Phoenix XXIV: How many twists does the scriptwriter have left?

[MAROONSRoad]

I think it's relevant to this thread that Devellano said,

Devellano comments are dated and contradicted by more recent developments. Since those comments were reported both Scruggs and Bettman have mentioned difficulties and/or time constraints in closing the deal with MH.

GHOST

 

[Grumpz]

Hockey is a lock in the desert! It's only because of poor management and a bad location. So why doesn't MH just buy the team with his own money. Period. No if's and and's and no help from the CoG. He surely can generate enough in parking revenue to help with losses. Look at those studies! Parking is worth 10's of millions! Heck they're won't even be any losses, because this guy is going to turn things around!

Side note! When as 14, I was taking the bus to Jets games, took me 2 hrs both ways. The rink was in the exact opposite side of the city. It didn't stop me, or the other non drivers in -30 temps.

Blaming the location is a pathetic excuse.

 

[RR]

Devellano comments are dated and contradicted by more recent developments. Since those comments were reported both Scruggs and Bettman have mentioned difficulties and/or time constraints in closing the deal with MH.

GHOST

Thursday, March 3, comments are dated?

I know some here want to put on earmuffs if there is even an utterance of disagreement that the Coyotes are 99.99% on their way to Winnipeg. But there comes a point when that confidence becomes laughable.

Don't get me wrong. Not saying for a second there isn't a reasonable possibility the Coyotes move. But to simply dismiss the comments from Devellano, who has almost 30 years in management with the Wings, and who helped bring them back from the depths of being the laughing-stock of the NHL, is disingenuous to the nth degree. IMO, of course.

 

[Jeffrey93]

Thursday, March 3, comments are dated?

I know some here want to put on earmuffs if there is even an utterance of disagreement that the Coyotes are 99.99% on their way to Winnipeg. But there comes a point when that confidence becomes laughable.

Don't get me wrong. Not saying for a second there isn't a reasonable possibility the Coyotes move. But to simply dismiss the comments from Devellano, who has almost 30 years in management with the Wings, and who helped bring them back from the depths of being the laughing-stock of the NHL, is disingenuous to the nth degree. IMO, of course.

When things happen after his comments that he wouldn't have known when he made the comments....yeah, they can be considered 'dated'.

Besides....his comments were basically saying that the Wings haven't been told to prepare for a move to the Eastern Conference. With most relocation scenarios (even multiple relo's in same year) the Wings wouldn't be moving from the West to the East. It would be more likely a team farther East than Detroit would be moving from the East to the West.

 

[OthmarAmmann]

3 billion in revenues makes your statement kinda foolish.

It may not be MLB or NFL big, but the NHL is still a big major league, whether you like it or not.

oooo $3 billion in revenue. HUGE! Barely spitting distance of the Fortune 500.

It operates like a bush league and is still fringe in most of the U.S.

the city is saying that they will lose 500M if they lock the arena and do nothing with it.

on the other hand, this coyotes bailout will cost them over 400M.

so, is there really nothing the city can do with the arena to make 100M?

Charge for parking?

 

[Crazy_Ike]

oooo $3 billion in revenue. HUGE! Barely spitting distance of the Fortune 500.

It operates like a bush league and is still fringe in most of the U.S.

Actually it operates exceptionally professionally - which is why it isn't understood by most the 'unwashed masses' whose ideas of what is a professionally run league comes from guys who flunked out of both sports and journalism - and 3 billion in revenue still makes the NHL a major league whether it is "fringe" in parts of the US or not.

Why pretend it doesn't? All that does is make you look bitter. Give the league its due.

 

[Crazy_Ike]

Devellano comments are dated and contradicted by more recent developments. Since those comments were reported both Scruggs and Bettman have mentioned difficulties and/or time constraints in closing the deal with MH.

On closing the deal, or on closing it with better interest rates.

The suggestion I see nowadays is that the deal will close regardless of what happens with GWI now, it's just a question of whether or not GWI will allow them better rates by backing off of the threat to sue. Time is definitely short for that.

 

[MAROONSRoad]

Thursday, March 3, comments are dated?

Yes, dated in the sense that they were published at 8:00 am yesterday morning before the mayor's press conference and before Bettman's comments on the radio.

I know some here want to put on earmuffs if there is even an utterance of disagreement that the Coyotes are 99.99% on their way to Winnipeg. But there comes a point when that confidence becomes laughable.

If you are referring to me, I am not 99.99% confident on any outcome yet. I simply don't find Devellano's comments convincing given the evidence to the contrary.

GHOST

 

[MAROONSRoad]

On closing the deal, or on closing it with better interest rates.

The suggestion I see nowadays is that the deal will close regardless of what happens with GWI now, it's just a question of whether or not GWI will allow them better rates by backing off of the threat to sue. Time is definitely short for that.

The deal.

The only thing I feel certain of is we will find out relatively soon.

GHOST

 

[PeaSouper]

I'm also pretty sure that Devellano will toe the NHL line, as he should; even if he knew that the moving trucks were on their way to Glendale, uncertainty doesn't help any of the other NHL owners right now who collectively own the Coyotes. I'm not saying this means the train is clear off the tracks and heading into the cornfield, I'm just saying I wouldn't read much into his comments either way.

 

[Brodie]

Don't get me wrong. Not saying for a second there isn't a reasonable possibility the Coyotes move. But to simply dismiss the comments from Devellano, who has almost 30 years in management with the Wings, and who helped bring them back from the depths of being the laughing-stock of the NHL, is disingenuous to the nth degree. IMO, of course.

If you accept there's a reasonable possibility of the Coyotes moving, you're already accepting Jimmy is wrong in his assessment.

Let's be real here for a second... an NHL governor is asked, before Glendale broke their silence with the "this is end" business, if there are any plans in place to relocate any teams. What do you think he's going to say? Do you believe him that all the talk of a team in Winnipeg is Toronto media generated nonsense about getting a new team in Canada? It would certainly appear unlikely. This is about keeping up a universal front and nothing more.

 

[Brodie]

Please explain what you think Devellano would have said if he expected the team were moving. Do you think he would have told MLive "yeah, if **** doesn't go down we're moving the team to Winnipeg"? That would hurt the NHL's position in Glendale while also hurting their leverage over Winnipeg while also putting the league in a terrible PR position. And the Red Wings organization would have to bear the fault for that by losing a lot of power in the backroom.

Please note that none of his comments are any different than what Bettman says about this situation multiple times a week. Unless you believe Bettman every time he says "the last I heard, the deal was close to closing" and "we have no plans to relocate at this time", why do feel more confident when one of Bettman's employers echoes him?

 

[RR]

If you accept there's a reasonable possibility of the Coyotes moving, you're already accepting Jimmy is wrong in his assessment.

Let's be real here for a second... an NHL governor is asked, before Glendale broke their silence with the "this is end" business, if there are any plans in place to relocate any teams. What do you think he's going to say? Do you believe him that all the talk of a team in Winnipeg is Toronto media generated nonsense about getting a new team in Canada? It would certainly appear unlikely. This is about keeping up a universal front and nothing more.

A gut feeling here is more relevant than someone in a position to know? If that isn't the height of arrogance (or ignorance), not sure what is.

I may have a "gut" feeling (like those Peggers who feared their team was lost in the mid-90s), but I'm open to listening to the parties in a position to "know." I'm not so blind to dismiss an opinion I don't like.

As for Devellano, I'll take it with a grain of salt. But I'm starting to get the impression many here will attack and do all they can to rip him apart, because he doesn't support their wishes and/or desires.

 

[Brodie]

A gut feeling here is more relevant than someone in a position to know? If that isn't the height of arrogance (or ignorance), not sure what is.

I may have a "gut" feeling (like those Peggers who feared their team was lost in the mid-90s), but I'm open to listening to the parties in a position to "know." I'm not so blind to dismiss an opinion I don't like.

As for Devellano, I'll take it with a grain of salt. But I'm starting to get the impression many here will attack and do all they can to rip him apart, because he doesn't support their wishes and/or desires.

I certainly have no reason to attack Jimmy D. I love him! I've met him, he's a wonderfully nice man. But my point is that being in a position to know does not == being in a position to discuss the details of something publicly. I'd take his comments the exact same way I take Bettman's similar comments... slightly hopeful for Phoenix fans, but with a major grain of salt.

I simply don't believe this deal is in a position to close very quickly. Everything we've seen lately indicates that's probably not going to happen. And I don't believe the NHL has never discussed relocation to Winnipeg. Which leads me to conclude very little of what Jimmy D said was anything other than the party line.

 

[RR]

I certainly have no reason to attack Jimmy D. I love him! I've met him, he's a wonderfully nice man. But my point is that being in a position to know does not == being in a position to discuss the details of something publicly. I'd take his comments the exact same way I take Bettman's similar comments... slightly hopeful for Phoenix fans, but with a major grain of salt.

I simply don't believe this deal is in a position to close very quickly. Everything we've seen lately indicates that's probably not going to happen. And I don't believe the NHL has never discussed relocation to Winnipeg. Which leads me to conclude very little of what Jimmy D said was anything other than the party line.

On that bolded part, we agree 100%

But I disagree that Bettman and the BOG have not discussed relocation, at length. And probably for >a year.

Once the NHL acquired the team out of bankruptcy, that was the critical first step. The team was in the league's and the BOGs control (despite the fact many here will claim it was in the control of Bettman and Daly).

I have no doubt that the BOG has been calling the shots since May of 2009 when Moyes chose to give his fellow owners the finger. And once the NHL acquired the team out of BK, the BOGs involvement intensified.

I know so many in Canada want more teams there. I do. But do the Leafs, Habs, Oilers, Sens, Canucks and Flames? I get the "rivalry" argument, I do. But do all of those teams truly believe that more teams in Canada will increase revenues for everyone? Or, might revenues diminish (even fractionally), getting spread around due to a 17%- 25% increase in the # of franchises in Canada?

Not trying to be a ******. I'm not. Sincere question. If you owned the rights (granted to you by the NHL) to a team, would you happily open your arms and welcome a new competitor? One or two that could divert television and merchandise revenue away from you (to name only two rev sources)?

 

[ovi1]

The total sales price being paid is $170M.

it will be 175-180 when TNSE pays for this team with cash

 

[cbcwpg]

Not trying to be a ******. I'm not. Sincere question. If you owned the rights (granted to you by the NHL) to a team, would you happily open your arms and welcome a new competitor? One or two that could divert television and merchandise revenue away from you (to name only two rev sources)?

It depends where that competitor is added. Remember that geographically Winnipeg is a long ways away from any other NHL market and putting a team in Winnipeg will not take away one person from attending games in Calgary, Edmonton, or Minneapolis. But if you were to put a team in Southern Ontario close to Buffalo, or a team in Red Deer just as an example ( half way between Edmonton and Calgary) then you have to see what that franchise would do to the close by teams. So it depends. The TV and merchandise revenues are shared based on the total number of teams in the NHL, so moving a team doesn't affect that, but say expanding from 30 teams to 32 teams will.

 

[Niagara67]

Burnside chimes in:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/columns/story?columnist=burnside_scott&id=6179973
Must've got that information from the City of Glendale fact sheet. Quite the scoop.

Where are the legal minds like GSC when you need them? I'm sure GSC would have requested a detailed analysis from the CoG to back up their fact sheet rather than just accepting their numbers. (or is that only for the other side..).

 

[Jeffrey93]

it will be 175-180 when TNSE pays for this team with cash

If that is all they're paying there better be a doozy of a relocation fee tacked onto that!

 

[airlouche]

Ha ha ha, I love the new title.

I wonder if someone will make a movie with this story, but oh boy what a long movie it will be.

 

[JetFan4Ever]

Thursday, March 3, comments are dated?

I know some here want to put on earmuffs if there is even an utterance of disagreement that the Coyotes are 99.99% on their way to Winnipeg. But there comes a point when that confidence becomes laughable.

Don't get me wrong. Not saying for a second there isn't a reasonable possibility the Coyotes move. But to simply dismiss the comments from Devellano, who has almost 30 years in management with the Wings, and who helped bring them back from the depths of being the laughing-stock of the NHL, is disingenuous to the nth degree. IMO, of course.

RR, I really don't think it's confidence but more likely optimisim. The people that want a team back in Winnipeg (any team) are really focused on that. Two sides, one team. After reading all the deabate on this it reminds me of an old saying about discovering the truth. There are three sides to every story, my side your side and the truth. I hope after this is all over we actually find out the truth.

 

[cbcwpg]

Still no dates coming from the NHL

http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/opinion/columnists/glendale-arrives-at-panic-stage-117393588.html

Bettman had this to say Thursday.

"(Goldwater) has put a cloud over the bonds, which is making it difficult to sell them. If it looks like the bonds can't sell because the clouds can't move, we're going to have to start exploring our other options," said Bettman.

 

[cbcwpg]

Its being said that the GWI's delaying of the bond sale could cost the CoG an additional $100M in interest because the bonds would have to be sold at 9% instead of 5-6%.

I'm sure if the CoG made a "donation" to the GWI of $100M , the GWI could be persuaded to look the other way and let the bonds be sold at a lower interest rate.

 

[Ludwig Fell Down]

I can't recall the last time the NHL even mentioned the existence of other options. For the last several months, it has been optimism, imminence, and the pieces are in place.

The blame game continues, it looks like the circular firing squad has been assembled.

 

[Grumpz]

If that is all they're paying there better be a doozy of a relocation fee tacked onto that!

It's rumored that the amount the TNSE pays included a relocation fee of around $25 million. The price of the team is around $130 million plus $140 million plus 1 yr of losses and a relocation fee.

Let's face it, with half a dozen teams bleeding money and ownership issues scattered everywhere, TNSE is in a position to bail the NHL on the first issue that becomes immediate. The NHL isn't in the position to charge something stupid.