Phoenix XLVIII: Of Mice and Lieberman

[Confucius]

I've heard of all them. Thanks. I happen to believe that everyone involved learned their lessons last year and thats why things have been handled out of the spotlight. As it should be. We shall see.

Oh that Bettman announcement was out of the spotlight, I see.

 

[powerstuck]

I would never put faith in the quality of any potential owner. Bettman and Daly would not have let it get this far without being comfortable that this group could fund the operations for an extended period of time. Agreed there hasn't been an OFFICIAL approval but the BOG would not reject them at this point.

I am skeptical as well that's why I am very interested to see if Jamison can do it.

I think what is a bit weird is that so far into process it has not been made public who are the investors, except Jamison who is known to not have the cash himself.

I think knowing that information (and I would assume GB and the league do know it) might raise up the confidence in this deal a bit higher. The city officials might know who they are (but I doubt) and that could be a swing needed to make sure 4 or more votes are obtained for the approval.

We can say what we want, but a strong approval vote is a good PR publicity. I think the current administration cannot vote on a 5 year deal (meaning there is maybe a out clause in 5 years or something like that). They cannot (I know it won't be them exactly) do this all again in 5 years it's just dumb. Most of their profits/revenues will come on long term, 5 years being a short term.

Now, if investors that are part of Jamison group are all outsiders and can go elsewhere as they want that is a sign of instability or at least a sign that if things turn bad, those guys won't stay.

On the other side, a few local investors who do not have individual knowledge or money but can make it done in a group are a positive thing and it means those guys have way more chances staying there if bad things happens after 5 years.

I'm gonna take Jim Balsillie as an exemple. The guy is a local investor for Hamilton. He won't buy a team if he can't move it to Hamilton, so he's not a good buyer.

But, put a team in Hamilton and start searching for an owner and Balsillie will come as the best guy ever for the job, because you know he will work his ass to make the team viable and established for 50 years in his region.

 

[SCP Guy]

Hmmmmmm I just changed my mind......I hope Glendale keeps the team.....keeps losing millions of dollars to help keep the cap low....I hope QC and Mark/Ham get expansion teams they pay 275 mil + for....then my team gets a nice cut of that large pie

Why think with common sense any more time to be greedy and look out for #1 lol

 

[NHLfan4life]

Why is this a problem. If all that Phoenix needs is a new owner (which is what the coyotes fans have been saying for a long time) for the fans to show up in droves, then it shouldn't be a problem to have a ticket drive to prove this point. Right?

I seriously doubt this would work in many existing markets, maybe one and that was Winnipeg.

I think you may know that already but maybe not.

Let's get the new owner and people showing up is up to the fans, not for the new owner to blackmail the already battered fanbase.

 

[CoyotesJetsFan]

Oh that Bettman announcement was out of the spotlight, I see.

Bettman never intended to have the announcement and said so in the presser. His hand was forced when Jude put on local TV Bettman/Daly were heading to the valley to announce the sale.

 

[NHLfan4life]

I would support that as a current STH. Put up or shut up IMO.

I am also a STH but I think it would be a little much to go 0-1000 right now. IMHO.

 

[GuelphStormer]

I am also a STH but I think it would be a little much to go 0-1000 right now. IMHO.

of course, i mean, why ask the fans to demonstrate that any of this is worth it ...

 

[viper0220]

Hmmmmmm I just changed my mind......I hope Glendale keeps the team.....keeps losing millions of dollars to help keep the cap low....I hope QC and Mark/Ham get expansion teams they pay 275 mil + for....then my team gets a nice cut of that large pie

Why think with common sense any more time to be greedy and look out for #1 lol

That's one of way of looking at it, with 275+275=550, each team get around 18 million but don't think that will happen for the next 4-5 years. And we want a team QC right now.

 

[OthmarAmmann]

I am also a STH but I think it would be a little much to go 0-1000 right now. IMHO.

Between a new ownership group headed by a proven individual, a trip to the WCF, and the ongoing budget fiasco, I think it's perfectly acceptable for the city to ask for support in the form of a STH drive in return for hammering the city into the ground financially.

 

[GuelphStormer]

Between a new ownership group headed by a proven individual, a trip to the WCF, and the ongoing budget fiasco, I think it's perfectly acceptable for the city to ask for support in the form of a STH drive in return for hammering the city into the ground financially.

exactly, its just a special form of a referendum. and it's only 9,000, not 13,000 or something utterly outrageous that no city could ever possibly achieve.

 

[CoyotesJetsFan]

I am also a STH but I think it would be a little much to go 0-1000 right now. IMHO.

It's all in how its handled. I want to see committment from more fans and this would be an easy way to find out.

The time to strike is now though. I have 4 seats..2 of which I give to my employees or charity and I have been asked by no less than 20 people offering as much as $180 per ticket for Games 1 and 2. I will have a drawing for those but have encouraged the "losers" to call my Coyotes rep for tickets. (Season tickets next year)

 

[powerstuck]

I seriously doubt this would work in many existing markets, maybe one and that was Winnipeg.

I think you may know that already but maybe not.

Let's get the new owner and people showing up is up to the fans, not for the new owner to blackmail the already battered fanbase.

I don't wanna speak about american markets, but so far in Canada :

Montreal Canadiens - Waiting list for ST (Source)
Toronto Maple Leafs - Waiting list for ST (Source)
Edmonton Oilers - Waiting list for ST (Source)
Calgary Flames - Waiting list for ST (Source)
Winnipeg Jets - Possibly a waiting list (Was unable to find an official team list)
Vancouver Canucks - Waiting list for ST (Source)

So, only Canadian team that officially still has ST for sale are Ottawa Senators.

If I find time later tonight i'll come up with the american list.

 

[Mungman]

Why is that? Nobody does that. Already discussed.

Whaddya mean? THIS FRANCHISE has done exactly that in the past, in their past incarnation as the Jets (version 1.1) I remember Barry Shenkarow (I think in cahoots with Winnipeg Enterprises (aka the City of Wpg)) having a big ticket drive in the late 80's or very early 90's to boost the STH base. If memory serves it was a deal the team had worked out with the city and province to cover the losses the team was incurring until a deal to build a new arena was in place.

We all know know that ended.

 

[Blitz]

Between a new ownership group headed by a proven individual, a trip to the WCF, and the ongoing budget fiasco, I think it's perfectly acceptable for the city to ask for support in the form of a STH drive in return for hammering the city into the ground financially.

exactly, its just a special form of a referendum. and it's only 9,000, not 13,000 or something utterly outrageous that no city could ever possibly achieve.

I don't wanna speak about american markets, but so far in Canada :

Montreal Canadiens - Waiting list for ST (Source)
Toronto Maple Leafs - Waiting list for ST (Source)
Edmonton Oilers - Waiting list for ST (Source)
Calgary Flames - Waiting list for ST (Source)
Winnipeg Jets - Possibly a waiting list (Was unable to find an official team list)
Vancouver Canucks - Waiting list for ST (Source)

So, only Canadian team that officially still has ST for sale are Ottawa Senators.

If I find time later tonight i'll come up with the american list.

IIRC Winnipeg capped the waiting list at 8K people during their 'drive to 13'

 

[Howler Scores]

A breakdown of last night's meeting:

http://storify.com/LisaHalverstadt/phoenix-coyotes-fans-critics-address-glendale-city

Its hard to decipher exactly who was for and who was against but 12 people signed up to talk. Of the tweets and from what I remember from last night I got 13 but I think the last lady jumped in after the announcement of 12 people...or something, 1 of my "for" or "against" votes could be wrong.

So this is the breakdown:
Glendale Residents For: 7
Glendale Residents Against: 3
Avondale Resident For: 1
Phoenix Resident For: 1
Phoenix Resident Against: 1

Council seems unchanged so the deal should pass with 4 yes votes.

 

[viper0220]

I don't wanna speak about american markets, but so far in Canada :

Montreal Canadiens - Waiting list for ST (Source)
Toronto Maple Leafs - Waiting list for ST (Source)
Edmonton Oilers - Waiting list for ST (Source)
Calgary Flames - Waiting list for ST (Source)
Winnipeg Jets - Possibly a waiting list (Was unable to find an official team list)
Vancouver Canucks - Waiting list for ST (Source)

So, only Canadian team that officially still has ST for sale are Ottawa Senators.

If I find time later tonight i'll come up with the american list.

For the winnipeg Jets there is a waiting list. They had to cap, not sure what number though.

 

[viper0220]

A breakdown of last night's meeting:

http://storify.com/LisaHalverstadt/phoenix-coyotes-fans-critics-address-glendale-city

Its hard to decipher exactly who was for and who was against but 12 people signed up to talk. Of the tweets and from what I remember from last night I got 13 but I think the last lady jumped in after the announcement of 12 people...or something, 1 of my "for" or "against" votes could be wrong.

So this is the breakdown:
Glendale Residents For: 7
Glendale Residents Against: 3
Avondale Resident For: 1
Phoenix Resident For: 1
Phoenix Resident Against: 1

Council seems unchanged so the deal should pass with 4 yes votes.

This deal may pass but Jamison does need to buy and operate the team.

 

[Mungman]

I don't wanna speak about american markets, but so far in Canada :

Montreal Canadiens - Waiting list for ST (Source)
Toronto Maple Leafs - Waiting list for ST (Source)
Edmonton Oilers - Waiting list for ST (Source)
Calgary Flames - Waiting list for ST (Source)
Winnipeg Jets - Possibly a waiting list (Was unable to find an official team list)
Vancouver Canucks - Waiting list for ST (Source)

So, only Canadian team that officially still has ST for sale are Ottawa Senators.

If I find time later tonight i'll come up with the american list.

Here's from the Jet's site (the list is closed at the moment, capped at 8000)

Season Ticket Waiting List
A one-time non refundable deposit of $50 per seat is required (maximum of 4 seats) to join the waiting list. This amount is not applied against any future purchases.

Commencing at the beginning of the 2012-13 season, a $100 annual membership fee will be due each season in order to retain membership on the waiting list. All membership fees collected and accumulated annually will be applied to the eventual ticket package as long as the membership is retained. Membership fees are otherwise non-refundable.

Members will receive priority seat numbers (based on the number of seats they choose) indicating their priority position. Each season, renewed members will receive an updated number as there will be accounts that will have the opportunity to purchase ticket packages and others that do not renew their waiting list membership.

Position on the waiting list is non-transferable, other than within immediate family.

...
We have capped our waiting list at a maximum of 8,000. Waiting list subscriptions are currently unavailable.

http://jets.nhl.com/club/page.htm?id=69828

 

[JetsFanForever]

I seriously doubt this would work in many existing markets, maybe one and that was Winnipeg.

I think you may know that already but maybe not.

Let's get the new owner and people showing up is up to the fans, not for the new owner to blackmail the already battered fanbase.

I don't know that it won't work, because as mentioned above, this kind of thing has happened before.

The reason that I'm pushing on this is because alot of the Phoenix fans have been saying that as soon as an owner is found then the fans will return. Based on this, it shouldn't be a problem to sell a bunch of ST.

You can call this blackmail all you want, but at some point the coyotes fan base has to stand up and support their team. If you can't do it for a new owner, and a team that is in the WCF then when will you be able to?

 

[Royale With Cheese]

IIRC Winnipeg capped the waiting list at 8K people during their 'drive to 13'

True story.

Not only could I not get season tickets, I couldn't even get on the waiting list! I was on the list with the other 12,000, but they dropped the list back down to 8,000.

I wonder if they will open up a waiting list for those who want to get on the waiting list.

Good times.

 

[Scottrocks58*]

This is turning into a Jets board, A-gain. Comparing the two markets is ludicrous. Winnipeg is, for one, Canadian, and for another, euphoric that the NHL gave them another team. The dynamics are completely different.

 

[JetsFanForever]

This is turning into a Jets board, A-gain. Comparing the two markets is ludicrous. Winnipeg is, for one, Canadian, and for another, euphoric that the NHL gave them another team. The dynamics are completely different.

If you are refering to my question about the ticket drive.

I have not brought up Winnipeg in reference to Phoenix. I'm just questioning why so many of the fans have said that the fans will come back with a new owner, but then there is reluctance to prove it with a ticket drive.

 

[CoyotesJetsFan]

exactly, its just a special form of a referendum. and it's only 9,000, not 13,000 or something utterly outrageous that no city could ever possibly achieve.

Does every post have to be in a smart ass tone? Not too much to ask to have a civil dialogue here.

 

[GuelphStormer]

This is turning into a Jets board, A-gain. Comparing the two markets is ludicrous. Winnipeg is, for one, Canadian, and for another, euphoric that the NHL gave them another team. The dynamics are completely different.

ok, so Phoenix cannot sell 9,000 ST? even at this moment in time, the very apex of hockey excitement?

if the City said, "no money until we see proof that this is worth our investment" and demanded 9,000 STH, then what would you do scott? renew? call friends to buy also? or, resent the blackmail and cancel?

i'd love to see the city do that. it would immediately place the burden on the fans, and it would go a long way towards disarming GWI as it would demonstrate lower losses, less subsidy, greater tax revenues, etc.

 

[NHLfan4life]

If you are refering to my question about the ticket drive.

I have not brought up Winnipeg in reference to Phoenix. I'm just questioning why so many of the fans have said that the fans will come back with a new owner, but then there is reluctance to prove it with a ticket drive.

While I agree with you on the fans proving themselves now, I just don't think this is the way to do it in AZ.