Phoenix LXIII: I Have Become Comfortably Numb

[powerstuck]

oh lets me honest. none of us in Canada care about the number of cops and firefighters in Glendale. We just want the team in QC

While that is true...there is still a level of absurdity I hope for the WHOLE WORLD to not witness.

After all, if a bunch of bozos in Glendale can go and say : If our tax increase is defeated, we will simply cut more personnel, because paying $300M for a pro-hockey team is more important.

I don't want to know what a bigger bunch of bozos is doing with your and my retirement funds that we have no choice but to contribute to but that our unions and bank investors blindly invest in stock markets.

 

[goyotes]

oh lets me honest. none of us in Canada care about the number of cops and firefighters in Glendale. We just want the team in QC

I appreciate the honesty and candor of this remark. I think you will likely get your wish when the season starts next year. IMO it's not looking good for a deal to be worked out between the CoG and GJ. I have great respect for the hockey fans in Canada and QC. I know the Coyotes (or whatever rebrand they experience) will be appreciated and the players will enjoy playing there.

 

[aqib]

"Won't someone PLEASE think of the children!!!"

I care.... about another team in Canada!

I think its time for another transcript of a typical argument between Coyotes fans, Winnipeg, QC, and the Rest of Canada

Winnipeg: You're not really going to layoff cops and fire fighters to fund a hockey team are you

Coyotes Fan: stop it.

Winnipeg: I mean we wouldn't do that and we actually like hockey

Coyotes Fan: Stop it.

QC: Are you guys done yet, because we kind of need to know if we should finish upgrading our old arena or just wait for the new one to finish

Winnipeg: They aren't done they are trying to decide if its more important to have a hockey team or safe streets.

QC: Oh hey Winnipeg whats up.

Winnipeg: Not much just chilling hassling the Coyotes fan. Waiting for the season to start you know same old same old

Coyotes Fans: Why are you still here! You got a team now leave us alone.

Winnipeg: Don't take it so personally. We only bother you because we really don't like you

QC: So are they really deciding between safe streets and the NHL?

Winnipeg: Yeah its really funny considering no one actually goes to games down there

Coyotes fan: Enough with the we don't go to games nonsense we DID sell out the playoffs you know!

Winnipeg: Dude really? We sell out every game for the next 5 years at $80 a seat and we don't need grocery store giveaways either.

Coyotes Fan: that happened once and...

Winnipeg: I have links to a bunch of giveaways and discounts you did would you like me the present them

Coyotes Fan: Withdrawn. But let me just say Moyes Moyes Moyes Gretzky Gretzky Gretzky

Rest of Canada: Hey guys where does this stand?

Winnipeg: Oh hey ROC, what brings you here?

Rest of Canada: we're taking a break from the CBA talks just checking if this thing is done so we can take care of QC that way we're almost to 10.

GTA: Remember we're next! We need an NHL team!

QC: Don't you have the Leafs

GTA: ok a REAL NHL team

Hamilton: Oh no you don't. We've been waiting since before your Cup drought was even 20 years old.

ROC: Settle down you two. We're going to take care of both of you

Saskatoon: What about us

Halifax: And us

ROC: ugh not you two again

Saskatoon: we have a larger arena than Winnipeg does and..,

Winnipeg: Hey hey hey! Why you got be like that Sask? We didn't say anything about you!

Saskatoon: Well its just true

ROC: Thats enough out of you Saskatoon. If you triple your population come we'll talk, until then shut up, you're just making all of us look silly.

Halifax: Ha ha ROC called you silly

ROC: Halifax you need to double your population. Not losing everyone under 40 might help

Saskatoon: BURN!

ROC: Sask you're both on time out

Saskatoon and Halifax: grrrr

Coyotes fans: I can't believe you're talking about putting teams in small Canadian cities especially at OUR expense. Don't you know how many people we have here.

Winnipeg: yeah but

ROC: Hang on PEG I got this. Coyotes Fan how many of them like hockey

Coyotes fan: Some but

ROC: Ok stop right there. Out of those that like hockey how many of them are Coyotes fans and not transplants who only go when their team is in town and root against the Coyotes?

Coyotes: well less but Moyes Moyes Moyes Gretzky Gretzky Gertzky

ROC: Lawyered!

Coyotes Fan:

ROC: ok Peg so where do we stand on getting closing out the Phoenix chapter and getting the team out of there

Winnipeg: Well the election tomorrow could provide some answers. If the sales tax gets repealed and/or an anti-Coyotes council gets elected Skeete may pull the plug on the deal

ROC: this Skeete fellow, is he an educated man

Winnipeg: He got his masters from University of Phoenix

ROC: You mean the online school with the annoying pop-up ads?

Winnipeg: yep thats the place

ROC:

ROC: ok so assuming cyber school boy pushes it through then what

Winnipeg: Jamison needs to finish raising the cash, then sign the deal, then we still have the chance Goldwater Institute might sue

ROC: Isn't Goldwater those rightwing lunatics who oppose healthcare, most government spending, and pretty much everything we Canadians stand for

Winnipeg: yeah pretty much, but they are our allies here

ROC: Common enemies really do make strange bedfellows

Winnipeg: So we should have some answers tomorrow unless we don't

QC: so what should we do

ROC: Just sit tight. we'll see what happens tomorrow then we can put a timeline together. So with the lockout, if this thing falls apart in the next week we can move them now otherwise its probably after the season. In the mean time make us some this plotting to remake the NHL is making me hungry.

Winnipeg: Yeah we'll have an analysis for everyone to review around midnight tomorrow assuming they count the votes at a decent pace. You know how Americans are with counting votes. Or Counting

ROC: thats true they don't fair well in math scores do they

Winnipeg: I wonder if they cut math teachers to fund the hockey team too

ROC: Its possible maybe thats why they haven't figures out that their attendance is low

Coyotes fan: Thats enough! how will you even afford the team? Huh? Huh?

QB: PKP will put it on his black card

Coyotes fan: Damn you all

ROC/QC/Winnipeg:

 

[Whileee]

I honestly hope they realise this. Because, if tax doesn't pass, I can't believe they could say, oh well, we will cut 200 more firefighters and 400 more police officers to compensate...but again it's Glendale and everything can happen.

As others have commented, I'm not sure if anyone outside Glendale cares that much about their financial situation, or service and staffing cuts that might result from paying Jamison the large subsidy for the Coyotes.

My point was that at some point the political weight (and maybe even one's conscience) of having to make huge staffing cuts while supporting the Coyotes' deal could sway a council member. Knaack seems more likely to be swayed by calamitous events than Clark and others, and it seems like the group planning the recall probably sense that she might be swayed by the pressure.

I also don't think that it is a given that someone who now supports the subsidy as a candidate will support it as an elected council member, particularly if it is in the face of no increase in sales tax and the resulting financial mess. People are much more inclined to cling to their previous decisions than they are to go to the mat for something that someone else has put in place.

 

[Whileee]

I think its time for another transcript of a typical argument between Coyotes fans, Winnipeg, QC, and the Rest of Canada

Some funny and insightful stuff in that post, aqib.

I think that you missed some of the parts where Coyotes fans and many in the ROC insist that: a) the NHL would NEVER go back to Winnipeg because they want the big television audiences that are bound to emerge as soon as hockey catches on in places like Phoenix and, b) there is no way that Winnipeg can support a team with such a weak economy, so few corporate head offices, and such a small arena and, c) Winnipeg has long cold winters, etc., etc., etc.

15 years without an NHL team made many Winnipeg hockey fans rather grumpy, and the rest of the stuff made some of them rather snarky.

 

[aqib]

Some funny and insightful stuff in that post, aqib.

I think that you missed some of the parts where Coyotes fans and many in the ROC insist that: a) the NHL would NEVER go back to Winnipeg because they want the big television audiences that are bound to emerge as soon as hockey catches on in places like Phoenix and, b) there is no way that Winnipeg can support a team with such a weak economy, so few corporate head offices, and such a small arena and, c) Winnipeg has long cold winters, etc., etc., etc.

15 years without an NHL team made many Winnipeg hockey fans rather grumpy, and the rest of the stuff made some of them rather snarky.

well to be fair, if I was a Jets fan and had that happen to me I would be pretty grumpy too. Especially witnessing the degree to which the league went to save the Coyotes which far exceeds what happened in the Peg.

 

[DancesWithWookies]

So answer me this:

If the city of Glendale accepts the ballot initiative to eliminate the tax increase, does that mean the Coyotes are leaving Arizona for sure?

Also, does anyone have a link to election coverage for Glendale tomorrow to watch live?

Thanks!

 

[cbcwpg]

So answer me this:

If the city of Glendale accepts the ballot initiative to eliminate the tax increase, does that mean the Coyotes are leaving Arizona for sure?

Thanks!

In this mess? You're looking for a sure thing? Not happening.

Even if the tax increase is voted down, nobody can say for "sure" what will happen. Who knows, maybe Joyce Clark will start up a big ponzi scheme of shuffling money from one place to the other for the next 20 years to pay Jamison his AMF.

 

[mzappa]

@aqib

thats some good work

 

[aqib]

So answer me this:

If the city of Glendale accepts the ballot initiative to eliminate the tax increase, does that mean the Coyotes are leaving Arizona for sure?

Also, does anyone have a link to election coverage for Glendale tomorrow to watch live?

Thanks!

Election coverage tomorrow will be focused on the Presidential election and Arizona has a Senate race as well so I guess that even if we could get a local TV feed I doubt they will be talking about suburban races. I am one of the more frequent posters on the Phoenix threads but I will be zeroed in on presidential races and a few races in Ohio (my US home). I may check in around 11 after the west coast polls close.

 

[madhi19]

I think every Hockey fans should care about Glendale getting conned this way. Because if Gary pull this crap off in Glendale there will come a time when he going to try somewhere else!

 

[aqib]

@aqib

thats some good work

thanks. its been a while since I did one. who knows this may be reaching the end if things are decisive.

 

[ajmidd12]

aqib, well done, well done. Can I play the Winnipegger in the straight to DVD film?

 

[davemac1313]

I think every Hockey fans should care about Glendale getting conned this way. Because if Gary pull this crap off in Glendale there will come a time when he going to try somewhere else!

I don't think they have been conned...they bought magic beans and can't understand why there are no golden eggs.

Cmon, the due diligence on the part of COG is severely lacking, how much did that RFP to manage the arena come out too??...wait..never did one....

25 million you want...OK..no strings attached...no need to do any booking

Hey if Matt says the parking lot is worth a hundred million...it must be cause TL says so too and we pay him

The only conning that has gone on is squarely in the hands of the politicians that keep putting money into this without asking for a guarantee or without any plan beyond signing a cheque. They have conned the community by promoting this as good for the taxpayers.

The NHL never told them to build...that is on them and Ellman, Beasley perpetuated this by continually promising potential owners money he couldn't ultimately deliver, the NHL would have ended this sham 3 years ago, had it not been for the giddy council members jumping in over their heads with no long term thought.

The team was bought by the league, they simply said we want to keep it here, but until we find a buyer we want 25 million, because we don't want to pay the losses having a club in Glendale costs. All Glendale needed to do was do a little due diligence, ask a few questions and get a guarantee. They did not. Do you really believe for one second that the NHL wouldn't leave the team in Glendale if someone had the money to buy it? No one will because it is a money pit; yesterday, today and tomorrow. Funny Edmonton knew enough to say no and that team sells out...it has been clear for years that this club will never succeed financially, despite Killions insistence. The only thing other NHL cities need to worry about in this regard, is whether or not they are competent enough to understand the financial aspect and outcome of what is being asked. They got the team in the first place because a government said...we can't afford your asking price Gary, we tried but can't make the financials work...sad day Yes, but the right decision at the time.

Gary is only guilty of putting the sticker price real high on a lemon, COG walked in and paid that price, no negotiation, no questions and no warranty, only because they wanted the prestige of saying we have an NHL Team. If all of them, the NHL, Beasley, JR and the COG hadn't been so intent on screwing over Moyes and offered him even half the money they have thrown at either the NHL or ANY other potential buyer, NONE of this would ever have happened, certainly not when it did, later perhaps.

The COG has no one to blame but themselves.

If you buy a car with no block heater and you live in an area that is 40 below in the winter.....who's fault is it when the thing won't start in January? Using the blame Gary logic....blame Obama and Harper for bailing out the automakers, take no personal responsibility...sorry not going to buy that argument.

 

[OthmarAmmann]

Phoenix LXIX: Longer than a term in Congress, and even less progress!
Phoenix LXIX: Hanging chads got nothing on this!
Phoenix LXIX: Indecision 2012 (and 2011 and 2010 and 2009)
Phoenix LXIX: So long Cactus Phil, keep it real (but not lucid)

 

[Major4Boarding]

Landscape of tomorrow coming into view now. Yep, it' from Sunnucks

Car dealers fighting Arizona sales tax increases on two fronts
Phoenix Business Journal by Mike Sunnucks, Senior Reporter
Date: Monday, November 5, 2012, 4:14pm MST

The Arizona Automobile Dealers Association has donated $339,000 to the No on Proposition 204 camp. The statewide measure asks voters to permanently keep Arizona’s sales tax at 6.6 percent.

Voters temporarily increased the state levy in 2010 but it runs out next year. Prop. 204 keeps it 6.6 percent and would earmark revenue to schools, colleges, state highway construction and other spending area.

The AADA’s big donation follows up on Sanderson Ford’s opposition to a Glendale sales tax increase and advocacy of Proposition 457.

...

AADA officials declined comment on their backing for the No on 204 campaign.

http://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/blog/business/2012/11/car-dealers-fighting-arizona-sales-tax.html

Regarding Glendale

Arizona Treasurer and former Cold Stone Creamery CEO Doug Ducey is leading the effort against the measure.

That campaign also recently received a $30,000 contribution from the Arizona Chamber of Commerce & Industry and $125,000 from the Arizona Free Enterprise Club.

AFEC is backing Glendale’s tax cut measure and has spent money to oust pro-sales tax and pro-Phoenix Coyotes Councilwoman Joyce Clark.

http://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/...ealers-fighting-arizona-sales-tax.html?page=2

 

[Major4Boarding]

Forgot the link to the video from today's workhop

http://glendale-az.granicus.com/MediaPlayer.php?publish_id=584

Special Workshop Agenda

http://www.glendaleaz.com/clerk/agendasandminutes/Workshops/Agendas/110512.pdf

 

[htpwn]

Great post aqib.

And please, for the love of... no one quote it.

 

[CasualFan]

Phoenix LXIX: Longer than a term in Congress, and even less progress!
Phoenix LXIX: Hanging chads got nothing on this!
Phoenix LXIX: Indecision 2012 (and 2011 and 2010 and 2009)
Phoenix LXIX: So long Cactus Phil, keep it real (but not lucid)

It really has been spectacular

 

[tarheelhockey]

Great job trolling the few Coyotes fans loyal enough to still put up with this board, aqib! That'll keep them from feeling like this is a welcoming place to discuss the situation!

On a less sarcastic note, how about we not act like ***holes to people who are faced with losing their team in the immediate future.

 

[Morgoth Bauglir]

Great job trolling the few Coyotes fans loyal enough to still put up with this board, aqib! That'll keep them from feeling like this is a welcoming place to discuss the situation!

On a less sarcastic note, how about we not act like ***holes to people who are faced with losing their team in the immediate future.

I'm St. Patrick and I endorse this message

 

[TheLegend]

Great job trolling the few Coyotes fans loyal enough to still put up with this board, aqib! That'll keep them from feeling like this is a welcoming place to discuss the situation!

On a less sarcastic note, how about we not act like ***holes to people who are faced with losing their team in the immediate future.

Don't worry......

After three years of putting up with trolling via Hamilton, Winnipeg, and lately Quebec City..... we're kinda used to it.

 

[aqib]

aqib, well done, well done. Can I play the Winnipegger in the straight to DVD film?

I wouldn't have it any other way. I wrote that character with you in mind

 

[TheLegend]

On another note.....

Joyce Clark was on the radio today with a few of pieces of information I'll pass along. You may chew..... spit...... regurgitate on it at your leisure......

-- Greg Jamison will be in Glendale this Wednesday (11/7) to discuss the revised AMF with Skeete..... and apparently will also be meeting with council members.

-- Clark has looked over a copy of the current revised AMF as it stands and estimated roughly 90% of it is the same as the original Jamison AMF.

-- There are exactly three items left to be worked out. Jamison's visit on Wednesday is for addressing those three items. Do not know what these items are or how large a part they play in the revision.

-- Per previous ruling in the GWI v Glendale suit..... Once the revised AMF is finalized it is to be made public at least one week prior to a council vote. Clark estimated that may not take place until late November or first week in December.

-- Revised AMF would be open for a referendum drive (ala Ken Jones) if it passes a council vote (for those who think a signature drive by hordes of Canadians would help, Ken might be accommodating . ).

 

[aqib]

Great job trolling the few Coyotes fans loyal enough to still put up with this board, aqib! That'll keep them from feeling like this is a welcoming place to discuss the situation!

On a less sarcastic note, how about we not act like ***holes to people who are faced with losing their team in the immediate future.

oh did I forget the to make the sarcasm more obvious?