GWT: PL Matchweek 23

[Halladay]

They beat West Ham next week they would have beaten every team in the league before the end of January.

 

[Live in the Now]

The thing I don’t get about this seemingly impending failed Bruno transfer is that he would walk straight into the team as their best player. No transfer man worth a damn would haggle over a fee when that’s the case.

Liverpool bungled things when they went for van Dijk by tapping him up, but money never had anything to do with it. The quality of the player should speak for itself, and he’s been available, so I don’t understand the reticence to just pay up. In addition to that it would be smart to preserve a good relationship with Sporting as they rather regularly have these sorts of talents on offer.

 

[hatterson]

The thing I don’t get about this seemingly impending failed Bruno transfer is that he would walk straight into the team as their best player. No transfer man worth a damn would haggle over a fee when that’s the case.

Liverpool bungled things when they went for van Dijk by tapping him up, but money never had anything to do with it. The quality of the player should speak for itself, and he’s been available, so I don’t understand the reticence to just pay up. In addition to that it would be smart to preserve a good relationship with Sporting as they rather regularly have these sorts of talents on offer.

Woodward is completely out of his depth in relation to football stuff.

He’s used to negotiating from strength where he has what someone else needs (United business arrangements) and there’s some competition over it.

In this case, he’s not really from a position of strength. Last time that happened he ended up folding and giving up a ridiculous fee for Maguire, so he doesn’t want to be “embarrassed” again.

It’s clear he doesn’t understand player value in relation to the pitch very well, and he’ll keep getting abused and making mistakes in situations like this until United replace him.

 

[YNWA14]

If this was posted by Curtinho or AB it would've gotten wrecked to pieces.

Henderson is better than people give him credit for. Are there really people who still don’t consider Wijnaldum world class? He’s Liverpool’s best midfielder and has proven himself at the grandest stage time and again. Liverpool haven’t conceded a goal since Gomez was introduced and I think he’s one of the best young defenders in the world, if not the best in his age bracket.

I don’t think you can take anything away from what Klopp has done with this group but I also don’t think you can realistically look at what Liverpool have done the last few seasons and think it could be done without world class players.

 

[hatterson]

Henderson is better than people give him credit for. Are there really people who still don’t consider Wijnaldum world class? He’s Liverpool’s best midfielder and has proven himself at the grandest stage time and again. Liverpool haven’t conceded a goal since Gomez was introduced and I think he’s one of the best young defenders in the world, if not the best in his age bracket.

I don’t think you can take anything away from what Klopp has done with this group but I also don’t think you can realistically look at what Liverpool have done the last few seasons and think it could be done without world class players.

No issues with Wijnaldum.

And yes, Henderson is good, and basically a perfect fit for his current role, but he’s not world class.

 

[I Eat Crow]

Oh, if you mean last year and this year with no CL, then sure. I thought you meant 2 more years beyond this.

Precisely. Apologies if I was unclear.

 

[Live in the Now]

I don’t think you can take anything away from what Klopp has done with this group but I also don’t think you can realistically look at what Liverpool have done the last few seasons and think it could be done without world class players.

Nope, it definitely can't. Pep tried this season with the defense that they have. It doesn't work. The players have to be world class at something if they aren't completely all the way at a world class level. Klopp is a great coach, and he's coached these players into what they are, but if they weren't great players at this point independently of him they wouldn't be winning trophies.

When Klopp dragged Liverpool to fourth place in 16/17, that showed how far he could take players who weren't really capable of being that successful. Before an injury crisis, Liverpool were in second place for much of the season. That was a very frustrating campaign though. We didn't have any strength at fullback, had very limited technical ability in midfield, Mane had a season ending injury, and Henderson was hurt pretty much all the time. Still that team was dragged to fourth place. Under no circumstances could any manager ever have made that into a top team. They were very arguably not better than Arsenal or Spurs are now.

 

[IceColdOx]

Woodward needs to sack up and overpay. City started winning by doing that. It's time do what your enemies did to get into the dance.

 

[Duchene2MacKinnon]

Woodward needs to sack up and overpay. City started winning by doing that. It's time do what your enemies did to get into the dance.

They have over paid see martial, McGuire it’s about identifying those who are worth the over payment and a coach with a clue.

 

[Live in the Now]

You can see the difference in the teams when you see Salah take his shirt off and watch Shaw lumber up the field. The standard for what it takes to play at Manchester United has lowered far too much and Ferguson would never send this side out onto the pitch.

Anyway, as a Liverpool supporter, this is absolutely the peak. This is the kind of peak that is unlikely to be duplicated as a team has never done this before in one of the big leagues. Not ever has a team started their season this well. They may finish with 100 points or they may not as it is no longer crucial to do so. This Liverpool team has set the marker for success and will always be mentioned as the model of a great start to a season. This kind of thing was completely unfathomable just a short time ago. To beat Them just makes it all even better. There's been some damage inflicted over the years, and some damage we've put on them as well. The performance wasn't great but the way the game ended was absolutely perfect. Was good to hear that chant ring out again. There's been a lot of iconic moments over the last three years that will be easy to remember, this one was near the top.

I'm glad this title win is coming in style, with these sorts of results. Not sure I could have done another nailbiter. There's been three of those, two of which were devastating and difficult to stomach. This one will not be. This is the kind of season I always hoped for but never thought would happen.

 

[Venkman]

Thought United started quite well. Then the set piece goal and Liverpool took over. If I saw it correctly, United have conceded the joint most goals from corners this season and are still using zonal marking against van Dijk.

De Gea kept United in the game with the save on Mane before half-time. Got battered at the start of the 2nd half, could've been 2 or 3 down but responded well. Fred was our best player by a long way, Martial was better in the 2nd half, should've done better with his chance. Shaw played well, showed more composure at times than Lindelof and Maguire, who were both poor. James, Pereira and AWB didn't play well either. Rashford's season looks even better playing through those injuries.

 

[IceColdOx]

I like Ole more than most, but I don't think he's the guy. The problem is who would want to manage United. It's like players as we're not the cool brand anymore.

 

[The Abusement Park]

I like Ole more than most, but I don't think he's the guy. The problem is who would want to manage United. It's like players as we're not the cool brand anymore.

What’s the allure for Ole? I don’t get it, he seems to be trying to change the mindset behind but that’s about the only positive.

 

[hatterson]

I like Ole more than most, but I don't think he's the guy. The problem is who would want to manage United. It's like players as we're not the cool brand anymore.

Was Liverpool the cool brand when they got Klopp?

You don’t need to be a cool brand to attract a top manger, you have to convince them you have a good structure in place, a good plan to get there, the the financial backing to make it happen.

United are 1/3 in that area right now and that’s what’s really holding them back far more than being a “hot” destination.

Edit: for that matter, were Liverpool a “hot” destination when they bought the vast majority of their current squad.

Allison yes, and to a lesser extent VVD, but basically all of their other contributors were signed when Liverpool was no better than United is now.

 

[Live in the Now]

Getting a great coach in United's position or the position Liverpool were in is all about the timing of firing your coach at the same time a great coach is available with nowhere else to go. If Liverpool had sacked Rodgers when he first deserved to be sacked, they would certainly not have Klopp right now. I'll be captain obvious here and point out that they should have whacked Ole for Conte. Look at the uses Conte has found for players that weren't doing very well at United. Wouldn't even have needed to overhaul the team.

The other problem is that there are very few other managers who can compete with Klopp and Pep. Conte's one of them.

So, you can't really whack Ole until there's someone worth whacking him for.

 

[hatterson]

Getting a great coach in United's position or the position Liverpool were in is all about the timing of firing your coach at the same time a great coach is available with nowhere else to go. If Liverpool had sacked Rodgers when he first deserved to be sacked, they would certainly not have Klopp right now. I'll be captain obvious here and point out that they should have whacked Ole for Conte. Look at the uses Conte has found for players that weren't doing very well at United. Wouldn't even have needed to overhaul the team.

The other problem is that there are very few other managers who can compete with Klopp and Pep. Conte's one of them.

So, you can't really whack Ole until there's someone worth whacking him for.

The better option would have been not giving him the permanent job in the first place and you had several top end managers available over the summer. Blanc, Conte, etc

 

[Live in the Now]

Edit: for that matter, were Liverpool a “hot” destination when they bought the vast majority of their current squad.

Allison yes, and to a lesser extent VVD, but basically all of their other contributors were signed when Liverpool was no better than United is now.

Everyone except Firmino and Henderson was signed after a Europa League final or CL qualification. So I dunno. Maybe. That some of these teams didn't see quality in the players they did sign is truly baffling.

The better option would have been not giving him the permanent job in the first place and you had several top end managers available over the summer. Blanc, Conte, etc

Yep. Most people were trying to say this would happen, but the former players in the media wouldn't go against their friend. They can't get rid of him until the end of the season now no matter what. And even then, there might not be a good replacement and they're doing this all over again. Something a lot of people don't understand is that a team should never sack their manager until they have the next one pretty much signed up. Otherwise they get another shit manager and do this all over again. Is there any value in getting rid of him, failing to have another manager, and signing someone like Emery? I think not.

The whole thing was also really poorly planned on United's part as they should have done this when Mourinho was gone.

Also, this game shouldn't be the reason to get rid of Ole as they never should have won this game.

 

[hatterson]

The whole thing was also really poorly planned on United's part

That's basically the motto of the Ed Woodward era.

 

[S E P H]

A couple days late, but Arsenal played good. What's killing us lately is the lack of secondary scoring; in a lot of the games we've drew, Arsenal should've killed the game off by the first half as they should've done against CP. Not sure if it is an Arteta issue or a personnel issue, what's not helping is Laca's current form.

 

[S E P H]

Always love it when those plastic ****s in blue lose, today was no exeption!

Biggest racist, plastic, and blood money club in the world.

 

[robertmac43]

A couple days late, but Arsenal played good. What's killing us lately is the lack of secondary scoring; in a lot of the games we've drew, Arsenal should've killed the game off by the first half as they should've done against CP. Not sure if it is an Arteta issue or a personnel issue, what's not helping is Laca's current form.

Lack of secondary scoring and our ability to hold leads. That is now Chelsea, CP, and Sheff that we were up 1-0 over and blew points. Got a total of 2 out of 9.... Not good enough in the slightest.

 

[IceColdOx]

The better option would have been not giving him the permanent job in the first place and you had several top end managers available over the summer. Blanc, Conte, etc

Is Poch that guy or not? Who would you put in there?

 

[Cassano]

The better option would have been not giving him the permanent job in the first place and you had several top end managers available over the summer. Blanc, Conte, etc

If Conte was on board, he would've stuck with Lukaku, Alexis, Young aka the Utd rejects Lol

 

[Gecklund]

The better option would have been not giving him the permanent job in the first place and you had several top end managers available over the summer. Blanc, Conte, etc

Honestly would love Blanc right now. Also would be okay with Poch. I think those are the only two managers that are available right now that I’d sack Ole for. Maybe Jardim.

 

[Chimaera]

#Oleforever