Players own League - funded by former NY mayor Rudy Giuliani?

[Schlep Rock]

Ruperts friends could come up with 5 Billion dollars within 15 minutes. If this is a serious report, it's interesting to say the least

Who knows where it goes but the Star is reporting it's already been sent off to Goldman Sach's, etc. so it's serious enough to take the time to write and formulate a 71-page business plan and begin circulating it.

I'll bet my life that they have proposals for arena issues, etc. in that plan and it might seem far fetched but at least it's being explored.

 

[Poignant Discussion*]

Who knows where it goes but the Star is reporting it's already been sent off to Goldman Sach's, etc. so it's serious enough to take the time to write and formulate a 71-page business plan and begin circulating it.

I'll bet my life that they have proposals for arena issues, etc. in that plan and it might seem far fetched but at least it's being explored.

It's interesting for sure. Especially since FOX's ratings have been skyrocketing.

 

[tantalum]

Those folks who want to buy the NHL have offered a similar amount for the NHL. They have also said that there is no way they would invest that kind of money to start up a league. They want an the established league with histroy behind it for their $4.5 bil dollars. Raising the $5 billion, finding arenas, finding players etc etc etc isn't going to be done in a few months. It would be unlikely to happen in a year. Are the players really willing to pursue this option while not getting paid for another 12-24 months while having fingers crossed that things work out? That the NHL is still off the ice? Somehow I doubt it.

 

[habfan4]

An NHLPA organized league is a long shot but don't laugh at $500 million per firm... I've seen venture capital firms put that or more in companies that you'd never imagine them getting involved in and bam, there you go!

It's a long shot but let's not laugh it off right away.

Finding 10 firms to cough up a half billion each on what has been a losing venture would not be not impossible, but it's certainly not a slam dunk either.

 

[DuklaNation]

This concept is a joke and should be treated as such. Lame, desperate, pathetic bargaining ploy.

 

[txomisc]

Check out the latest Gossip strip



Interesting power move !!!!!!!!!!!

Yeah, real smart. Mention right off the bat that the only reason you are looking into the idea is bargaining power. That really serves to make the idea legitimate.

 

[Poignant Discussion*]

Those folks who want to buy the NHL have offered a similar amount for the NHL. They have also said that there is no way they would invest that kind of money to start up a league. They want an the established league with histroy behind it for their $4.5 bil dollars. Raising the $5 billion, finding arenas, finding players etc etc etc isn't going to be done in a few months. It would be unlikely to happen in a year. Are the players really willing to pursue this option while not getting paid for another 12-24 months while having fingers crossed that things work out? That the NHL is still off the ice? Somehow I doubt it.

I have a few questions

How exactly is rasing 5 Billion dollars difficult for someone like Rupert Murdoch?

How exactly does it gain the owners anything to leave hockey arenas empty when they could have events in them?

I'm sure the owners of established NHL teams will be allowed to "move" thier team into the new league for a price of course. And whats double good for them is there most likely would be "protection" from losing tons of money.

How hard would it be to find players?

I believe there are 600 or so looking for work right now.

It would take at least 6-12 months to pull it off, and there is no guarantee that the NHL will start by then anyways.

Small non profitable markets - Gone
Players Salaries - Could stay where they are because of the increased revenue that should be created
Every home in the USA - Would have access to hockey


They could change the rules (4 on 4), make the nets bigger or do whatever they like because its a NEW league

I bet it would sell in the USA

 

[tantalum]

Those folks who want to buy the NHL have offered a similar amount for the NHL. They have also said that there is no way they would invest that kind of money to start up a league. They want an the established league with histroy behind it for their $4.5 bil dollars. I don't see other business men being any different. Heck our start up company has a billionaire and a few that are close on the BOD's, a proven technology and it's hard raising even a minute fraction of that!

Raising the $5 billion, finding arenas, finding players etc etc etc isn't going to be done in a few months. It would be unlikely to happen in a year. Are the players really willing to pursue this option while not getting paid for another 12-24 months while having fingers crossed that things work out? That the NHL is still off the ice? Somehow I doubt it.

 

[dawgbone]

That is true ...

but the big market owners in this dispute are losing the most by no nhl hockey ..

Whose is to say if this battle continues at their expense for the good of the small market teams that owners like Tannenbaum in Toronto, Dolan in NY and Snider in Philly will not open their arenas and allow them to be leased out during this battle. They have little to say in this CBA outcome as there voices are not heard ..

If I am them how long do I sit idle as Bettman tries to save Nashville and Florida and Carolina ??

Bettman has gone as far as saying if he doesn't get a deal in the next month and they can't raise funds now then they migh as well cancel the season .. If he did that ..

Who is to stop these Billionaire owners to line their pockets via leasing out the arena's while Rudy Guliani pays the players ??

What a gravey train for them ..

The leasing out of the Arena's would earn them more profit the running the teams themselves !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Zero player cost and the big stars that fans want to see will be on the ice .. Big market could sell that .. It would be like the original 6 again in star quality on the ice ..

Something to think about ..

A thinking... what a concept...

But maybe you should have thought about this for a second before posting this, because it couldn't be farther from the truth.

Really think about this for a few minutes. The Leafs and Rangers are by far the most valuable NHL franchises. Why would they risk completely devaluing thier franchises (if a rival league takes up shop and supplants the NHL), just to make a little bit of money in an arena lease?

Does that make any sense to you at all? The leafs have far more to lose by allowing a new league in thier building than they have to gain. Even if the lockout lasts 2 full seasons, the fallout could be disastrous if they tried something like this.

Imagine if the leafs lease out the ACC to this rival league and it catches on. It becomes insanely popular and the PA just abandones the NHL. The Toronto Maple leafs are now finished. MLSE now has to try and buy into this new league, meaning they completely lose all value on the Leafs franchise, plus have to pay $100mil (or whatever) to buy into this league.

Seems pretty disatrous to me.

I don't see how you can possibly think that leasing out the ACC would be a good thing for the Leafs... not if you actually think about it.

 

[Poignant Discussion*]

This concept is a joke and should be treated as such. Lame, desperate, pathetic bargaining ploy.

Why is it a joke? Do you think Rupert Murdoch does things for a joke?

Do you think Rupert Murdoch would be a part of a pathetic bargaining ploy?

We are talking about one of the richest men in the WORLD

I highly doubt if this is true its a "joke"

 

[SENSible1*]

This concept is a joke and should be treated as such. Lame, desperate, pathetic bargaining ploy.

Pretty much sums it up.

The timing tells the story. The PA had this laughable ploy in the can for quite some time and pull it out on the eve of the biggest meeting in the dispute.

Coicidence?

 

[ryz]

You have got to be kidding me. I can just see it now, Saskatoon vs. Montana and Amarillo vs. Omaha in rinks holding 4000 people. Yeah this will go over real well.

It *MIGHT* work as a USAHL or something, but no team in a major Canadian center not named Flames, Oilers, Senators, Canadiens, Maple Leafs or Canucks is gonna sell 15000+ tickets 40 times a year.

Big league hockey is in quite a pickle in NA. It needs US $$$ and Canadian interest to be a viable #1 league.

 

[DuklaNation]

Why is it a joke? Do you think Rupert Murdoch does things for a joke?

Do you think Rupert Murdoch would be a part of a pathetic bargaining ploy?

We are talking about one of the richest men in the WORLD

I highly doubt if this is true its a "joke"

Let me know when News Corp issues an official press release confirming Murdoch's interest. Otherwise, its a joke. The whole concept is not practical.

 

[CGG]

Pretty much sums it up.

The timing tells the story. The PA had this laughable ploy in the can for quite some time and pull it out on the eve of the biggest meeting in the dispute.

Coicidence?

How in the hell does everyone assume this is the players' doing?

Nowhere in the article does it say the players are involved at all. It's not Bob Goodenow and Arturs Irbe out going door to door trying to raise the $5 billion to start an NHLPA league. It's a group of investors.

For the last time, IT'S NOT THE NHLPA ORGANIZING A LEAGUE. Get that through your heads. To think that Goodenow is using Rupert Murdoch and Rudy Guliani in some kind of scam / media ploy is absolutely absurd. Give your heads a shake.

Even the title of this thread is crap -- "Players Own League"? Nope. "Investors Trying To Set Up Another League In Which NHLPA Members Might One Day Play In Theoretically" is what the thread title should be.

 

[dawgbone]

Why is it a joke? Do you think Rupert Murdoch does things for a joke?

Do you think Rupert Murdoch would be a part of a pathetic bargaining ploy?

We are talking about one of the richest men in the WORLD

I highly doubt if this is true its a "joke"

I'm sorry... I must have missed the part where it said Rupert Murdoch has signed on and is giving this thing a go.

Before we count chickens and eggs, maybe we should go back and read the part where it says may act as an emissary. That doesn't mean Murdoch has anything to do with this, just that the possibility exists.

 

[Poignant Discussion*]

A thinking... what a concept...

But maybe you should have thought about this for a second before posting this, because it couldn't be farther from the truth.

Really think about this for a few minutes. The Leafs and Rangers are by far the most valuable NHL franchises. Why would they risk completely devaluing thier franchises (if a rival league takes up shop and supplants the NHL), just to make a little bit of money in an arena lease?

Does that make any sense to you at all? The leafs have far more to lose by allowing a new league in thier building than they have to gain. Even if the lockout lasts 2 full seasons, the fallout could be disastrous if they tried something like this.

Imagine if the leafs lease out the ACC to this rival league and it catches on. It becomes insanely popular and the PA just abandones the NHL. The Toronto Maple leafs are now finished. MLSE now has to try and buy into this new league, meaning they completely lose all value on the Leafs franchise, plus have to pay $100mil (or whatever) to buy into this league.

Seems pretty disatrous to me.

I don't see how you can possibly think that leasing out the ACC would be a good thing for the Leafs... not if you actually think about it.

But what if the NHL teams could "move" which I think the idea would be anyways. It would just take one established team to move into the new league to all of a sudden make all the other owners think.

Since everyone hates them, lets use the Toronto Maple Leafs. A team worth 250 million dollars and then lets use the New York Rangers another team worth 250 million. They decide the strike has gone on too long and its hurting their bottom line. Rupert Murdoch shows both teams a business plan and how instead of being worth 250 million they could be worth 500 million in 10-15 years. Then Detroit sees whats happening and they want part of the pie. Eventually you get 10-15 owners willing to jump ship to the new league.

All of a sudden the buildings are not a problem any more. The teams that lose money are gone. Plus the owners know they have a 5 billion dollar buffer in case someone gets into trouble.

Now we know under any new CBA reducing the player roster would be a major sticking point. But it's a new league! so 12 fowards, 4 defensemen and 2 goaltenders are the roster limit and the owners save MORE money. The bigger paid players won't give a crap because they are still seeing their 6 million dollar paycheques because of the added revenue.

You ask any of the owners if they would rather be on CBC on Saturday night or on Fox on a Saturday night.

You know this idea is so left field, it almost makes me thinks the bigger market owners are behind it

 

[Poignant Discussion*]

I'm sorry... I must have missed the part where it said Rupert Murdoch has signed on and is giving this thing a go.

Before we count chickens and eggs, maybe we should go back and read the part where it says may act as an emissary. That doesn't mean Murdoch has anything to do with this, just that the possibility exists.

I agree, if Rupert Murdoch (or someone else with a ton of money and or television clout) isn't part of it. The chance of it working is nil.

If what I understand is true and I'm just going on what people on here are saying...it could be VERY good for HOCKEY

Screw the NHLPA and the NHL

Both have been dead to me now for almost a year

 

[nyrmessier011]

Good...If they actually think they can make this work, go ahead. Bettman and every single owner can go to hell. I just want to see the best players in the world play in the same league. If they have a team in Manhattan or near there, screw Dolan.

 

[A Good Flying Bird*]

Check out the latest Gossip strip



Interesting power move !!!!!!!!!!!

As much as I'd like to believe it, I can't.
If the PA was serious, they'd all ready be all over this thing. I mean, we've all ready lost a season.
And now this is just a back up plan?

ANd seriously, what suckers would invest anywhere near $5 Billion in someone else's backup plan?

 

[Lanny MacDonald*]

I didn't realize Rudy Giuliani was a hockey fan. I wonder if he can name five players outside of New York. And he's going to be the savior to the game? Okie dokie.

 

[dawgbone]

But what if the NHL teams could "move" which I think the idea would be anyways. It would just take one established team to move into the new league to all of a sudden make all the other owners think.

Since everyone hates them, lets use the Toronto Maple Leafs. A team worth 250 million dollars and then lets use the New York Rangers another team worth 250 million. They decide the strike has gone on too long and its hurting their bottom line. Rupert Murdoch shows both teams a business plan and how instead of being worth 250 million they could be worth 500 million in 10-15 years. Then Detroit sees whats happening and they want part of the pie. Eventually you get 10-15 owners willing to jump ship to the new league.

All of a sudden the buildings are not a problem any more. The teams that lose money are gone. Plus the owners know they have a 5 billion dollar buffer in case someone gets into trouble.

Now we know under any new CBA reducing the player roster would be a major sticking point. But it's a new league! so 12 fowards, 4 defensemen and 2 goaltenders are the roster limit and the owners save MORE money. The bigger paid players won't give a crap because they are still seeing their 6 million dollar paycheques because of the added revenue.

You ask any of the owners if they would rather be on CBC on Saturday night or on Fox on a Saturday night.

You know this idea is so left field, it almost makes me thinks the bigger market owners are behind it

Allowing teams to move may work... but then again, the thought of it failing may scare them away.

Imagine MLSE moves their franchise into this new league... the NHL gets pissed and revokes their franchise (thier might be something in their franchise agreement that prohibits them from owning a team in a rival hockey league). This venture fails, and the leafs now have to buy back into the NHL at a big price (because that is exactly what I would do... if MLSE won't do it, you can bet your ass someone will).

 

[ryz]

This is all good comedey here this morning guys!! Keep it up. I'll need some new jokes to read in this thread when I get back from lunch and a sales call or 2.

 

[txomisc]

How in the hell does everyone assume this is the players' doing?

Nowhere in the article does it say the players are involved at all. It's not Bob Goodenow and Arturs Irbe out going door to door trying to raise the $5 billion to start an NHLPA league. It's a group of investors.

For the last time, IT'S NOT THE NHLPA ORGANIZING A LEAGUE. Get that through your heads. To think that Goodenow is using Rupert Murdoch and Rudy Guliani in some kind of scam / media ploy is absolutely absurd. Give your heads a shake.

Even the title of this thread is crap -- "Players Own League"? Nope. "Investors Trying To Set Up Another League In Which NHLPA Members Might One Day Play In Theoretically" is what the thread title should be.

"the players' association, in concert with at least one prominent hockey agent, has considered a plan to start a rival league to the NHL." Nice tirade though. Give your own head a shake, Sparky.

 

[tantalum]

How exactly is rasing 5 Billion dollars difficult for someone like Rupert Murdoch?

Ever tried to get money from a billionaire? They don't throw it around. There will have to be a superb business plan in place and much negotiation with each investor. They may have a lot of money but they aren't willing to lose ANY of it. You have to make a very good case and right now you have a league with 80 years of histroy behind it in terrible financial shape, and that own or are major tenants in the arenas of the major facilities, dropping viewership numbers. A network is not going to give a prime time slot to a sport that doesn't generate prime time type numbers. When the network is based on advertising revenues which are based on ratings a national network is not going to make a lofty committment even if they share common ownership. Those are huge obstacle to overcome while soliciting investors for a similar product. it isn't as easy as thinking they have some money to burn and can afford it.

How exactly does it gain the owners anything to leave hockey arenas empty when they could have events in them?

Perhaps to prevent an competing league from getting a foothold? Nah that couldn't be a reason.

I'm sure the owners of established NHL teams will be allowed to "move" thier team into the new league for a price of course. And whats double good for them is there most likely would be "protection" from losing tons of money.

Those owners are tied to the NHL in ways that none of us really know. They may in fact have agreements in place that will not compete with the NHL in terms of product for X amount of time after leaving the league. I don't know and you don't know. If that isn't in place why would a team, as someone has already mentioned, devalue the club and run the risk of completely folding by going to a new unproven league? It make no sense now and wouldn't even be a consideration until after atleast another full season is lost.

Would that protection be a salary cap or guaranteed profits that PA apologists have been whining about for months?

How hard would it be to find players?

Ask the WHA. It isn't easy to get employees to committ to a start up especially when there are other more established options out there and there have been so many league failures.

It would take at least 6-12 months to pull it off, and there is no guarantee that the NHL will start by then anyways.

12 months would be an absolute minimum to get the finances and in place let alone arena deals, marketing etc etc .

Players Salaries - Could stay where they are because of the increased revenue that should be created

How do they stay where they are? Is this new league all of a sudden going to outperform the 80 year established one and generate $2.1 bil in revenues out of the box? In 5 years? Will these investors be more willing to lose money than the ones in the NHL?

Every home in the USA - Would have access to hockey

Every home in the US has had access to hockey for the past 10 years. A lot of good that's done.

They could change the rules (4 on 4), make the nets bigger or do whatever they like because its a NEW league

The NHL could do the same if they wanted to.

I bet it would sell in the USA

Then invest some of your hard earned cash in it.

 

[CGG]

"the players' association, in concert with at least one prominent hockey agent, has considered a plan to start a rival league to the NHL." Nice tirade though. Give your own head a shake, Sparky.

It says they've considered the plan, not orchestrated the plan. Seems like the investors came to the PA:

"Following the NHL's decision to lock out the players and subsequently cancel the 2004-05 season, the NHLPA has been approached by several different groups proposing alternative options for our members," said Ted Saskin, senior director of the NHLPA.

"Most of these groups have made these proposals on a confidential basis and the NHLPA will not be commenting on them. Our primary focus has always been to reach an agreement with the NHL on a new CBA (collective bargaining agreement)."

The only one with any link to the PA that's involved is Rich Winter, an agent. That's a far cry from Jeremy Roenick and PJ Stock getting $5 billion together to set up an NHLPA league.