PP TOI Allocation - Pet Peeve

Leafsman

I guess $11M doesn't buy you what it use to
May 22, 2008
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588
I hate to harp on this team after a lousy loss but I really need to air this grievance as everyone watching hockey with me is tired of hearing it.

I find it very irritating that about 1:00 in to a PP (sometimes not even) our first unit rushes to get off the ice.

Why in the hell can't our first unit play more than 1:00 of PP play time???? Or at the very least Matthews??? Also, Nylander should be on the top unit and him and Matthews can stay out for close to the whole 2:00.

There are PP's where the 1st Unit gets 1:00ish, the 2nd unit gets <1:00 and then Freddy the Goat is out there. When our 4th liners are out there for 10-20 secs of the PP, that basically means we are getting 1:40 PP and a 20 second slight advantage for the 4th line.

The shortened PP time for our 1st unit means that it is always facing the other teams 1st PK unit for the vast majority of every PP, and never really gets a chance to face the other teams lesser penalty killers.

This team right now is #1 in PP opportunities but our 1st PP unit players barely crack the top 30 in PP TOI/g.

Babcock needs to get his TOI issues resolved and fast.
 

Hustlr

Registered User
Oct 1, 2019
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744
Just a thought. Perhaps this thread when we aren’t at 40 percent on the PP.

I don’t agree, this is an issue.

I’d much rather someone get through to Babcock on a few things instead of canning his ***. It would be very much preferable.
 

DarkKnight

Professional Amateur
Jan 17, 2017
31,304
47,699
You must've missed the playoffs last year when we lost in the playoffs cause of special teams.

Either play the loaded one 2 mins or evenly distribute the PPs
Now you’re throwing the historical awful playoff PK into the mix? Seems convoluted.
 
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Hustlr

Registered User
Oct 1, 2019
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744
Now you’re throwing the historical awful playoff PK into the mix? Seems convoluted.

They were coming off at 45 seconds in game 6!!!!!

If we’re going to roll the units with this TOI allocation we NEED to split up the talent, we have it in spades.
 

Hustlr

Registered User
Oct 1, 2019
1,376
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I would argue we have a new PP coach and strategy this year. The PP has been very effective so far, not the time to air old grievances.

Cheers.

That’s a fair stance, but the first units talent should net them at least 1 minute of the PP... I still don’t like the 2nd PP, the only threat is Nylander and it’s going to be a tough unit to watch imo.
 

Mess

Global Moderator
Feb 27, 2002
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Leafs Home Board
I would argue we have a new PP coach and strategy this year. The PP has been very effective so far, not the time to air old grievances.

Cheers.

Agreed

Right now when teams take penalties against the Leafs they make them pay.

However it will only be a matter of time before the opposition adapt to this new PP strategy and formation and game script for shutting it down, and that is the time to evolve for the Leafs. Last year Leafs also came out of the gate red hot on the PP, the mistake they made was not adapting and altering it when the opposition learned how to best defend against it and it began to struggle as a result.

This will never really be about PP TOI issues but rather formation and strategy as they have more than enough talent to succeed.
 

Leafsman

I guess $11M doesn't buy you what it use to
May 22, 2008
3,412
588
I would argue we have a new PP coach and strategy this year. The PP has been very effective so far, not the time to air old grievances.

Cheers.

I see a new strategy but not the proper TOI allocation in which to best utilize it.

Yes, they're 40% on the PP but they could be 50ish% which would mean 1 or 2 more goals already this season.

I would have to argue about your definition of the term "effective" do you mean "they scored enough goals" or "they scored all the goals they possibly could?" It's a big difference between being good enough and the best.

They could have very possibly gone 4/5 or even 5/5 had teh 1st unit stayed out 1:30ish and faced the Habs' 2nd PP unit.
 

DarkKnight

Professional Amateur
Jan 17, 2017
31,304
47,699
I see a new strategy but not the proper TOI allocation in which to best utilize it.

Yes, they're 40% on the PP but they could be 50ish% which would mean 1 or 2 more goals already this season.

I would have to argue about your definition of the term "effective" do you mean "they scored enough goals" or "they scored all the goals they possibly could?" It's a big difference between being good enough and the best.

They could have very possibly gone 4/5 or even 5/5 had teh 1st unit stayed out 1:30ish and faced the Habs' 2nd PP unit.
Our second unit scored two PP goals last night. I mean pick your spots fellas.
 

Hustlr

Registered User
Oct 1, 2019
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We need to be the best, plain and simple. No cutting corners, no excuses.
 

54thecup

keep on rockin the free world!
Aug 3, 2017
573
194
Muskoka
You must've missed the playoffs last year when we lost in the playoffs cause of special teams.

Either play the loaded one 2 mins or evenly distribute the PPs


First, we were 1-5 on pp last nite. Willy scored the only pp goal 5 hole. I see Matthews last goal credited incorrectly as pp, unless I missed something a pulled goalie is not pp.

PP 1 had 4.5 mins of ice time last nite. Some good looks but some bad entries. They were given lots of chances.

One misconception is that Boston 's PP1 plays more than ours. They played a slightly lower % PP time. My source was an Athletic article I cant find at the moment. We were both around a 60 / 40 split. The top units in the league Wash and FLA were at ~70/30 split.

Although I'd like to see our first unit playing more in critical situations, there are great advantages to having a decent second unit!
Nylander's goal last nite should have been the sparkplug (4-1 goal) which would have been a great positive for our depth scorers!

I like our scheme and it takes time to improve the execution.

Unlike our rivals, we gutted our lineup and have a completely diff pp so we have to expect some hiccups along the way.
 

Leafsman

I guess $11M doesn't buy you what it use to
May 22, 2008
3,412
588
Our second unit scored two PP goals last night. I mean pick your spots fellas.

Not as good as the 1st PP scoring 4. I know it's not the best game because the PP, especially the 2nd unit, put up numbers.

But this was a 1 goal loss, and icing the 1st PP more could have made the difference.

How does the second unit get better if they don't get much time on the PP ?? This is a marathon, not a sprint. The regular season is the time to get everybody ready for the playoffs.

The regular season after we've clinched everything possible is the time to let the 2nd unit takeover and get some experience in. Or games where the team is so far ahead it doesn't matter.

If the 2nd PP isn't playing as much they don't need to be as good.

Not to mention, I'd move Nylander to the 1st PP unit then double shift both him and Matthews. So the 2nd unit would be Matthews, Nylander, Johnsson, Mikeyhev and Barrie or something.
 

Hustlr

Registered User
Oct 1, 2019
1,376
744
Not to mention, I'd move Nylander to the 1st PP unit then double shift both him and Matthews. So the 2nd unit would be Matthews, Nylander, Johnsson, Mikeyhev and Barrie or something.

I think I saw Tthews stay late onto PP2 in game 1 or 2, can’t remember.
 

Hustlr

Registered User
Oct 1, 2019
1,376
744
This idea I completely agree with!

We want Matty playing as many mins in the Ozone as possible. Let him stay as a shooter across from Nylander.

I would be doing this vs: having him get more time pking as some suggest.

Exactly, he’s not even expending energy. Just throw him there like Laine, no movement necessary.
 
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54thecup

keep on rockin the free world!
Aug 3, 2017
573
194
Muskoka
I see such similarities between where lacrosse has gone and where hockey is going. Lacrosse transitioned to offensive / defensive players ~30 years ago. It's the closest game I know that changes on the fly. It's easier to do in lax because possession is easier (like basketball) and therefore more important.

When will we start to see a 4th foward jump into a play in transition?

Can you imagine having Matty fly into the ozone as a 4th foward (even high slot ) and the players know he's coming?

On the way back we may throw one more defensively inclined player on the ice (ex: Hyman)

Rover roles becoming more common.

I may be a dreamer.... but I'm not the only one:)
 
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Hustlr

Registered User
Oct 1, 2019
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That’s a cool idea and I’m sure we could cheat at the benches at least in the regular season.
 

54thecup

keep on rockin the free world!
Aug 3, 2017
573
194
Muskoka
Here's an interesting clip that is an old lacrosse trick.




Used against Canada too, shame on us!

The interesting this is that the coach was Ted Nolan who has a lax background (was part owner of the Rochester Knighthawks NLL team at the time I believe).

The north - south game flow is so fast now that it's not without its challenges, but it would be interesting to see.

For the stats nerds, we're trying to take out all the inefficiencies of the game right?

Who wouldn't agree that D on Ozone rushes are underdeployed? This is just one additional tactic I see as a way to get more out of your assets at the right time!
 
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Buds17

Registered User
Nov 29, 2015
8,221
3,343
1 more goal tonight and they could have won.

Sure. I'd argue though that not giving up four unanswered goals in about half of a period could have also achieved a victory. Hopefully five goals for will also win most of its share of games throughout the season. The bright side is from battling back after giving up the lead and garnering a point out of it.
 
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