Salary Cap: Pittsburgh Penguins Salary Cap Thread: A New Error?

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Gurglesons

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I disagree. He doesn't score enough goals. Hayes can get you 25+.

Danault is better defensively, But he's a very passive offensive player. Hayes likes to carry the puck in.

I'm not sure what passive offensive players top 40+ ES points twice.

Danault has been part of one of the best 5v5 lines in the game the past two years and unless you want to put that all on Tatar and Gallagher, he's a very effective top six center who doesn't want to take a pay cut.

He'll get a haul if he's traded and will be a huge free agent if he gets there.
 
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Gurglesons

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He does, but he doesn't score goals like ROR did or like Hayes does.

He also isn't average at 5v5 like Hayes is.

I mean, we can wait and see, but Danault likely gets 6.5 - 7 mil in FA this summer if he wants it.

If you think he gets below 6 you're out to lunch. He may take a pay cut to be on a contender, but I doubt it given he turned down a 6 year 30 mil deal.
 

PensandCaps

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I'm not sure what passive offensive players top 40+ ES points twice.

Danault has been part of one of the best 5v5 lines in the game the past two years and unless you want to put that all on Tatar and Gallagher, he's a very effective top six center who doesn't want to take a pay cut.

He'll get a haul if he's traded and will be a huge free agent if he gets there.

I'm saying that he defers and passes the puck. Im not denying his overall offensive game, but you would like more than a career high of 13 goals.
 

PensandCaps

Beddy Tlueger
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He also isn't average at 5v5 like Hayes is.

I mean, we can wait and see, but Danault likely gets 6.5 - 7 mil in FA this summer if he wants it.

If you think he gets below 6 you're out to lunch. He may take a pay cut to be on a contender, but I doubt it given he turned down a 6 year 30 mil deal.

Not sure where you're getting that Hayes is average at 5v5. He picks up some 2nd PP points, but that's about it, 90% of his production is at 5v5/SH
 

MayorofWBS

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As long as Jenner is still a Bluejacket, it will be over all our dead bodies for CBus to trade with us. Not going to happen. I don't care if the Metro isn't a thing this year. They are not trading with us...no how, no way. They see us a a big rival. I can't see any of our fellow Metro alum trading with us.

Bennett, Crouse, Heinen seem more likely. Any thoughts on Max Jones? He's lost ground to Comtois and may be available in the right trade. I haven't watched Jones as a pro. I thought he started on the taxi squad this year and has recently been inserted back in the lineup due to injury. He turns 23 in 2 days.
 

Turin

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Anaheim’s C depth has Derek Grant as their 2C. McCann?

McCann, Pettersson, Jarry, 3rd for Gibson and Backes? I’m not sure if they need LD though.
 

Scandale du Jour

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Aside from the fact he doesn't want to play 3C on a team like Montreal, so I doubt he wants to do anything close to it here.

One thing important to consider here is that Danault does not want to be the 3C in Montreal behind Suzuki AND, most importantly, Kotkaniemi. He does not want to get pass over when he has been the defacto 1C for 3-4 years. The reason why is strictly financial IMO. If the perception is that you are a 3rd line center, you will get less money... especially if one of the two guys in front of you (KK) is nothing special. "Look Phil, you are our 3C, we can only afford to pay you as such."

Here, he would be behind Crosby and Malkin. He would basically have the Staal role. Would he be strictly a rental? Yes, most likely. He probably would not want to be stuck being a 3C. Would playing the Staal role here more beneficial to him financially than playing the role he is in Montreal? Maybe. Especially if he can maintain his 5v5 production and nobody wonders why he is not on the PP... people will know why here. In Montreal, it can raise questions (and does). Also, Danault here makes the Pens a bigger contender than Montreal. Winning a Cup would increase his value. That being said, I do not think we would be a real contender, even with him.

That being said, Montreal would be absolutely foolish to trade him. As I said, they are in a very good position to potentially come out of their weak division and Danault is their only proven center. Suzuki is trending to be very good to great and Kotkaniemi is settiling into a 2C... but both are very young. Danault is still handling most of the tough match ups. Their depth is why they have a chance. Trading Danault would

Thing is, I doubt he wants out of Montreal, but he also wants to get paid and he is likely to be the sacrificial lamb, unless he takes a discount, considering both young Cs will have to be re-signed pretty soon. If I had to make a prediction, I'd say he will re-sign in Montreal for around 6M a year. They are gonna have to do some maneuvering to stay under the cap next year though.
 

SEALBound

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As long as Jenner is still a Bluejacket, it will be over all our dead bodies for CBus to trade with us. Not going to happen. I don't care if the Metro isn't a thing this year. They are not trading with us...no how, no way. They see us a a big rival. I can't see any of our fellow Metro alum trading with us.

Bennett, Crouse, Heinen seem more likely. Any thoughts on Max Jones? He's lost ground to Comtois and may be available in the right trade. I haven't watched Jones as a pro. I thought he started on the taxi squad this year and has recently been inserted back in the lineup due to injury. He turns 23 in 2 days.

I really like Comtois. Wish we could have figured out something around him before now. I think Comtois, Jones, Steel, Zegras, and Drysdale are all off-limits. I think that's the core of players that will be built around. It's a good core too.
 
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Turin

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I know I basically said this a page ago, and a page before that, but why are we talking about paying big to turbo boost the 3rd line?

Yea, the team needs a guy to get Geno/the PP going and a goalie before trying to craft an ideal 4th line.
 
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Gurglesons

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Yea, the team needs a guy to get Geno/the PP going and a goalie before trying to craft an ideal 4th line.

I think simply getting a better LW fit for Malkin improves every line. Zucker is a fine 3rd liner if we aren't going to play him in the top six effectively.

I don't see any solution for the PP that realistically makes sense with the assets we have. If this team and roster can't have an effective PP someone like Palms or Getzlaf isn't fixing it.

You'd need to bring in a huge ego for that to happen and even then once the power play started running solely through Kessel it became a train wreck.
 

Empoleon8771

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If the Penguins are doing anything to their bottom-6, they need to turn their 4th line into a 3B line. You already have one 3rd line in ZAR-Blueger-Tanev, but you only have McCann (who I'm quickly souring on) on the 3B line.

Honestly, you could even convince me that you have 2/3 of a 3B line in McCann and Rodrigues, who I honestly don't have an issue with in that kind of role. I want a speedy playmaker who's good defensively for the RW on that 3B line, and I think Rodrigues can fit that. But you either really need another Blueger style 3C or you need to acquire another LWer for that line for me to feel comfortable. Guys like Jankowski, Sceviour, Lafferty and O'Connor aren't going to cut it for what I'd want out of a 3B line.
 

Gurglesons

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If the Penguins are doing anything to their bottom-6, they need to turn their 4th line into a 3B line. You already have one 3rd line in ZAR-Blueger-Tanev, but you only have McCann (who I'm quickly souring on) on the 3B line.

Honestly, you could even convince me that you have 2/3 of a 3B line in McCann and Rodrigues, who I honestly don't have an issue with in that kind of role. I want a speedy playmaker who's good defensively for the RW on that 3B line, and I think Rodrigues can fit that. But you either really need another Blueger style 3C or you need to acquire another LWer for that line for me to feel comfortable. Guys like Jankowski, Sceviour, Lafferty and O'Connor aren't going to cut it for what I'd want out of a 3B line.

It's why I'm trying to find a top six LW that is more fit than production.

Crouse, Bennett, Jenner. These guys are 30 pt forwards, but next to Malkin they might play the right type of game to compliment him and Kapanen.

Then you go Zucker - McCann - Sceviour ZAR - Blueger - Tanev.

I mean, naturally I'd prefer we just go Zucker - Blueger - Tanev for L3 and make a L4 with spare parts but Sullivan has already decided what he's doing with Zucker and looks a hell of a lot like what he did with Pearson.
 

Dipsy Doodle

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I mean Rust has a good shot, is willing to shoot, led the team in PP goals last season...so yea Rust does provide an element on the PP with his shot.

The guy who doesn't bring much of anything is Guentzel on the PP

Neither Rust nor Guentzel bring anything this PP really needs, which is why it continues to struggle.
 

Peat

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Because Pens fans saw it work once 10 years ago.

I mean, it sure does if you get it right, but as priority number one right now I'm baffled. And I'd like to think we're aware enough to know we don't really have enough assets for multiple big buys...
 

MayorofWBS

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I really like Comtois. Wish we could have figured out something around him before now. I think Comtois, Jones, Steel, Zegras, and Drysdale are all off-limits. I think that's the core of players that will be built around. It's a good core too.

They maybe off-limits but both Jones and Steel have been passed up by young prospects in Lundstrom and Comtois in the Ducks system.

The Ducks picked Comtois (2017 #50 OA) right in front of ours (Zachary Lauzon - 2017 #51 OA). That was our best shot at Comtois.

I didn't list out all those first round picks that the ducks system has over the last 5 years. It makes you uneasy to see how many first and high seconds they picked over the last 5 years and see where they are at. Our time is coming.
 
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Dipsy Doodle

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I know I basically said this a page ago, and a page before that, but why are we talking about paying big to turbo boost the 3rd line?

As an option to diversify offense if the org continues to ignore the problems with Malkin's line.

Not ideal, but I don't see people offering many realistic targets who'd do as much to help with ES and PP offense, not to mention playoff performance. Who do you prefer?
 

Gurglesons

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I mean, it sure does if you get it right, but as priority number one right now I'm baffled. And I'd like to think we're aware enough to know we don't really have enough assets for multiple big buys...

I mean, Peat isn't this thread just a non-stop paradox of we need to get a RW for Crosby that produces on the power play, a LW for Malkin that supports his play and plays an aggressive game and a new goaltender? No matter what year or date you come in the Pens salary cap thread it is continuous.

Which kind of speaks to the fact that maybe Malkin and the PP are the issues and not the personnel considering we had Phil Kessel and Patric Hornqvist and the PP still blew and we've tried plenty of LWs that seem to have success elsewhere with Malkin in Pearson and Perron, but the reality is that sometimes it is more about simple fixes than names.
 

pistolpete11

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Zucker hasn't been great, but I'm not as convinced he's the real problem with L2. I think it is a combination of Malkin not playing well and Zucker/Kap not being a good mix, at least for Malkin. If it takes a Zucker swap, that's fine by me, but I think it could also be finding a different RW.

BART is a solid line, but in my view, I think the ultimate goal should be to have L4 be ZAR - 4C - Tanev.

The easiest way to build that depth is to get a top 6 winger and bump some guys down. Dumo for a top 6 winger. McCann for a different mix, a la Bennett.


Gunetzel - Crosby - Rust (because Sully)
Zucker - Malkin - (trade)
(Bennett) - Blueger - Kap
ZAR - Jank/4C - Tanev

Petts - Letang
Matheson - Marino
POJ - Ruh/Ceci



They need to figure out the situation in goal and certain guys, namely Malkin, just need to play better, but on paper, I'd be satisfied going into the playoffs with that roster.
 
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Gurglesons

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Zucker hasn't been great, but I'm not as convinced he's the real problem with L2. I think it is a combination of Malkin not playing well and Zucker/Kap not being a good mix, at least for Malkin. If it takes a Zucker swap, that's fine by me, but I think it could also be finding a different RW.

BART is a solid line, but in my view, I think the ultimate goal should be to have L4 be ZAR - 4C - Tanev.

The easiest way to build that depth is to get a top 6 winger and bump some guys down. Dumo for a top 6 winger. McCann for a different mix, a la Bennett.


Gunetzel - Crosby - Rust (because Sully)
Zucker - Malkin - (trade)
(Bennett) - Blueger - Kap
ZAR - Jank/4C - Tanev

Petts - Letang
Matheson - Marino
POJ - Ruh/Ceci



They need to figure out the situation in goal and certain guys, namely Malkin, just need to play better, but on paper, I'd be satisfied going into the playoffs with that roster.

Kapanen out of the top six makes no sense. He's Bryan Rust 2.0.
 
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Empoleon8771

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Figured I'd bring this from the main board here, but I was looking at the comparison between pre-Chicago Daley (meaning 2012-2015) and pre-Pittsburgh Matheson (meaning 2017-2020), and their results are staggeringly similar:

5v5 goals/60: 0.31 for Daley, 0.32 for Matheson
5v5 points/60: 0.98 for Daley, 0.87 for Matheson

CF%Rel: -3.96% for Daley, -0.80% for Matheson
xGF%Rel: -2.15% for Daley, -2.00% for Matheson
GF%Rel: +0.4% for Daley, -4.00% for Matheson
HDCF%Rel: -1.67% for Daley, -2.47% for Matheson

You basically have Daley being slightly better at getting assists, which can possibly be explained by comparing the teams (Dallas was 12th, 11th and 2nd in GF in those years, while Florida was 14th, 9th and 7th), but everything else being more or less a wash.
 
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