GWT: PL Matchweek 17

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phisherman

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Never is a very long time but if Arsenal can’t even jump Man Utd with Ole at the wheel, it’s really hard to see them breaking through the Top 4.

Players never stay on one team. He's basically arguing they suck and will never be good enough for a top team. Which is pretty ridiculous.
 

AB13

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Saliba is not on the same level as Kamara (not to mention some of the other L1 CBs) and what about those players is insulting? They’re all among the top talents of their birth years. Just because you don’t know them doesn’t make Saliba automatically better; especially just going off of some out of context stats from a mediocre team in the weakest of the top 5 leagues. Read recently that Liverpool have never lost a game which Keita has started or something like that; is he the best midfielder in the world?

Those games represent a relatively large sample size, and represent just the incredible impact he has had on his team. For one of the weaker teams of Ligue 1 to have a win percentage like a title contender with Saliba, based on a pretty large sample size, is insane. I have watched Saliba plenty of times this season, and no PL prospect has come close to impressing me as much. Saliba is in no way worse than Kamara, it is not even close, don’t be ridiculous.

You actually said him and Martinelli won’t play in the CL, that is just pure ignorance and bias.
 

Live in the Now

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Those games represent a relatively large sample size, and represent just the incredible impact he has had on his team. For one of the weaker teams of Ligue 1 to have a win percentage like a title contender with Saliba, based on a pretty large sample size, is insane.

This is just bullshit and it is impossible to take you seriously ever again after you say this. You are just a straight out f***ing liar.

He played 90 minutes four times this season. He played one minute one time. That is all he has played in the league this season. He hasn't even played in two months because he broke his foot. How exactly are you judging the player?
 

AB13

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This is just bull**** and it is impossible to take you seriously ever again after you say this. You are just a straight out ****ing liar.

He played 90 minutes four times. He played one minute one time. That is all he has played in the league this season. He hasn't even played in two months because he broke his foot.

13 games with him, 19 games without him in 2019, that is a pretty large sample size and obviously what I was referring too, not the 4 games he has been fit to play in the league this season. That isn't being a liar. You are the one being a liar, either that or misunderstanding my claim and trying to do everything in your power to make me look bad.
 

Live in the Now

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13 games with him, 19 games without him in 2019, that is a pretty large sample size and obviously what I was referring too, not the 4 games he has been fit to play in the league this season. Saying that isn't a liar. You are the one being a liar, either that or misunderstanding my claim and trying to do everything in your power to make me look bad.

I am 100% certain that you did not watch any of those games from last season.
 
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AB13

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I am 100% certain that you did not watch any of those games from last season.

I have seen him play 4 times this season, which is enough for me too know what he is like as a player. I did not watch him last season, but I never claimed to have, so how was I lying? I used them in a statistical sample size, never said I personally watched them, but that isn't relevant.
 

The Abusement Park

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I have seen him play 4 times this season, which is enough for me too know what he is like as a player. I did not watch him last season, but I never claimed to have, so how was I lying? I used them in a statistical sample size, never said I personally watched them, but that isn't relevant.

He just gave you the context of the stats you're swinging around....
 

Live in the Now

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Jon Flanagan - Stats 13/14

These winning stats are proof that you need to watch someone in order to know what they're doing. You can't just judge by "they aren't losing," because plenty of players have been in teams that don't lose.

And I'm not making any statement about Saliba because I have not watched him.
 
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AB13

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Jon Flanagan - Stats 13/14

These winning stats are proof that you need to watch someone in order to know what they're doing. You can't just judge by "they aren't losing," because plenty of players have been in teams that don't lose.

And I'm not making any statement about Saliba because I have not watched him.

If you concede 6 goals in 11 games with a defensive player, and 28 goals in 19 games without him, that should tell you a bit about the impact a player can have. A win percentage of 84.6% with him compared to 26.3% without him is such a massive difference I think you can draw conclusions from it. The rest of what you said is completely right, you need to watch players consistently to form yourself an opinion. Considering I have seen a bit, I use that to judge him primarily, not stats.
 

YNWA14

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Saliba is in no way worse than Kamara, it is not even close, don’t be ridiculous.
Pretty much every 'in the know' French analyst and the biggest French league follower from this board who follows French prospects very closely will tell you otherwise. Saliba will get hype because he's going to the PL but Kamara is the better talent and player. But I'll defer to your expertise on this matter given your unbiased view of how Martinelli and Saliba stack up against the world's best u20s.

You actually said him and Martinelli won’t play in the CL, that is just pure ignorance and bias.
Is that what I said?
 

hatterson

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If you concede 6 goals in 11 games with a defensive player, and 28 goals in 19 games without him, that should tell you a bit about the impact a player can have. A win percentage of 84.6% with him compared to 26.3% without him is such a massive difference I think you can draw conclusions from it. The rest of what you said is completely right, you need to watch players consistently to form yourself an opinion. Considering I have seen a bit, I use that to judge him primarily, not stats.

The important numbers there are 11 and 19. Those are not large sample sizes.
 

AB13

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Pretty much every 'in the know' French analyst and the biggest French league follower from this board who follows French prospects very closely will tell you otherwise. Saliba will get hype because he's going to the PL but Kamara is the better talent and player. But I'll defer to your expertise on this matter given your unbiased view of how Martinelli and Saliba stack up against the world's best u20s.


Is that what I said?

Most analysts outside of this board seem to rate Saliba higher though, he just made onefootballs top 10 players of the 2020s decade list, for instance. Transfermarkt and also have Saliba valued considerably higher, for example.

According to highly rated CIES Football Observatory, Saliba is the highest valued player in the world born 2001 or later, which large parts of your list is composed of.
 

AB13

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So basically they've lost against every top 6 team they've played with Saliba in the line-up minus one game against Toulouse, and he's never had to play PSG or Lyon (or Marseille as far as I could tell). What a difference he makes. So again, these stats don't prove that he's bad and nobody is saying that, but...

Convenient lie? They beat tough teams like Monaco, Lyon and Bordeaux this season with Saliba, keeping clean sheets in all of those games. Saliba was named man of the match against Lyon, his performances in those were a large reason behind why his estimated market valuation rose to the top of all players born 2001 or after.
 
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hatterson

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Saliba definitely has a ton of potential, but that's what it is now, potential. He's looked good in very limited expose he's had at the senior level, but also has missed time due to 3 separate injuries, that's a concern.

Either way, saying he's a top 10 u20 player isn't really absurd.

Your stance on Martinelli is ridiculous though. He's a good young player with potential, but as I said, basically every major team's academy in the world has a player with similar or superior potential who is either right at the end of their academy time or right at the beginning of their senior time.
 

AB13

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Saliba definitely has a ton of potential, but that's what it is now, potential. He's looked good in very limited expose he's had at the senior level, but also has missed time due to 3 separate injuries, that's a concern.

Either way, saying he's a top 10 u20 player isn't really absurd.

Your stance on Martinelli is ridiculous though. He's a good young player with potential, but as I said, basically every major team's academy in the world has a player with similar or superior potential who is either right at the end of their academy time or right at the beginning of their senior time.

Martinelli is the highest scoring teenager playing for a team in Europes top 5 leagues ( all competitions). Every major team doesn’t have a player like that.

Injuries are a major concern with Saliba, yes.
 

Live in the Now

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Martinelli is the highest scoring teenager playing for a team in Europes top 5 leagues ( all competitions). Every major team doesn’t have a player like that.

Not even true again. Liar. Sancho has more goals for starters and he scored most of his against far better teams. I don't know why you post stuff that is so easily disproven.
 

hatterson

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Martinelli is the highest scoring teenager playing for a team in Europes top 5 leagues ( all competitions). Every major team doesn’t have a player like that.

That's false. Sancho has more goals. Greenwood has the same number. And those aren't even without checking very much.

Not to mention that 2 of those came in the league cup against a championship side and 2 came against Liverpool's u23 team in the league cup.
 
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