Poll: Should DA be fired?

Should the Blues fire DA if we are still a dumpster fire by Xmas?


  • Total voters
    87

Ted Hoffman

The other Rick Zombo
Dec 15, 2002
28,855
8,110
There's no "f***ing hell yeah" option? Or a, "even if they turn it around, fire him" option?

How about Pronger for GM?
Why? He's been an AGM for what, this is his 2nd year? I know, he's got connections to the city, he's a former alumnus, he really cares. Great, can we get someone who's got experience building a team up instead of throwing the reins to someone who's got scant experience dealing with players from the executive side and hasn't done squat toward building a roster?
 

TruBlu

Registered User
Feb 7, 2016
6,784
2,923
Sometimes you have to bring someone in from the outside to make changes. We can never see the problems that are sitting right under our noses.
 

Saint Loser

"(they) are unavoidably unsafe" - SCOTUS
Mar 16, 2018
508
505
He should not be allowed to touch this roster at all. And IF he is still here by the TDL, then Stillman absolutely must handcuff him from doing anything at all.
 

BlueDream

Registered User
Aug 30, 2011
25,680
14,072
There's no "****ing hell yeah" option? Or a, "even if they turn it around, fire him" option?


Why? He's been an AGM for what, this is his 2nd year? I know, he's got connections to the city, he's a former alumnus, he really cares. Great, can we get someone who's got experience building a team up instead of throwing the reins to someone who's got scant experience dealing with players from the executive side and hasn't done squat toward building a roster?
That's what we did with Armstrong and look what it got us.

I'm not saying Pronger is the definite answer or that an experienced guy is bad, but we shouldn't hire someone JUST because they have experience. It doesn't mean they'll be the right fit. Steve Yzerman and Joe Sakic have done pretty well in their positions. Pronger strikes me as a guy that would be pretty successful in that role, but it's anyone's guess.

This is how I feel about coaches too. Would I rather have Sheldon Keefe or Michel Therrien hired as head coach in the Summer? Probably Keefe. But knowing Armstrong, he would go with the guy with experience (Therrien) and he'd probably suck.

What experienced GMs have a proven track record of building a Cup winner that are actually available right now?
 
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Ranksu

Crotch Academy ftw
Sponsor
Apr 28, 2014
19,661
9,296
Lapland
No at least now.

I was one biggest Army basher, but he has done great job last couple off-season to make team better. Ofc it doesn't show in the standings, but get rid of Lehterä, Berglund and Sobotka was great moves. Upgrade them to Schenn and ROR.

Trade away Stastny when team didn't have change for deep playoff run.

Only negative thing what I see is if Army fails to get right coach for us.

I view Army has done mistakes, but his last couple year moves has showed he's very good GM.

Its not his fault players are playing badly.

Every lost will be on players when Yeo is gone.

But if there is locker room problem and two groups. Negative pkayers have to get fired away no matter what is their status on team.
 

Frenzy31

Registered User
May 21, 2003
7,175
1,995
I said No.

He has done a great job over the last two summers and decent job prior to. He managed to control our cap situation very well with tying up our key FAs to reasonable deals. Our bad contracts were all under 5 million per year (So no Lucic types) and he was able to move them for solid returns (Schenn and ROR). Not everyone of his trades have worked out, but the majority have worked in our favor.

He brought in solid UFAs and has managed to keep most of our first rounders. Maybe waited to long to fire coaches, but for Hitch, the summer after he should have been fired we got to the Western Finals. And Yeo did a great job when he took over getting us into the playoffs and past the first round. But Yeo needed to go about 2 weeks prior to dumping him.

But I would put him in the top 10 or so GMs. There are some that are clearly above him like Steve Y, but I put him on the 2nd tier.

This year is a complete cluster*****. I don't put this on him. Getting ROR for Sobi and Berglund was a great deal. Bozak and Perron have been good additions. I felt and SO DID EVERYONE here that we had a great summer...... There where high expectations for the team which is why we are all so pissed.

At this point, I am good with riding out the year and drafting in the top 5. And taking a swing at it next year. I really dont want this team to go on a tear and just miss the playoffs so we lose our draft pick this year.
 

Pizza!Pizza!

Registered User
Sep 25, 2018
4,716
7,183
On the one hand- fire him, he deserves it for his coaching decisions and the Blues' best chance of being a contender is to tank and rebuild from the ground up.

On the other hand, Army's trading abilities are the only reason the Blues have done as *well* as they have up to this point. His dumping of garbage in exchange for ROR was f***ing awe-inspiring. The only offseason move he made that was Pejorative Slured was bringing Perron back. Even if the Blues somehow make the playoffs it just means they'll have a boat anchor eating up top 6 minutes.

If the Blues are trying to salvage this season, then they need someone like Armstrong to wheel and deal and rebuild on the fly.

Your move Stillman.
 

RORbacon

Registered User
May 14, 2014
3,657
1,974
Central Illinois
On the one hand- fire him, he deserves it for his coaching decisions and the Blues' best chance of being a contender is to tank and rebuild from the ground up.

On the other hand, Army's trading abilities are the only reason the Blues have done as *well* as they have up to this point. His dumping of garbage in exchange for ROR was ****ing awe-inspiring. The only offseason move he made that was ******ed was bringing Perron back. Even if the Blues somehow make the playoffs it just means they'll have a boat anchor eating up top 6 minutes.

If the Blues are trying to salvage this season, then they need someone like Armstrong to wheel and deal and rebuild on the fly.

Your move Stillman.

You do realize Perron is only behind ROR and Vova in points, correct? Besides points, he’s the only one that seems to give a shit lately.
 

ZigZagBluesFan

Registered User
Sep 30, 2010
390
296
I'm torn. On one hand I can see that certain players are playing way below their ability, to the point where it almost seems completely unpredictable. For example, I don't know if I've ever seen a defensive unit on an NHL team commit so many brainless errors. I have a hard time putting the blame on Army when these players are clearly underachieving.

On the other hand, there's a problem with the culture of this team. It's become very clear. What set this team apart the last year when we made a deep run was that it was one of the hardest working teams we'd seen. I don't see that anymore. We also went back and forth between trying to get bigger and more physical or smaller and faster. Instead we haven't committed to either strategy. This team has no identity and I feel like Armstrong is to blame for some of that.

We're facing a very tumultuous time when we're going to have to start moving pieces of the core and if you do so in trades for futures that don't work out, we're going to be looking at a rebuild that could take a long time.

I don't know what to do at this point. This years iteration of the Blues has been the most unpredictable and frustrating team I've ever followed in St. Louis across all sports. I'm throwing my hands up to the hockey gods at this point. I don't know.
 

Pizza!Pizza!

Registered User
Sep 25, 2018
4,716
7,183
You do realize Perron is only behind ROR and Vova in points, correct? Besides points, he’s the only one that seems to give a **** lately.
You do realize I said the playoffs right? You know that thing that Perron has never shown up for in his career and got healthy scratched during the SCF...
 
Last edited:

PiggySmalls

Oink Oink MF
Mar 7, 2015
6,107
3,516
You can have a new GM here tomorrow, but until the players start to actually give a f*** and play with heart. No GM is going to fix that with the current roster. Worst damn part about the NHL is guranteed contracts, Those players are getting their money regardless. So clearly there are still some of them that are too much a passenger.
 

Evocable Manager

Registered User
Apr 20, 2016
3,837
883
St. Louis
You can have a new GM here tomorrow, but until the players start to actually give a **** and play with heart. No GM is going to fix that with the current roster. Worst damn part about the NHL is guranteed contracts, Those players are getting their money regardless. So clearly there are still some of them that are too much a passenger.
Surely a team down 3-0 with no heart or passion would even attempt to try and claw their way back into the game...
 

Frenzy31

Registered User
May 21, 2003
7,175
1,995
Surely a team down 3-0 with no heart or passion would even attempt to try and claw their way back into the game...

They were down 3-0 because they were out shot 16 to 4 in the first period. And really only played the last 30 minutes of the game. If they had shown up with a full 60 minute effort or even 40 minute effort we would have won.....
 

ort

Registered User
Mar 6, 2012
1,036
1,074
I'm so down on the team right now, that I'm in favor of firing everyone. Trade the whole team and go 100% rebuild. Who cares. What does it matter?

I'd rather watch a bunch of bright eyed kids lose than a bunch of uninspired veterans lose. Who cares.

It's not like anything good will ever happen to the team or it's fans. So why does any of it matter.

The Blues were put here to be a stepping stone for the good teams of the league. We're the Washington generals of the NHL. We're like the 14th guy Arnold Swartzenegger kills in the big final battle. If we're lucky we'll at least get a good one liner as he kills us. But more than likely we're the 3rd thug on the left who dies when he shoots a gas canister.

We don't matter. We've never mattered and we never will. The management doesn't care. The players don't care. The league doesn't care. Why should we care?
 

ort

Registered User
Mar 6, 2012
1,036
1,074
The only constant in Blues hockey is disappoint. Year after year... it's disappointment.

Losing is the only thing that binds this team together. Losing is all this team knows and has ever known. It's a losing bunch of losers who lose and nothing good ever happens.

They just come up with fresh and unique ways of disappointing their bizarrely loyal fanbase year after year.
 
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Pizza!Pizza!

Registered User
Sep 25, 2018
4,716
7,183
The only constant in Blues hockey is disappoint. Year after year... it's disappointment.

Losing is the only thing that binds this team together. Losing is all this team knows and has ever known. It's a losing bunch of losers who lose and nothing good ever happens.

They just come up with fresh and unique ways of disappointing their bizarrely loyal fanbase year after year.
Do yourself a favor and go on Amazon and for $1.99 each you can buy the broadcasts of the old Blues games from the 80's. Jacques Demers standing on the bench and yelling at players/refs. Watching them play a hard 60 mins while rolling only 2 lines and having only 12 players on the bench because the team was bankrupt will cheer you up after watching the current shit show. They used to have heart, which means its possible to get back there.

I'm so down on the team right now, that I'm in favor of firing everyone. Trade the whole team and go 100% rebuild. Who cares. What does it matter?

I'd rather watch a bunch of bright eyed kids lose than a bunch of uninspired veterans lose. Who cares.

It's not like anything good will ever happen to the team or it's fans. So why does any of it matter.

The Blues were put here to be a stepping stone for the good teams of the league. We're the Washington generals of the NHL. We're like the 14th guy Arnold Swartzenegger kills in the big final battle. If we're lucky we'll at least get a good one liner as he kills us. But more than likely we're the 3rd thug on the left who dies when he shoots a gas canister.

We don't matter. We've never mattered and we never will. The management doesn't care. The players don't care. The league doesn't care. Why should we care?

Seriously, if they blew up the team and only spent the cap floor and had all AHLers and undrafted kids they'd at least play with heart and would be an underdog worthy of rooting for.
 
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Ted Hoffman

The other Rick Zombo
Dec 15, 2002
28,855
8,110
That's what we did with Armstrong and look what it got us.
Actually, Armstrong had experience taking an elite roster and making it steadily worse and a chronic playoff underachiever. [Kind of sounds familiar.]

I'm not saying Pronger is the definite answer or that an experienced guy is bad, but we shouldn't hire someone JUST because they have experience. It doesn't mean they'll be the right fit. Steve Yzerman and Joe Sakic have done pretty well in their positions. Pronger strikes me as a guy that would be pretty successful in that role, but it's anyone's guess.
Yzerman had 4 years under Ken Holland, but also spent a decent amount of time learning from the side as a player. He also had Steve Stamkos on his roster, which is a pretty good building block to start with.

Sakic had about 3 years as an advisor before officially assuming the GM duties; even that final year when he was largely doing GM stuff, he had Greg Sherman helping and even now Sherman's around as needed. Who's going to fill that role if you bring Pronger in and make him the GM? Dave Taylor's about the only guy in the organization who has experience as a GM, but he's a DA hire; if you're cleaning out the front office does he get the boot too?


This is how I feel about coaches too. Would I rather have Sheldon Keefe or Michel Therrien hired as head coach in the Summer? Probably Keefe. But knowing Armstrong, he would go with the guy with experience (Therrien) and he'd probably suck.
Well, I did once upon a time think Therrien would lead the Canadiens to a Cup. Once upon a time - you know, before he got canned by the Habs, then the Pens, then the Habs [again].

Keefe, ... someone elsewhere brought up a good point. Remember when Dallas Eakins was the hot name on the market because of his success with the Marlies? Then he went to Edmonton and ... well, he's not nearly the hot name he used to be. The thought is that Keefe looks great because it's the Marlies and Toronto can plow all kinds of resources into hockey ops; if you put him somewhere that can't freely lob those $, is he going to still look that good? I'm lobbing it out as food for thought, not to argue that he's not a guy to be considered.


What experienced GMs have a proven track record of building a Cup winner that are actually available right now?
That's narrowing the field to an incredibly small couple of guys and making the search unrealistic. Dean Lombardi would be the only choice available, but by all accounts he's tied to the Flyers for a couple years with a pretty iron-clad contract. If we're going to look for a guy with some past management experience who might fit well, I'd look at the following:

* Tom Fitzgerald, assistant GM in New Jersey. Not sure if he would want to leave New Jersey seeing as how his family has set roots there, but with Brodeur back in the Devils organization and Shero inching toward thin ice, but he's got a decent amount of experience [even if a large part of it is under Shero] and most reports think very highly of him. I think you give it a shot.
* Bill Zito, assistant GM in Columbus. He's been AGM there for a while now, and he's a former agent so he's familiar with both sides of the table. He's watched what Kekalainen has done building up the Blue Jackets, so he could bring some of that experience with him. Again, not sure he jumps Columbus for St. Louis but I think you give it a shot. [Note: Philadelphia is thought to be pursuing him.]
* Mike Vellucci, assistant GM in Carolina. Also the head coach at Charlotte [AHL]. He ran operations in Plymouth [OHL] and the Whalers were competitive year in and year out. [Also had good success with Detroit Compuware in the NAHL in the mid-90s, so maybe you also look at him as a head coaching candidate?]
* Bill Guerin, assistant GM in Pittsburgh. Highly regarded by many, considered a future GM somewhere, but seems to be the eventual heir to Jim Rutherford's position as GM.

Otherwise, if you're going off the board:
* Brian Burke. [Nah, just kidding - though I'd be tempted to bring him in for a year to be a special advisor to give a really critical look at the franchise and suggest improvements.]
* Pierre McGuire. [Nah, just kidding. Almost entirely.]
 

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