Prospect Info: Phantoms (AHL), Reading Royals (ECHL), NCAA, Jrs., Int'l, etc. [mid-March 2021 edition]

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renberg

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My biggest issue with Patrick is that we've seen no growth in his game whatsoever. He didn't look any better his sophomore season. He has looked worse this season but I am willing to give him a pass on it for obvious reasons. Next season he needs to take a big step forward, assuming we keep him, or it's time to re-assess his ceiling and possibly move on.
I’m with you on his lack of professional growth, especially this year. I don’t discount the AV/staff impact. Like other players, their lack of development is a real cause of concern. If it was just NP, that would be one thing bits it’s more than him.
 

GapToothedWonder

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Dec 20, 2013
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I love how since Kase started the season as their best player... once he was sent back from Flyers...

bottom six mainly playing with guys like Mueller, Wilson, Laberge and Ratcliffe.

At least now has Willman.

But just bizarre. Mueller (who is a joke) and O'Reilly get the pick of wingers and offensive situations.

Does not help the Phantoms. And since Kase is not going to be at C in NHL anyway how is it helping him?

1st line on the Czech national team to 4th line on a "fine" AHL team in a few months. Got to look out for O'Reilly, Fitzgerald, Mueller etc.

You're under the false impression that the goal of the Phantoms is to develop prospects into NHL players.
 

Rebels57

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You're under the false impression that the goal of the Phantoms is to develop prospects into NHL players.

Bingo.

Fire Gordon. Hire a young coach you forsee as your future Flyers coach. Have him develop guys for the Flyers knowing he'll be up there coaching them one day. Truthfully this is what they should have done with Knoblauch to begin with but that ship has sailed.
 

Larry44

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My biggest issue with Patrick is that we've seen no growth in his game whatsoever. He didn't look any better his sophomore season. He has looked worse this season but I am willing to give him a pass on it for obvious reasons. Next season he needs to take a big step forward, assuming we keep him, or it's time to re-assess his ceiling and possibly move on.
I have to disagree that Patrick didn't show any development. The biggest factor has been head injuries. He started his first and second seasons with head injuries and missed time. By Christmas, he was playing well again. Then he a lost season to migraines brought on by a puck in the head (and the two head shots days before it).

I've been watching him closely this year, and he's playing a smart positional game. He's in on the forecheck, backchecks to the proper spot, makes nice passes, gets scoring chances, is more physical than ever before (to his credit after the year off). It's coming. How many deflections has he made in the last few weeks that just didn't make it in? How many nice chances? If he wasn't getting any, that would be a worry.

On top of everything else, if Patrick doesn't develop into a 1B centre to support Couts we're screwed. Frost isn't it. Hayes is too slow. None of the other prospects are Cs except Laczynski and Kase who I like but are bottom 6 guys.

They are going to have to draft Cs and if they trade Patrick, it has to be for a young 2C in return (who will do that?). In either case, that means no contender for 3-4 more years, so we might as well trade G and JV and do a rebuild under Couts. Patrick has always been a star player and has all the tools, he just needs some luck with his health and a coach who can make lines and leave them together. And no more shots off the noggin from his own team....
 

Rebels57

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I have to disagree that Patrick didn't show any development. The biggest factor has been head injuries. He started his first and second seasons with head injuries and missed time. By Christmas, he was playing well again. Then he a lost season to migraines brought on by a puck in the head (and the two head shots days before it).

I've been watching him closely this year, and he's playing a smart positional game. He's in on the forecheck, backchecks to the proper spot, makes nice passes, gets scoring chances, is more physical than ever before (to his credit after the year off). It's coming. How many deflections has he made in the last few weeks that just didn't make it in? How many nice chances? If he wasn't getting any, that would be a worry.

On top of everything else, if Patrick doesn't develop into a 1B centre to support Couts we're screwed. Frost isn't it. Hayes is too slow. None of the other prospects are Cs except Laczynski and Kase who I like but are bottom 6 guys.

They are going to have to draft Cs and if they trade Patrick, it has to be for a young 2C in return (who will do that?). In either case, that means no contender for 3-4 more years, so we might as well trade G and JV and do a rebuild under Couts. Patrick has always been a star player and has all the tools, he just needs some luck with his health and a coach who can make lines and leave them together. And no more shots off the noggin from his own team....

Jarrett Stoll could do those things too. Im not worried about Patricks defensive game. Its his offensive game. Granted I have tuned out the last few weeks, but I didnt see the passes and scoring chances you mentioned when I was watching. He has 43 shots in 42 games. He needs to up that quite a bit next year. His shot totals have actually dropped with each season. Add to that a 92 PDO and you get the awful production.
 
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Larry44

#FireTortsNOW
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Amazing how Frost went from a 20 year old that had 7 points in 20 NHL games to somebody that is never going to be an impactful player because of one injury.
Frost is going to be a good NHL player, but I don't think he's going to be star, and at best he's a 2nd line winger, which we have a lot of currently. There's a reason he was 13th fwd at the start of the year.

We'll see and only hope. I'd love to see Frost and Foerster blossom, that would solve a lot of problems. If other guys like Wisdom, Brink and O'Brien do too, we could have a good team in a few years.
 

hystyk1921

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Jun 17, 2015
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Drafting college kids is not a problem. Allison and Laczynski signed. Kalynuk apparently was always hoping not to be drafted to he could be a UDFA, he got his wish by refusing to sign so they traded him. Marody was the same.

We don't know that this means Noah Cates is not signing. He clearly wants to try to win one more national championship. The Flyers signed his brother, so it's not like the family hates the org, quite the contrary. I expect to sign Noah at the end of his next season, so he can burn a year off his ELC like his big bro did.

Brink, O'Brien and Attard et all, we'll see.

Not bad players in the system, that’s not the issue. Draft players from any league just ones that don’t have skating issues too risky. It’s up to the player to fix it. Mcdavid skating ability is why teams in the league are trying to build a fast/skilled team. Islanders are one example of that need to compete
 
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deadhead

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Feb 26, 2014
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Islanders have three forwards who can skate (Barzal, Beauvillier, Pageau), the rest are average or worse. And most of their defensemen are average skaters.
Toronto has great skill players who can skate, and haven't made it past the 1st rd in four years.
 

CanadianFlyer88

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Feb 12, 2004
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Islanders have three forwards who can skate (Barzal, Beauvillier, Pageau), the rest are average or worse. And most of their defensemen are average skaters.
Toronto has great skill players who can skate, and haven't made it past the 1st rd in four years.
Since you made it sound like the Leafs had a modicum of success five years ago, let's all remember that Toronto hasn't made it past the first round since 2004. ;)
 

Rebels57

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Frost is going to be a good NHL player, but I don't think he's going to be star, and at best he's a 2nd line winger, which we have a lot of currently. There's a reason he was 13th fwd at the start of the year.

We'll see and only hope. I'd love to see Frost and Foerster blossom, that would solve a lot of problems. If other guys like Wisdom, Brink and O'Brien do too, we could have a good team in a few years.

Lmao, if this isnt the Flyers motto of the last 10 years I dont know what is.
 

dats81

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Jan 22, 2011
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He was the 13th fw because he is projected as a center at the NHL level (which he should until proven wrong) and because they wanted to hold onto former 2nd overall draft pick Nolan Patrick ... who at least on paper was a better fit for the 3C role.

Later Frost coincidently going down with a season ending injury when Couturier was sidelined with the 1C spot wide open for him was nothing but bad luck.
Neither Fletcher nor Vignault are disliking Frost. In fact it's quite the opposite. I still remember AV his first season being asked by a beat who he wanted to be called up and he immediately came up with Frost.
 
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Curufinwe

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Feb 28, 2013
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Frost is going to be a good NHL player, but I don't think he's going to be star, and at best he's a 2nd line winger, which we have a lot of currently. There's a reason he was 13th fwd at the start of the year.

If he hadn't got hurt I think he'd be the 2C right now, at least in terms of offensive deployment.
 

mr4tno

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Oct 13, 2017
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Wade Allison, Tanner Lac and York are on the team right now dude....
I think it is more of the perveived trend. True they are all on the team, but we had a heck of a time signing Allison and Lacz (and even JVR back in the day). They all stayed a year longer than the team wanted. I wouldn't be surprised if the pandemic actually helped us sign them (bird in the hand theory). First round picks are a little different because they tend to sign after one-two years so free agency is far into the future, but once a player gets to that 3/4th year they can start to "touch" the free agency, and let's face it the flyers do not appear to be a coveted destination for most young players...
 
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Larry44

#FireTortsNOW
Mar 1, 2002
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And how many developed in anything? I have no tim right now to search it. But i cant think of one in the last years. Just asking.
Whether the players are drafted from CHL, USHL/College or Europe, I think there is lots of stat evidence (which someone here will have) that after mid-2nd round, the chances of getting an NHL player out of the draft are very slim.

Finding guys in the 5th or 6th round who can play are a bonus, e.g. Lindblom, Laczynski, maybe Ersson. Teams that find gems like Kucherov later in the drafts are teams that have depth.

Teams like the Flyers that can find NHL players from undrafted free agents out of college, Jr or Europe do well. Myers, Zamula, Raffl for example, give you depth. We'll see about Jackson Cates and Sandin.

The Flyers have done well to get at least one, often two, regular players from each draft. I'm sure that's better than the league average.

In 2016, we drafted 10 players and 5 of them dressed for the Flyers this year. Not all will have NHL careers, but that's looking like a good draft if Allison keeps up his great start and Laczynski gets healthy, esp. considering the top two picks haven't made it.

You can look at all the guys we've drafted and see that almost all of them failed to make the NHL, whether from CHL, USHL/college bound, or Europe.

"It is what it is," Paul Holmgren.

All Draft Choices - Philadelphia Flyers - Team
 
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