GWT: PL Matchweek 11

Jersey Fresh

Video Et Taceo
Feb 23, 2004
26,154
9,094
T.A.
Are people seriously under the impression that this is the way the laws of the game are being applied now? That injuries upgrade offenses depending on their severity? It isn't. Atkinson made a unilateral call here, more than likely because he thought Son directly caused Gomes' injury, rather than the unfortunate circumstances that actually happened.

Watching it again, I'd agree with the interpretation that this was a more severe yellow/orange offense. What Atkinson did though was offer a yellow, only to go back and give Son a red when he saw how hurt Gomes was and that is not the way the game should be refereed.
 
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YEM

Registered User
Mar 7, 2010
5,718
2,697
What Atkinson did though was offer a yellow, only to go back and give Son a red when he saw how hurt Gomes was and that is not the way the game should be refereed.
Exactly. Straight red right away? Ok, fine.
Go back and change your mind AFTER you showed the yellow? Just wrong.
 

Stray Wasp

Registered User
May 5, 2009
4,561
1,503
South east London
Funny how everyone is okay with Atkinson until now though. He should be sacked.

Those with very long memories will recall my bitterness towards Atkinson for his oversight of Manchester City-Newcastle in October of 2010, when De Jong broke Ben Arfa's leg with a violent challenge that received not even a yellow card. For good measure, Atkinson gave The People's Billionaires a dubious penalty then denied NUFC a legitimate claim.

Ever since I've considered him a referee likely to cave in favour of home teams, and I think that weakness has abetted rather than hindered his career.
 

YNWA14

Onbreekbaar
Dec 29, 2010
34,543
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I have zero issues with a yellow being upgraded to a red when the result of a bad challenge is a guys career potentially ending.
I mean that’s the way most punishments usually work. While it wasn’t a direct break from the challenge itself it was a result of an illegal and dangerous challenge so it should be treated as such. It absolutely is the way the game should be officiated, also.
 

YNWA14

Onbreekbaar
Dec 29, 2010
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Exactly. Straight red right away? Ok, fine.
Go back and change your mind AFTER you showed the yellow? Just wrong.
No problem with it at all. Don’t dangerously and illegally tackle someone and you don’t have to deal with the consequences. Gomes certainly does.
 

YNWA14

Onbreekbaar
Dec 29, 2010
34,543
2,560
Not directly.

The circumstances are that Son made a yellow card worthy tackle and Gomes unfortunately got hurt. It’s unfortunate the injury happened and unfortunate that it was so horrific but that doesn’t change the fact the tackle was worth a yellow card at most.
You really are completely ignorant to the real world, aren’t you?
 

YNWA14

Onbreekbaar
Dec 29, 2010
34,543
2,560
So if you push someone and they trip, then fall into the street and something bad happens to them do you think you’re absolved of responsibility? It’s not your fault they tripped after you pushed them, after all.
 

Baxterman

Registered User
Aug 27, 2017
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So if you push someone and they trip, then fall into the street and something bad happens to them do you think you’re absolved of responsibility? It’s not your fault they tripped after you pushed them, after all.

I think that if I push someone and they trip and fall into the street and something bad happens to them it is unlikely that I get convicted of murder.

I would get punished for the act of pushing them and everything that happened after that would be looked at to see if it was my fault or not.
 

Duchene2MacKinnon

In the hands of Genius
Aug 8, 2006
45,300
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I think that if I push someone and they trip and fall into the street and something bad happens to them it is unlikely that I get convicted of murder.

I would get punished for the act of pushing them and everything that happened after that would be looked at to see if it was my fault or not.
It’s manslaughter lol but regardless that’s a stretch of an analogy. It’s a red tackle from behind resulting into an injury. Wether you want to agree with that is entirely up to you.
 

Live in the Now

Registered User
Dec 17, 2005
53,030
7,489
LA
I think that if I push someone and they trip and fall into the street and something bad happens to them it is unlikely that I get convicted of murder.

I would get punished for the act of pushing them and everything that happened after that would be looked at to see if it was my fault or not.

You would actually go to prison for a very long time unless that person was your friend and you could prove you were joking around.
 

Baxterman

Registered User
Aug 27, 2017
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It’s manslaughter lol but regardless that’s a stretch of an analogy. It’s a red tackle from behind resulting into an injury. Wether you want to agree with that is entirely up to you.

Its not just me but most people.

Its a clear yellow card at most but because of how bad Gomes was hurt and people feeling bad about it they up it to a red. Its understandable why they do it but it doesn't change the fact that it is the wrong call.
 

Jersey Fresh

Video Et Taceo
Feb 23, 2004
26,154
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Well, if it isn't the ol' "analogize a tackle on a football pitch to pushing a guy in front of a bus" maneuver. How quaint.

You really are completely ignorant to the real world, aren’t you?
Because if there's one guy who is definitely well-adjusted to the real world based on his comments on this board, it's obviously you...
 
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Duchene2MacKinnon

In the hands of Genius
Aug 8, 2006
45,300
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Its not just me but most people.

Its a clear yellow card at most but because of how bad Gomes was hurt and people feeling bad about it they up it to a red. Its understandable why they do it but it doesn't change the fact that it is the wrong call.
At most lol
 

JeffreyLFC

Registered User
Sep 29, 2017
9,828
6,976
I have no problem with a red there.

I think football fans are ridiculous. If anything there should be way way more yellow cards and red cards called, not less or whatever is orange card.

I hate technical/cynical fouls like going after the players to stop a clear counter attack. It should be a straight red. That should stop it. The best example is Choudry tackle on Salah. He never cared about the ball, he just wanted to stop a chance for Salah. He got a yellow and Salah got injured. That is just wrong. If you don't make an attempt at the ball it should be a straight red even if it is not a clear attempt to injure the other player.

There is no question that if Son does not trip Gomes, he does not break his leg. Players are responsible of their own action. Son has all the reasons to feel bad about his tackle. It is awful how people still defend it because they think the injury is the ONLY reason it is called a red card and not yellow. This should be a red card 100% of the time no mater of the injury.

I have zero problem with handling more red cards to similar foul to prevent these type of injuries.
 
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YNWA14

Onbreekbaar
Dec 29, 2010
34,543
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Well, if it isn't the ol' "analogize a tackle on a football pitch to pushing a guy in front of a bus" maneuver. How quaint.


Because if there's one guy who is definitely well-adjusted to the real world based on his comments on this board, it's obviously you...
Clearly you’re the best judge of that and it’s why I value your opinion on this so highly.
 
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YNWA14

Onbreekbaar
Dec 29, 2010
34,543
2,560
I have no problem with a red there.

I think football fans are ridiculous. If anything there should be way way more yellow cards and red cards called, not less or whatever is orange card.

I hate technical/cynical fouls like going after the players to stop a clear counter attack. It should be a straight red. That should stop it. The best example is Choudry tackle on Salah. He never cared about the ball, he just wanted to stop a chance for Salah. He got a yellow and Salah got injured. That is just wrong. If you don't make an attempt at the ball it should be a straight red even if it is not a clear attempt to injure the other player.

There is no question that if Son does not trip Gomes, he does not break his leg. Players are responsible of their own action. Son has all the reasons to feel bad about his tackle. It is awful how people still defend it because they think the injury is the ONLY reason it is called a red card and not yellow. This should be a red card 100% of the time no mater of the injury.

I have zero problem with handling more red cards to similar foul to prevent these type of injuries.
Absolutely.

What really should be instituted, and would be really easy to implement, is if you are found at fault of a foul and someone is injured because of it you should be suspended for the same amount of time as the injury.

I know people don’t like to take responsibility for any negative result of their actions but it would be a good step in eliminating cynical actions.
 
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bluesfan94

Registered User
Jan 7, 2008
30,720
8,081
St. Louis
Then there should be retroactive punishment for yellows that result in long layoffs.

But there isn't.

And the court of law has literally no relevance here.
Yeah agreed that it isn’t a perfect match which is why not every foul should be judged by the outcome. But if you tackle someone from behind and injure them, I have no issue with the injury being taken into consideration.
 

bluesfan94

Registered User
Jan 7, 2008
30,720
8,081
St. Louis
Virtually every part of society judges the results based on the circumstances not on the result alone. At least in the society that I have been apart of things may be very different where you are from.

When something occurs out of your control you are not then punished for that.
That’s not even true though.
 

bluesfan94

Registered User
Jan 7, 2008
30,720
8,081
St. Louis
I think that if I push someone and they trip and fall into the street and something bad happens to them it is unlikely that I get convicted of murder.

I would get punished for the act of pushing them and everything that happened after that would be looked at to see if it was my fault or not.
Let me tell you, that isn’t how the law works. Merely pushing someone is battery. Pushing them and having them get hit by a bus and dying is manslaughter.
 

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