR strides to not be a terrible team. Let's not forget we still lost one of our best players this season in Zetterberg and we were still terrible with him on the squad all last season. Losing Green is gonna hurt too.

I think next year being more of the same is highly possible even if development hasn't stalled but is just as "expected."
Plus all of our young forwards would have a year more of development.
 

Flowah

Registered User
Nov 30, 2009
10,249
547
Plus all of our young forwards would have a year more of development.
Okay, but we were bottom 5 last season.

If you want to improve after losing Z, and probably Green and Kronwall after this season (and maybe even Nyquist), you have to see some big strides being taken.

I don't think it's reasonable to assume all the forwards continue taking big steps forward. That rarely happens. Players stall all the time, or even regress. And even if they do take those steps, will they be big enough to overcome the holes left by Z's departure and the departure of other good players that are likely to come within the next year or two? Not just overcome, but overcome and overtake. Because again we were bottom 5 last season. If we want to be better than that the players have to make up for the players we lost and then some. Actually not "and then some." More like "and then a lot more."

Maybe we're talking bubble playoff team. I think that's about best we could hope for next season barring a miracle.
 

Hammettf2b

oldmanyellsatcloud.jpg
Jul 9, 2012
22,489
4,610
So California
Okay, but we were bottom 5 last season.

If you want to improve after losing Z, and probably Green and Kronwall after this season (and maybe even Nyquist), you have to see some big strides being taken.

I don't think it's reasonable to assume all the forwards continue taking big steps forward. That rarely happens. Players stall all the time, or even regress. And even if they do take those steps, will they be big enough to overcome the holes left by Z's departure and the departure of other good players that are likely to come within the next year or two? Not just overcome, but overcome and overtake. Because again we were bottom 5 last season. If we want to be better than that the players have to make up for the players we lost and then some. Actually not "and then some." More like "and then a lot more."

Maybe we're talking bubble playoff team. I think that's about best we could hope for next season barring a miracle.
Don't get me wrong, I don't think we will become a bubble playoff team by next year (unless some players make some big strides) but I think the overhaul of the defense will greatly help this team.
 

Henkka

Registered User
Jan 31, 2004
31,077
12,078
Tampere, Finland
Here is some on-ice data from Natural stat trick of pre-season games we have played.

NumPlayerPosxGtotxGFxGaGmsTOIFFFAFF%GFGAGF%SCFSCASCF%HDCFHDCAHDCF%MedDCFMedDCAMedSCF%LowDCFLowDCALowDCF%xGtotxGFtxGAtxGF%
#29Vili SaarijärviRD0.975 1.073 0.099 215.132978.020100.021195.590100.012192.311857.90.9752.1460.19791.6
#55Niklas KronwallLD0.865 0.883 0.018 112.910190.910100.070100.050100.020100.03175.00.8650.8830.01898.0
#52Jonathan EricssonLD0.543 0.908 0.365 118.811857.920100.08466.74180.04357.13442.90.5430.9080.36571.3
#83Trevor DaleyD0.348 0.832 0.484 215.8292158.04357.1151060.05183.310952.6141156.00.3481.6640.96863.2
#17Filip HronekRD0.166 0.856 0.690 216.7252253.21150.0161551.68561.581044.49756.30.1661.7111.37955.4
#47Libor SulakLD0.115 0.786 0.671 317.5373352.93260.0231954.89852.9141156.0141450.00.1152.3592.01354.0
#65Danny DeKeyserLD0.056 0.789 0.734 214.2252352.12166.7131743.37558.361233.312666.70.0561.5781.46751.8
#2Joe HickettsD0.007 0.628 0.622 318.2333151.6010.0231560.56940.017673.9101638.50.0071.8851.86550.3
Trevor HamiltonRD-0.017 0.783 0.800 117.0161551.61150.08947.12250.06746.28657.1-0.0170.7830.80049.5
#5Nick JensenRD-0.324 0.482 0.806 214.9192246.31150.071729.24736.431023.112570.6-0.3240.9641.61137.4
#21Dennis CholowskiLD-0.365 0.620 0.985 316.9344344.24357.1183037.551229.4131841.9161355.2-0.3651.8592.95538.6
#4Dylan McIlrathRD-0.667 0.347 1.014 113.861331.61233.331023.11420.02625.03350.0-0.6670.3471.01425.5
Jake CheliosLD-0.900 0.294 1.194 121.061528.6010.031121.41614.32528.63442.9-0.9000.2941.19419.8
[TBODY] [/TBODY]
.

What does these numbers mean?

HDCF is High-Danger corsi for, shot attempt from high danger slot -area. It has had ~13.5% probality to go in on average. This is NHL regular season average.

MedDCF is medium-danger corsi for, shot attempt from medium-danger slot

They are separated in this table because, I hate corsi as a pure corsi, when every shot attempt is count as equal. That's the biggest flaw on normal corsi. But these High and Medium-dangers made it A LOT more informative.

What I've studied these, best defenceman seem to have low HIGH-danger Corsi Against. They protect the net-front area, and it comes from there. Ryan Suter was best at last season, from guys with high qualcomp group.

High-Danger Corsi has 13.5% probability to go in at last season
MediumDanger Corsi attempt had 5.2% proablity to go in at last season
Low-danger Corsi attempt had 1.8% proablity to go in at last season.

This gives you the weighload for different area shots. High-Danger Area shot attempt is over 7 times higher proability to go in as Low-danger for example.

So I created my own basic expected goals formula for these shot attempts. (HDCF*0.135 + MedDCF*0.052 + LowDCF*0.018) = xGF

It counts the average mathematical sum, how much team should score when a player is on the ice, and how much opposite team should score against.

***

It's only 2 games, very very small sample size, but Vili Saarijärvi just jumps out from that data. Best on xGF-xGA sum and that's a sky-high value.

Also 9-0 on HIGH-dangers is pretty impressive, against any kind of qualcomp. Easy or hard, that's really hard to achieve. He played his games with Kronwall and Hicketts. Hicketts best game was with Saarijärvi (13-1 in scoring chances), then he has had two average games with Sulak.

What comes to other kids, those xGtot values between Hronek, Sulak and Hicketts are pretty equal. It's really splitting hairs between them. But Cholowski has been worse than them defensively.
 
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