GWT: PL matchweek 4

[Il Mediano]

Arsenal looks like the 6th best team in the league , which is where they'll finish. Regardless of the defensive/midfield issues , they'll be able to score enough goals with that attacking talent.

Everton might cause some problems in the end, but I doubt it.

 

[Gecklund]

I just don't think they are as bad as people everywhere make them out to be. The Man City loss is tough however it was Unai's first game at the helm and its City; and the Chelsea game was an unlucky loss. They scraped by today but they have been solid thus far.

It's the same thing with United. People love to shit on them to fit their agenda. It's easiest to just ignore it. I think that both United and Arsenal are somewhat similar in that they both have big holes that are obvious.

 

[Blender]

and the Chelsea game was an unlucky loss.

You don't get to be dominated for 75 minutes of a game and call it an "unlucky loss". Possession wasn't close (62/38% Chelsea), shots were 24/15 Chelsea, shots on target were 11/6 Chelsea, etc. Arsenal had a great 15 minute stretch and could have scored more than they did, but Chelsea could have scored a few more as well. Arsenal in no way deserved the win based on the complete game.

 

[robertmac43]

You don't get to be dominated for 75 minutes of a game and call it an "unlucky loss". Possession wasn't close (62/38% Chelsea), shots were 24/15 Chelsea, shots on target were 11/6 Chelsea, etc. Arsenal had a great 15 minute stretch and could have scored more than they did, but Chelsea could have score a few more as well. Arsenal in no way deserved the win based on the complete game.

The 2 missed sitters by Auba and the 1 by Mkhi could have changed that game entirely. Those 3 chances were arguably the best in the game. Unlucky may not be the word for the loss, however that game could very easily been a draw or even an Arsenal win.

 

[TheMoreYouKnow]

It's the same thing with United. People love to **** on them to fit their agenda. It's easiest to just ignore it. I think that both United and Arsenal are somewhat similar in that they both have big holes that are obvious.

Arsenal and United both were pretty dominant clubs in the 90s/00s. People enjoy a good 'fall from grace' narrative. It helped that the two legendary managers responsible for those spells of dominance only left fairly recently. It's like how NFL fans are already excited about the future collapse of the Patriots.

 

[robertmac43]

Arsenal and United both were pretty dominant clubs in the 90s/00s. People enjoy a good 'fall from grace' narrative. It helped that the two legendary managers responsible for those spells of dominance only left fairly recently. It's like how NFL fans are already excited about the future collapse of the Patriots.

And everyone also loves a great "reemergence to grace" story.... Q the Arsenal comeback.

Also been waiting for the Pats fall my whole life....

 

[Il Mediano]

Also been waiting for the Pats fall my whole life....

Yeah, I wish that would just hurry up and happen.

Not holding out hope, though.

 

[KJS14]

I haven't seen N'Zonzi much to comment on him, but Coquelin was hella underrated here. Best ball-winner in the PL besides Kante, and he fit like a glove playing with the little magician Santi Cazorla. He's not a perfect player, but he knew his role.

 

[Jussi]

 

[Cassano]

Only Ozil is who is a much different olayer

Ramsey when healthy is a 15g+a midfielder - poor man's Lampard basically with his versatility as well.
Torreira is simply a better player than Nzonzi - just has way more qualities in his games.

I wouldn't play Nzonzi over either - maybe some starts over Ramsey if we want to set up more defensively. But as a whole - nah.

 

[Cassano]

Emery is predominantly a 4-2-3-1 coach , is he not?

Torreira is a good player (but still a little unproven), Guendouzi is a kid , and Xhaka is a disaster.

You're trying to tell me Nzonzi, currently in his absolute prime, wouldn't walk right into that starting lineup as a holding midfielder and be positive contributor?

Ozil and Ramsey are entirely different players. And no, Torreira is not "significantly better" as a holding midfielder than Nzonzi. In fact, as someone who follows Serie A , I'm pretty confident Nzonzi is actually better. Maybe Torreira will surpass him eventually -- but it isn't today.

This is a bit much.

Torreira is significantly better than Nzonzi. The unproven tag is only there because of his age - his last season with Sampdoria was better than any season Nzonzi had in his career. He is only better at him in the air.

TBH I'm not sure how a CL club didn't snap him up before Arsenal - he is going to be one of the best DMs of this generation.

 

[Gecklund]

Ramsey when healthy is a 15g+a midfielder - poor man's Lampard basically with his versatility as well.
Torreira is simply a better player than Nzonzi - just has way more qualities in his games.

I wouldn't play Nzonzi over either - maybe some starts over Ramsey if we want to set up more defensively. But as a whole - nah.

Really? Ramsey is a 15 goal+assist midfielder? Even if that was true, he still isn't great defensively. Torreira is good for sure and would look great next to N'Zonzi but Torreira is more of a deep playmaker while N'Zonzi is more of a defensive midfielder. It's so hard to compare players like N'Zonzi to other midfielders because his contributions don't show up on any stat sheets.

Also just looked it up Ramsey had 2 15 goal+assist seasons... in 10 years.

 

[Cassano]

Really? Ramsey is a 15 goal+assist midfielder? Even if that was true, he still isn't great defensively. Torreira is good for sure and would look great next to N'Zonzi but Torreira is more of a deep playmaker while N'Zonzi is more of a defensive midfielder.

15 goal + assist totals. He can play well defensively when insulated in a role with a competent (non-Xhaka) ball-player. Like he did with Arteta for a few years before his game fell apart. He can also pretty much play any role on the pitch - super versatile player.

Fair point on Torreira vs Nzonzi, but I think having him as a sole DM role really hinders a team's attacking prowess. That's the big reason I'm not a huge fan of his.

 

[Gecklund]

15 goal + assist totals. He can play well defensively when insulated in a role with a competent (non-Xhaka) ball-player. Like he did with Arteta for a few years before his game fell apart. He can also pretty much play any role on the pitch - super versatile player.

Fair point on Torreira vs Nzonzi, but I think having him as a sole DM role really hinders a team's attacking prowess. That's the big reason I'm not a huge fan of his.

I'm actually very surprised Emery didn't push harder for Nzonzi. Fits the team great

Lacazette
Auba-Ozil-Mkhi
Nzonzi-Torreira

 

[Cassano]

I'm actually very surprised Emery didn't push harder for Nzonzi. Fits the team great

Lacazette
Auba-Ozil-Mkhi
Nzonzi-Torreira

IMO I don't see enough offense/goals/creativity out of that midfield. It's already stagnant as is.

 

[Gecklund]

IMO I don't see enough offense/goals/creativity out of that midfield. It's already stagnant as is.

It would be fine with Ozil, Torreira, and Mkhi as creators and Auba and Lacazette as finishers. It's crazy what a competent DM can do for a team.

 

[Il Mediano]

It's crazy what a competent DM can do for a team.

Might be the most undervalued and poorly judged position by fans.

 

[KJS14]

Might be the most undervalued and poorly judged position by fans.

Idk as everyone here praises guys like Busquets, Kante, Matic, Fabinho, etc on a regular basis. Even Casemiro gets some love in between us saying that he gets away with way too many fouls. But all of those guys can actually pass the ball as well.

Like I said before, I'm a guy that loved Coquelin, but he was a limited DM who needed Cazorla next to him to excel. If Emery would just play Ozil in front of Torreira - Guendouzi or even Torreira - Ramsey then we would be better off. Xhaka is awful.


Edit: your average/casual fan probably does not appreciate the DM's like we do here though, we can agree on that.

 

[robertmac43]

How I miss having Viera supporting the defensive side of things for Arsenal. Got to love the glory days.

 

[S E P H]

Idk as everyone here praises guys like Busquets, Kante, Matic, Fabinho, etc on a regular basis. Even Casemiro gets some love in between us saying that he gets away with way too many fouls. But all of those guys can actually pass the ball as well.

Like I said before, I'm a guy that loved Coquelin, but he was a limited DM who needed Cazorla next to him to excel. If Emery would just play Ozil in front of Torreira - Guendouzi or even Torreira - Ramsey then we would be better off. Xhaka is awful.


Edit: your average/casual fan probably does not appreciate the DM's like we do here though, we can agree on that.

I wouldn't classify Casmeiro as a pure CDM, I think he's more along the lines of a BxB with very physical tendencies/traits which is why he gets a mega amount of yellowcards. He's in the same category of Vidal and Xhaka, but the latter is brain-dead.

 

[Cassano]

Idk as everyone here praises guys like Busquets, Kante, Matic, Fabinho, etc on a regular basis. Even Casemiro gets some love in between us saying that he gets away with way too many fouls. But all of those guys can actually pass the ball as well.

Like I said before, I'm a guy that loved Coquelin, but he was a limited DM who needed Cazorla next to him to excel. If Emery would just play Ozil in front of Torreira - Guendouzi or even Torreira - Ramsey then we would be better off. Xhaka is awful.


Edit: your average/casual fan probably does not appreciate the DM's like we do here though, we can agree on that.

Kante is the best player in EPL IMO.

 

[S E P H]

He's obviously trying to win the marketing/image game with the fans when he eventually gets fired, as the people have already started blaming the higher ups. It's quite easy to spot the British evil-genius tactics here by him.

 

[Gecklund]

He's obviously trying to win the marketing/image game with the fans when he eventually gets fired, as the people have already started blaming the higher ups. It's quite easy to spot the British evil-genius tactics here by him.

Everyone at the club is at fault right now. They didn't get the money to fund new transfers so Woodward couldn't bring in anyone so Mou has to play this negative style so the players are giving up a bit.

 

[Il Mediano]

Everyone at the club is at fault right now. They didn't get the money to fund new transfers so Woodward couldn't bring in anyone so Mou has to play this negative style so the players are giving up a bit.

They didn't get the money?

How much revenue did United haul in last season? The most in the world, no? (or at least top 3).You're telling me the Glazers sucked up all of it?

I think it's more likely Woodward rejected/vetoed Mourinho's targets.

 

[Gecklund]

They didn't get the money?

How much revenue did United haul in last season? The most in the world, no? (or at least top 3).You're telling me the Glazers sucked up all of it?

I think it's more likely Woodward rejected/vetoed Mourinho's targets.

I mean the owners didn't give them the money. There were many articles that said this. Mou was targeting too expensive options after they spent so much money already and it's not like Fred or Dalot were cheap.