You talk like the US just banged your wife lol...
Not if you are a Canadian you don't. 45% is still half more or less. Not much has changed in the last two decades. Since the turn of the century we have been at around 53%. Two decades and still not much has changed. The big difference has been more Americans in the last decade. Russians have dropped in the NHL.
Top level talent is still more or less half Canadian.
Top 20 scorers the last 10 years:
2010 - 8/20
2011 - 10/20
2012 - 10/20
2013 - 11/20
2014 - 11/20
2015 - 9/20
2016 - 9/20
2017 - 8/20
2018 - 9/20
2019 - 9/20 (so far this year)
So not a whole lot of change if any at all. When you go back further it gets more noticeable.
2000 - 9/20
1995 - 12/20
1990 - 18/20
1985 - 15/20
1980 - 19/20
People forget that from the mid 1990s onward half of the top scorers were non-Canadian then too. Heck, in the late 1990s we had an emergency Summit over it in Canada. So not a lot has changed. It is just that then you had maybe 60% of the NHL as Canadian.
Top 20 scorers that are American:
2000 - 4/20
2004 - 2/20 (and that was the 19th and 20th scorers)
2006 - 1/20
2010 - 3/20
2015 - 3/20
2016 - 4/20
2017 - 3/20
2018 - 3/20
2019 - 5/20 (so far)
But more to the story Americans make up 27% of the NHL so there are more 2nd and 3rd liners from the US than ever before.
We shall see. There was a time in the late 1990s when it was a foregone conclusion that Europeans were going to be 50/50 with North Americans. I remember an article years back when there was almost a panic that of all the "new" additions in the NHL (this is maybe around 2000 or so) that Canada only made up 50% of them. The idea was that Americans were pretty stagnant with their development but that European countries were going to take over, which isn't crazy to see at the time since they were winning the major awards, had the best goal scorers in the NHL and were winning the international tournaments. I want to say it was Anders Hedberg who said in that article a few years back that eventually the NHL was going to be a 50% league of North Americans and 50% of everyone else.
Things changed. Russia has never been the same since the collapse of the Soviet Union. Sweden went into a tailspin for a while, as did the Czechs and the Finns were never that dominant to start with. Canada smartened up a bit and things stayed the same for pretty much the next decade or so. It is the Americans that have made the push since and we are at a point where the NHL has almost a 75%/25% North American/European ratio today. So that European surge never happened.
While it may look like Americans are poised to take over in the next 20-25 years all it takes is for Canada to wake up a little bit more in order to maintain what they have already. Canada has had their worst decade when it comes to percentage of players drafted in the NHL and their performances in the World Juniors (2 gold in the 2010s). So my guess is we will work on that and find other ways to improve.
Hockey Canada won't do **** until it loses a couple of high profile international tournaments on the senior men's level. so, a couple of loses at a World Cup combined with an NHL Olympics or two is what it will take.
They couldn't care less about gold medals at the World Juniors. That's their cash cow. That's how Hockey Canada defines success at the junior level. They have long since bought into the NHL mantra of parity is good for the game and keeps the cash spigot on and money flowing. The only thing that riles Canadians up more and keeps us more invested in the game than winning - is losing. They'll have a few years of success and then go into sleep mode and only rev up the machine when it's absolutely critical to do so., My guess is next year heading to the Czech Rep is not mission critical, but the year after heading back to Canada the pressure might be turned up a notch.
Now, around the midway point of the season, the figure is just 44.1%.
1Canada44.1%2United States26.8%3Sweden10.0%4Finland5.5%5Russia4.2%6Czech Republic4.1%7Switzerland1.4%8Slovakia1.0%9Denmark0.8%10Germany0.7%11Austria0.3%12Latvia0.2%13Norway0.2%14France0.2%15Australia0.1%16Slovenia0.1%17Netherlands0.1%
But are they doing enough at the grassroots level to produce the best players in the world. Don Cherry isn't off on this idea that we ought to teach our own first. In a way, the "Canadian" way was sort of a top secret formula. There always seemed to be that extra gear we could hit and dig a bit deeper to score that big goal. Which is why we scored to many big ones over the years. Now we've let that secret out because we are teaching everyone. The Finnish goalie at the WJC this year plays in the OHL.
Canada should be proud that they have more NHL players than the US, Sweden and Finland do combined together. You have to throw in half of the Russians to even it out.
Having most of the top NHL scorers being Canadian, is still amazing!
Thou doth protest...
I know pre draft rankings are a lot of people with different opinions.
Though this years upcoming draft once again has a Canadian falling just outside the top five rankings.
This post is way off base. Let's just change the facts and history to create false narratives.
I suppose we should credit Canada for inventing the game of Volleyball as well.
Everyone I know wants to see the best players in the world perform on the big stage. The players themselves wanted to compete and win a gold medal for their country. It's the Olympics. I'm sure yourself was intrigued to watch MJ and Magic shine. It was always crazy not to allow the best to play and represent their country in the same way the World Cup of soccer is played.
At the time (up until 1988 I believe) the US was still winning the Olympic gold medals with college athletes. But at the same time the NBA was in its golden era. What better way to showcase the game and great stars like Jordan, Magic and Bird than to tour around the world?
It's incorrect to suggest that the US did this solely because of National Pride.
Before the Dream Team was assembled in 1992 basketball fans around the world already knew the best players weren't even on the court. These games garnered so much attention and were sell outs. European basketball teams knew if they competed and won the silver it would earn them respect. It also motivated those countries to get better and helped teach them what's necessary to do so.
The Dream Team wasn't really necessary to prove anything.
The climate has changed from the late 1980's and most Americans embrace the diversity of the sport. It's awesome to grow the sport to maximum popularity. Losing in 2004 was embarrassing and bad but at the same time it showed how much other countries have progressed.
oh, you can be sure part of the point was asserting dominance after recent failure in what was considered an "American" sport, don't kid yourself there.losing to the Soviet Union of all places on the olympic stage with all the world watching did not go over well at all and the media starting asking questions immediately after. Not that your points here about wanting to see all the best players wasn't true but the fans and media were not happy that the Euros were starting to get their number with the college boys, it's so long ago now that there is no way I can find the articles in sports illustrated, etc and stuff on T.v that I saw and read at that time but I can assure you plenty were wringing their hands, they had taken it for granted for so long that the college guys would always be good enough to get it done because the U.S was so far ahead until one day the woke up and saw they could no longer do that, enter the calls for the pros.
I can't even imagine if football was an international sport like hockey and the U.S started losing in that, the U.S would want blood. To think otherwise from one of the most patriotic countries on earth, you know, the one that coined and truly believes in the term "American exceptionalism" would be quite naive.
Was it the sole point for the pros involvement at the olympics? no, but you can be sure it was high up there in importance, that's enough.
Americans or anyone else are not any different that way then Canada in this manner, all you have to do is read the threads on this site here at HF to see how nationalistic fans from each country are, you can see it is this thread even. The Euros are probably the most extreme example of this, they would not even follow the N.H.L or be on this site if not for players from their own country, everyone knows that.That is their one and sole interest for 95% of them. So who are we kidding when it's insinuated that Canadian fans have some unique trait concerning where players in hockey are from? They seem to have less of that trait to be honest, because most by all appearances, on HF at least, seem to only care about whether the player is helping their club team win, not where he is from, I mean the rinks seem to be pretty full aside from Ottawa and with the way that gong show is with ownership who could blame them? it's certainly not because there isn't enough players from Canada.
If New Zealand were to start failing in rugby and their players did not have dominance anymore there would be an outcry, it's not a "Canadian" thing at all.
And to boot you are not even taking into account of what hockey means to Canada culturally as a small and very insignificant country(compared to the U.S and other powers) sitting in the shadow of the behemoth of the United States right next door. It's a unique cultural situation and that needs to be factored in which you don't seem to do. You seem to want to paint it all with a theory of hyper Ethnocentrism unique to Canadians, I gotta call falsity on that one.
Some of your points here are accurate but you shade others or leave them completely out.
Basketball is an American invention and the US expects to be the best. The US was undoubtedly and unapologetically sending a message after losing to the Soviets in 1988.
I used the word "solely" because I cited other factors. Also The 2004 loss was taken pretty serious. No country wants to lose at their own game. That loss opened a lot of eyes and shook the world. US fans, its citizens and supporters were deeply upset. As I recall it was extremely stunning and embarrassing for the basketball loving country.
It's certainly not just a Canadian thing and I was probably too harsh. I happen to love the passion and enthusiasm of Canadian hockey fans and wish that existed in the States.
Thank you, well balanced, thoughtful and reasoned post.
So this thread boils down to blind Nationalism.
Please see the stats that i just compile from Eliteprospects.com and Capfriendly.com.
The number of Canadian players in the NHL is more like 42.48% not 44 or 45%
Please see data table. I have counted myself to verify.
TeamsCnd Players American playersTotal Players Cnd Players %US Players %linkTotal32220675842.48%27.18%Anaheim Ducks1282842.86%28.57%https://www.eliteprospects.com/teams[/TD][TD]Arizona Coyotes10112835.71%39.29%https://www.eliteprospects.com/team/72/arizona-coyotes[/TD][TD]Boston Bruins4112218.18%50.00%https://www.eliteprospects.com/teams[/TD][TD]Buffalo Sabres6102326.09%43.48%https://www.eliteprospects.com/teams[/TD][TD]Calgary Flames1162347.83%26.09%https://www.eliteprospects.com/teams[/TD][TD]Carolina Hurricanes1042147.62%19.05%https://www.eliteprospects.com/teams[/TD][TD]Chicago Blackhawks1162445.83%25.00%https://www.eliteprospects.com/teams[/TD][TD]Colorado Avalanche962536.00%24.00%https://www.eliteprospects.com/teams[/TD][TD]Columbus Blue Jackets952339.13%21.74%https://www.eliteprospects.com/teams[/TD][TD]Dallas Stars1142839.29%14.29%Detroit Red Wings962437.50%25.00%Edmonton Oilers1612369.57%4.35%Florida Pathers1742665.38%15.38%LA Kings992437.50%37.50%Minnesota Wild6122524.00%48.00%Montréal Canadiens1632564.00%12.00%Nashville Predators1062638.46%23.08%New Jersey Devils6142722.22%51.85%New York Islanders1542560.00%16.00%New York Rangers592420.83%37.50%Ottawa Senators1252352.17%21.74%Philadelphia Flyers1342552.00%16.00%Pittsburgh Penguins7102429.17%41.67%San Jose Sharks952339.13%21.74%St. Louis Blues1542462.50%16.67%Tampa Bay Lightning1152347.83%21.74%Toronto Maple Leafs1152347.83%21.74%Vancouver Canucks1352650.00%19.23%Vegas Golden Knights1282646.15%30.77%Washington Capitals672326.09%30.43%Winnipeg Jets1192445.83%37.50%
Please also review this NHL entry draft data :
NHL Draft Data19952005200820092010201120122013201420152016201720181 Canada59.40%47.50%58.80%49.50%47.10%39.10%47.40%47.40%38.10%37.90%42.20%37.30%33.60%2 United States6.80%27.40%19.90%25.20%28.10%28.50%25.60%25.10%30.50%25.60%24.60%21.70%24.00%Europe453 Sweden3.40%5.20%8.10%11.40%9.50%13.30%10.40%11.80%13.30%9.50%11.80%12.40%13.80%4 Russia10.70%5.20%4.30%3.30%3.80%4.80%5.70%5.20%6.20%8.10%8.10%10.60%9.20%5 Finland5.60%3.90%3.30%4.80%3.30%4.80%4.30%3.80%4.30%6.20%7.10%8.30%7.40%6 Czech Republic9.00%5.20%1.40%1.40%2.40%4.30%2.80%1.90%3.80%5.20%1.90%4.10%5.10%
From the NHL draft data table, we can expect the Canadian players in the NHL will trend downwards further as the NHL Canadian draft % is trending below 40%. Please see draft data table that i have compile above. I am hoping that it can be useful information especially for CHL and Hockey Canada Management staff and Canadian Hockey Fans.
We are seeing that the NHL is drafting more Swedes, Finns, and Russians and other Europeans.
American NHL is also increasing compared to 1990s and 2000s. Most importantly, USA is turning out better quality players recently.
problem with that is, the majority of americans still don't like ice hockey...
You make that sound like that's a low bar - here are comparable percentages for Canadians:
NHL hockey fans in Canada by age group 2014 | Survey
What is this about?
This is clearly not just a result of lower interest in hockey from young Canadians, the increase of players from much smaller nations like Sweden means that Hockey Canada needs to pull their heads out of their ***** and actually do something to increase the percentage of Canadian content in the NHL. Until they rid themselves of this delusional "This is fine..." mentality, it's not looking good for us.
From the NHL draft data table, there is another bigger issue besides the gradual drop in Canadian-born NHL draftees. That bigger issue is the decline of Canadian players being drafted early in the first round.
NHL scouts are realizing the necessity of speed and puck possession game in winning. In particular, more NHL teams are utilizing NCAA, Fin, and Swede players on 3rd and 4th lines; there is also a slight increase in Line 1 and 2 wingers as well.
I strongly believe that the HC and CHL need to make a slight change to their league rules regarding junior player transfer program and development models to ahead of the game. It is in their hands, God speeds!
and we can't play in the Olympics, I guess it wouldn't be fair to other countries, makes sense
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