Player Discussion: Shayne Gostisbehere 2018-19 edition

[FlyerNutter]

I mean you say that but he’s probably going to see four minutes a night of power play time (ish). The best case scenario is that power play one is back to normal and clicking and that half his time is with Patrick or Hayes line at ES against other teams bottom six and third pair. The potential for exploitation there.

I’d love to see Sanheim and Ghost on that PP1 unit.

Put Ghost in Jakes spot.

Give it to me.

 

[Magua]

If Ghost can’t score with Tyler Pitlick and Michael Raffl, that’s on him. Great players don’t need to be stapled to Sean Couturier.

 

[freakydallas13]

If Ghost can’t score with Tyler Pitlick and Michael Raffl, that’s on him. Great players don’t need to be stapled to Sean Couturier.

If pitlick and raffl are playing 16-18 minutes a night, we have much bigger problems.

 

[prototypical4thliner]

If Ghost can’t score with Tyler Pitlick and Michael Raffl, that’s on him. Great players don’t need to be stapled to Sean Couturier.

 

[Striiker]

If Ghost can’t score with Tyler Pitlick and Michael Raffl, that’s on him. Great players don’t need to be stapled to Sean Couturier.

 

[FLYguy3911]

I mean you say that but he’s probably going to see four minutes a night of power play time (ish). The best case scenario is that power play one is back to normal and clicking and that half his time is with Patrick or Hayes line at ES against other teams bottom six and third pair. The potential for exploitation there.

Take a peak at what his 5v5 scoring looks like when he's playing with bottom 6ers (hint: it's not good).

His career high in PP points is 33, which led the league. No defenseman has cracked the 40 point barrier since 07-08. That's pretty much what he would have to do to flirt with 70 points.

 

[VladDrag]

View attachment 249223

Goddamn it - I just posted this GIF on another thread without seeing this one.

 

[Harhis]

Also the potential to play with inferior teammates who waste his offensive talent.

Ghost being on the bottom pair would be an indefensible joke.

If he playes with 3rd line (JVR/Lindblom, NP and Frost/Farabee and against 3rd/4th lines) I could see that being good thing. IF he gets enough minutes.

Wouldn't be bad thing for NP either to get that offensive help from Ghost.

 

[Striiker]

If he playes with 3rd line (JVR/Lindblom, NP and Frost/Farabee and against 3rd/4th lines) I could see that being good thing. IF he gets enough minutes.

Wouldn't be bad thing for NP either to get that offensive help from Ghost.

I’m 1000% against the whole rational of “he’ll get great/easy matchups!” as a way to defend him playing on the third pair.

The benefit of playing against easy comp is less of a positive than the lower icetime and worse teammates are negative. It completely wastes his potential and ability.

Just look at Couturier. Look at the difference between present day 1C Couts and the version who was used on the 3rd line. Night and day as far as results and overall impact goes because he got better usage and better linemates.

Id assume anyone suggesting Ghost’s likely roster spot is a good thing would be against Couts being lower down the lineup for those fabled matchup advantages. The same logic applies to both players.

 

[Harhis]

I’m 1000% against the whole rational of “he’ll get great/easy matchups!” as a way to defend him playing on the third pair.

The benefit of playing against easy comp is less of a positive than the lower icetime and worse teammates are negative. It completely wastes his potential and ability.

Just look at Couturier. Look at the difference between present day 1C Couts and the version who was used on the 3rd line. Night and day as far as results and overall impact goes because he got better usage and better linemates.

Id assume anyone suggesting Ghost’s likely roster spot is a good thing would be against Couts being lower down the lineup for those fabled matchup advantages. The same logic applies to both players.

Difference with Coots is that he still played against opponents 1st lines but with crappy linemates. We SHOULD have good 3rd line this season.

 

[Striiker]

Difference with Coots is that he still played against opponents 1st lines but with crappy linemates. We SHOULD have good 3rd line this season.

Playing your best offensive defensemen with your bottom 6 is a horrible idea.

If teammates matter for Couts, as we know for a fact that they did, then they also matter for Ghost.

 

[Harhis]

Playing your best offensive defensemen with your bottom 6 is a horrible idea.

If teammates matter for Couts, as we know for a fact that they did, then they also matter for Ghost.

I see where you are coming from. I'm not 100% opposed to trying him with 3rd line, but if that doesn't work he needs to move up to play with top6 forwards.

 

[Tripod]

4 F lines
3 D pairings

Just roll both and have every D pairing play with every line "on average". Then adjust as the game goes on depending on results and situations.

 

[Dooble08]

4 F lines
3 D pairings

Just roll both and have every D pairing play with every line "on average". Then adjust as the game goes on depending on results and situations.

That's too reasonable for here.

 

[Striiker]

I'll believe it when I see it.

 

[TB87]

Was told the other day that the Flyers should trade Ghost for Ristolainen because Ristolainen is better defensively...

 

[Curufinwe]

What's better than 3 RHD in the top 6?

4 RHD.

 

[dragonoffrost]

 

[Curufinwe]

"At 26 he's physically developed"

 

[kudymen]

4 F lines
3 D pairings

Just roll both and have every D pairing play with every line "on average". Then adjust as the game goes on depending on results and situations.

Or you can send VdV, Weise, AMac and Manning out there and wait for the inevitable success

 

[Rebels57]

Or you can send VdV, Weise, AMac and Manning out there and wait for the inevitable success

Sometimes you just have to live for the next shift.

 

[kudymen]

Sometimes you just have to live for the next shift.

Or the next starfish, in some cases

 

[Appleyard]

"At 26 he's physically developed"

I mean, from a human male biological perspective he will likely keep getting physically stronger even if he did not really train that much for the next ~5-8 years or so.

There is always this "age 25" human strength peak thrown out there from a decades old study... but more normalised stuff such as handgrip, bonemass, studies on actual athletes, as well as simply "results" from pure strength contents it is seemingly 30-35.

Though after 30 the fast twitch muscles are going to fade, so that does hinder being able to utilise that physical maturity!

I mean, Ghost is probably just entering his absolute peak now... 26-28 is pretty much it for most players.

 

[deadhead]

Strength may peak a little later than the past (probably due to better conditioning), but mass rarely does without a loss of speed and quickness. Point is he is what he's going to be physically, he's not going to morph into Kimmo Jr.

Only a few "lightweights" play big minutes.
185 lbs <
Klingberg, Spurgeon, Ellis >24
Dumba, Heiskanen > 23
Vatanen, Brodie, Goligoski, Russell >20

 

[FLYguy3911]

4 F lines
3 D pairings

Just roll both and have every D pairing play with every line "on average". Then adjust as the game goes on depending on results and situations.

This never happens. Coaches obsess over matchups.