Post-Game Talk: PO #4 | Penguins at FLYERS | Wed., April 18, 2018, 7:00 p.m. ET

[SanBlom]

see what a 37 year old dominik hasek got on in a trade and compare that to a 32 year old quick.

that is the last time a goalie of quicks caliber was traded in their relative prime.

I cant think of anything even close to this offer when Hasek was traded? Who was it? Found this article though, which I thought was pretty neat and interesting. Dominik Hasek Trade Tree – Minimal Return for a Franchise Great

 

[TheKingPin]

Wow. Those lines and d pairs are an abomination. He’s going in the opposite direction of what needs to be done. Amac has been horrible outside that one game and manning is just horrendous. Gudas has offered very little. And you bench Sanheim for amac and manning?! Wtf is wrong with you!

Filpulla centering Giroux! Wtf!

 

[SanBlom]

kozlov, a first, and a conditional 3rd in 2001?

Do keep in mind too...that the landscape of the NHL is very different with the cap now.

Hart, Frost, and a 1st does not compare to that at all. Hart has all the makings of a FRANCHISE Goalie and possibly what Quick is. Frost appears to be a 1st line Center in the making, and a 1st. I dont see how they add up. Frost could be as good or better than Kozlov was, the 1st is a 1st, and Hart = 3rd???

The point of getting Quick is to solidify the position WHILE mentoring Hart. He's out for sure.
Frost, besides what we did to get him and the fact that he is the brightest spot in a position of need for the future....I cant see him involved in any deal like this.

But, what would you do? I know I'm open to a 1st. Just dont know what the add would be.

 

[Jtown]

kozlov, a first, and a conditional 3rd in 2001?

Do keep in mind too...that the landscape of the NHL is very different with the cap now.

A guy of quicks caliber has not been traded since Roy, and that is after roy had a few bad years in Montreal. Its been 22 years since that trade. Since that time we have seen hall of fame hart winning centerman traded, we have seen hall of fame hart winning dman traded. That is how rare a player of quick's caliber is traded. So if we are trading for him buckle up and be prepared for what he will cost.

 

[Ruck Over]

This feels like it's going to end the same way as it did for Bill Barber and the Ottawa series.

I see your Bill Barber and Ottawa series fait accompli, and raise you a Bill Barber and Buffalo series conclusion.

 

[BernieParent]

A guy of quicks caliber has not been traded since Roy, and that is after roy had a few bad years in Montreal. Its been 22 years since that trade. Since that time we have seen hall of fame hart winning centerman traded, we have seen hall of fame hart winning dman traded. That is how rare a player of quick's caliber is traded. So if we are trading for him buckle up and be prepared for what he will cost.

The Roy situation isn't comparable. After Mario Tremblay waited until 9 goals had been scored on him to pull him, Roy infamously stalked off the ice and told President Corey that he had played his last game for the Canadiens. The rest is another chapter in the Canadiens disastrous recent history.

I doubt the Flyers and Kings could come to a mutually acceptable agreement for Quick. But that is the level of deal I think this team needs for a defibrillator to the roster, particularly at the G position.

 

[Harhis]

Wow. Those lines and d pairs are an abomination. He’s going in the opposite direction of what needs to be done. Amac has been horrible outside that one game and manning is just horrendous. Gudas has offered very little. And you bench Sanheim for amac and manning?! Wtf is wrong with you!

Filpulla centering Giroux! Wtf!

Only explanation is that Hak is really employed by Pens and his job is to make Flyers bad. Makes perfect sense!

 

[Jtown]

The Roy situation isn't comparable. After Mario Tremblay waited until 9 goals had been scored on him to pull him, Roy infamously stalked off the ice and told President Corey that he had played his last game for the Canadiens. The rest is another chapter in the Canadiens disastrous recent history.

I doubt the Flyers and Kings could come to a mutually acceptable agreement for Quick. But that is the level of deal I think this team needs for a defibrillator to the roster, particularly at the G position.

You are correct. I think that even strengthens my point on the circumstances behind goalie trade of this caliber. So far we have 37 year old hasek, and 29 year old disgruntled patrick roy.

 

[achdumeingute]

A guy of quicks caliber has not been traded since Roy, and that is after roy had a few bad years in Montreal. Its been 22 years since that trade. Since that time we have seen hall of fame hart winning centerman traded, we have seen hall of fame hart winning dman traded. That is how rare a player of quick's caliber is traded. So if we are trading for him buckle up and be prepared for what he will cost.

quick is at the strata of "hes worth more to his current team" ECT. Part of the reason we dont trade Giroux is that we will probably get half his value back. Better to just keep a player that useful and hope it turns around while he's still here.

I dont think the Kings will get what hes worth. I also dont think they will deal him because Doughty is for sure gone then.

 

[Flyrs21]

If Patrick, Konecny and Provorov were the only players returning next season I wouldn't even care

 

[Jtown]

quick is at the strata of "hes worth more to his current team" ECT. Part of the reason we dont trade Giroux is that we will probably get half his value back. Better to just keep a player that useful and hope it turns around while he's still here.

I dont think the Kings will get what hes worth. I also dont think they will deal him because Doughty is for sure gone then.

i dont think he is dealt ,and if he was he would have a laundry list of suitors.

 

[BringBackHakstol]

It’s not all the players fault, I never said that, but good job misrepresenting my argument to fit your pigeon-holed generalized way of dealing with opinions you don’t agree with. When I say full rebuild, I mean the coaching staff needs to be ENTIRELY replaced as well.

However, the teams best players (besides G probably) just aren’t good enough. Again, making the playoffs can be a matter of talent, but if you can’t translate that to a different environment of higher intensity and higher stakes, then you aren’t good enough to win when it matters. They have, objectively, demonstrated that over an extended period of time at this point. It’s not working.

But, ad hominem probably works too, so keep doing that, champ.

There is no team in the league that has had playoff success in recent years being carried in the way this team would have to be by just a handful of players.

Your expectations are unfair of those players. They can't be properly evaluated like this with such utter dreck as depth. Even Malkin and Crosby had a lot of tough times until they were able to really add some great depth to that team (and an amazing coach, coincidentally).

 

[TheKingPin]

Only explanation is that Hak is really employed by Pens and his job is to make Flyers bad. Makes perfect sense!

It’s exactly what someone would do if they were trying to lose.

 

[BringBackHakstol]

Here it comes.

The guy is going to scratch Sanheim for Hagg! In this series!

In this series where quick attack and puck movement have completely decimated him, this guy's answer is taking out his arguably best guy at doing that for ROBERT HAGG

I know that we've seen everything we need to know about this guy, but if that isn't Dave Hakstol's complete incompetence in a nutshell, I don't know what is

 

[Rebels57]

If Patrick, Konecny and Provorov were the only players returning next season I wouldn't even care

I love how 4 games into the Playoffs and some people forget about Girouxs Hart calibre season, Couturiers selke calibre season, a career year from Jake and Ghost, etc.

Such utter nonsense.

 

[hatcher]

If Patrick, Konecny and Provorov were the only players returning next season I wouldn't even care

That should be it. Can't win with the rest. To easy to play against and they do nothing in return.

 

[Beef Invictus]

There is no team in the league that has had playoff success in recent years being carried in the way this team would have to be by just a handful of players.

Your expectations are unfair of those players. They can't be properly evaluated like this with such utter dreck as depth. Even Malkin and Crosby had a lot of tough times until they were able to really add some great depth to that team (and an amazing coach, coincidentally).

This can't be emphasized enough. How quickly everyone forgets how Crosby and Malkin were viewed pre-Sullivan.

 

[onlylordsvsmorebp]

it would be hart, frost and a 1st. Love quick, but you can't give up that much for a goalie his age.

hopefully wouldnt take THAT much...we could not, would not do that.

 

[Flyrs21]

I love how 4 games into the Playoffs and some people forget about Girouxs Hart calibre season, Couturiers selke calibre season, a career year from Jake and Ghost, etc.

Such utter nonsense.

let me be clear, I don't care if Giroux is here next year because I don't want him around this flaming pile of garbage and have to suffer. Lol

 

[onlylordsvsmorebp]

who set up the knights?? were they just lucky about who was unprotected or....

 

[Magua]

This can't be emphasized enough. How quickly everyone forgets how Crosby and Malkin were viewed pre-Sullivan.

There was serious talk that they were past their window. Malkin needed to be traded, etc.

Lo and behold, some young depth adds, the Kessel trade (which is what people want to do with Voracek.....except we're Toronto in this situation), and the crucial decision of moving on from the life-sucking Johnston -- who really was the source of many of their issues -- to Sullivan changed the narrative completely. Now it's: how many Cups can the Penguins win in the next 3-5 years on top of their 2-peat already?

But the Penguins fired Johnson less than 1.5 seasons into his Penguins career. To be fair, their expectations were higher at the time, but our timeline is no less a ticking clock.

 

[kelmitchell]

If Patrick, Konecny and Provorov were the only players returning next season I wouldn't even care

Ghost? 102 point giroux? You can stop now

 

[SanBlom]

Ghost? 102 point giroux? You can stop now

I dont understand why there is so much Ghost bashing these days. He is exactly what we wanted him to be and we got it by only using a 3rd rounder to get him! He has exceeded expectations, if anything...

 

[deadhead]

Sullivan deserves some credit, but he also had good timing.

First time Penguins won, they were unsustainable, b/c of the divergence of ages:
Gonchar (34), Scudari (30), Gill (33), Eaton (31), Guerin (38), Cooke (30), Fedotenko (30), Satan (34), Adams (31)
Malkin (22), Crosby (21), Letang (21), Staal (20), Talbot (24), Kennedy (22)
They only had 99 points that year, then got hot in the playoffs, but the depth aged and they couldn't add new talent fast enough.

They added Neal in 2010-11, Niskanen in 2011-12, Sutter in 2012-13, Maata in 2013-14, not enough, so they resorted to trades and FA in 2014:
Hornqvist and Spaling for Neal in 2014.
Perron for 1st rd pick in 2014
Comeau FA in 2014
Downie FA in 2014
Erhoff FA in 2014

Still not enough, so more moves in 2015:
Dumoulin had come up for the 2014 playoffs, Sheary, Rust & Kuhnhackl
Kessel & 2nd for Spaling, Kapanen (1st 2014), 1st 2015 and 3rd
Bonino & 2nd for Sutter & 3rd
Schultz for 3rd rd
Cole for Bortuzzo & 7th
Hagelin for Perron
TDL Daley for Scudari

So why Sullivan deserves some credit, the upsurge is also the result of "win now" trades and young depth.
While they made some minor moves in 2016 and 2017, it was the deals of the summer of 2015 that made the difference.

 

[Van Buren Boy]

A guy of quicks caliber has not been traded since Roy, and that is after roy had a few bad years in Montreal. Its been 22 years since that trade. Since that time we have seen hall of fame hart winning centerman traded, we have seen hall of fame hart winning dman traded. That is how rare a player of quick's caliber is traded. So if we are trading for him buckle up and be prepared for what he will cost.

Hasek was traded after that and of course Bobrovsky but that's before he got gud