I totally forgot about Rutherford being the GM who drafted Johnson in Carolina. But I can imagine dealing with 31 year old Jack Johnson will be different than dealing with 18 year old Jack Johnson.
Rumor: Penguins interested in Jack Johnson
- Thread starter Empoleon8771
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I totally forgot about Rutherford being the GM who drafted Johnson in Carolina. But I can imagine dealing with 31 year old Jack Johnson will be different than dealing with 18 year old Jack Johnson.
The reality is they won't be competing for a cup once 87 & 71 are gone. They should and I assume will tank for their next generational player.
Empoleon8771
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Yeah, this is pretty much it. I don't think they'll be terrible like the XGen Penguins were, but that's just because the Penguins have a strong and younger support cast for the Crosby/Malkin core. They'll top out as mediocre, though, unless they get really lucky with some draft picks.
haveandare
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Odds of it working out like this twice in a row are not great, especially with the new lottery system. If I were them I'd see what dynamic young talents they could get for Kessel, Hornqvist and Letang. They're all solid players, especially Kessel, but I bet teams would overpay now since they're still not too old and have two recent cups. Wait a few more years and they might lose a lot of the value they have. IMO Hornqvist and Letang can be replaced with kids without too huge a drop off if they target the right players. The fact is, if Crosby, Malkin and Murray are hot in the playoffs, they can win without those guys.
PensandCaps
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haveandare
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Cups are infinitely better. But they have 2 very recent ones, 3 with Crosby and Malkin, and the overwhelming majority of the team is getting toward the age when things start to get dicey. Crosby and Malkin will almost certainly last longer than most players because they have insane skill in so many different facets of the game, but the others I'm not so sure about.
hamzarocks
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Trade Sheary for a 2nd
Trade Hunwick for a 6th
Sign Johnson to either 1 year 4 mill, or 3 year 3 mill
Trade Hunwick for a 6th
Sign Johnson to either 1 year 4 mill, or 3 year 3 mill
ottomaddox
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Hold your horses Pens fans. You might want Jack Johnson, but Le Canadiens de Montréal might have something to say about it.
This is what they call a "bidding war for the ages".
This is what they call a "bidding war for the ages".
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DesertPenguin
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JMFJ was an absolute terror, in a good way for his team, against the Pens in 2014 when the Jackets pushed them way harder than they had any business doing. I earned a lot of respect for him in that series. His abilities haven't trended well since then though. I'd take him on the third pair, if we can send out Hunwick and fit him under the cap without subtracting elsewhere, but those are some pretty big ifs.
JaegerDice
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Penguins fans may know better, since they've seen Johnson on the Blue Jackets a lot, and had Daley for a full 2 years, but it seems to me, at a cursory glance at least, that there's a fair bit of overlap between Johnson's strengths and weaknesses as a player and Daleys?
Could be totally wrong, this is purely based on a cursory eye-test, I haven't dug into any numbers.
Could be totally wrong, this is purely based on a cursory eye-test, I haven't dug into any numbers.
I am uhh extremely not a Jack Johnson fan. I don't think he was ever good. That said, the Habs interest in him and the immediately-succeeding reports of his likely asking price sorta smelled like Montreal was setting salary expectations high so that he'd come in well under that, and the market would be happy. If he goes to Pittsburgh, I think given their cap situation, it's likely that it's because his market value is WELL under the expected price, to a point where the chance to win, and his relationship with Sid makes a difference. Fwiw, one of the Johnsons once reportedly called Phil Kessel a scumbag, but I admittedly don't remember which one. If someone does, and it was Jack and not Erik, maybe that's why they're fine dealing Phil?
All in, I hope he gets a nice deal, and I hope I'm wrong about him as a player. We all know he's had a rough go of things, and got screwed trusting the people we'd all most trust on this planet. It's hard to feel bad for guys with multi-million dollar contracts, but when you deal with the injury risks and forego education, and then have most of the rewards of that stolen from you, it's rough. Whatever I might think of him otherwise, it's hard not to pull for him. Would love to see him get a ring and some coin in Pittsburgh, who can at least deliver the ring if not necessarily the money.
All in, I hope he gets a nice deal, and I hope I'm wrong about him as a player. We all know he's had a rough go of things, and got screwed trusting the people we'd all most trust on this planet. It's hard to feel bad for guys with multi-million dollar contracts, but when you deal with the injury risks and forego education, and then have most of the rewards of that stolen from you, it's rough. Whatever I might think of him otherwise, it's hard not to pull for him. Would love to see him get a ring and some coin in Pittsburgh, who can at least deliver the ring if not necessarily the money.
Empoleon8771
Registered User
I think this is fair to say, although I think Daley is a higher IQ player and Johnson is more physical. But yeah, both can skate really well and can move the puck, and apparently both can play RD too (I didn't know JJ could play RD). Johnson seems like a guy who could really thrive with the Penguins, although I'm not sure how good he actually is in the first place.
Hagelin is seriously underrated, and COULD carry a 3rd or 4th line by himself, but doesn't need to in Pittsburgh, given how loaded they are up front. Even at his salary, it wouldn't be insane for a team to take on his contract, and if any team could afford to part with him, it's the Penguins. Finding takers for Hagelin and Hunwick would more than make the room for Johnson. It's not what I'd do, but it's something that wouldn't be bonkers for Pittsburgh to try.
Empoleon8771
Registered User
Honestly, I don't even know if they'd have to clear out that much salary. They may be able to afford JJ by just trading Sheary for a draft pick or dumping Hunwick without taking anyone back. I don't think Johnson is going to be getting much over $3 million if he's coming to the Penguins, I'm guessing that he'd get something like 1 year at $2.5 million if he comes to the Penguins.
UFA who can't play defense and who was robbed by his parents to a team that needs a cheap and defensive defenseman. Sounds like a great fit.
The cupboard is bare but who do you move to restock it while still get the best out of the current cores last few years?
THall4
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haveandare
Registered User
I'd say Letang is the most obvious if you can get someone to give you a good young player for him. There's been rumblings about Kessel, and I'd suggest maybe Hornqvist also. I think all 3 have the smell of success on them on top of being solid players who aren't obviously declining yet (maybe with the exception of Letang), I'd bet there would be more than a few GMs who would offer up good young players for them.
I'm not saying sell them for some picks or juniors players who may or may not pan out - definitely target young guys who have shown something to suggest they'll more likely than not be quality NHLers or more.
IMO, the Pens win or lose cups based on whether or not Crosby, Malkin and Murray are hot in the playoffs or not. If they're all humming, the team can win whether they have Letang, Kessel and Hornqvist or 3 younger and slightly worse (for now) guys in those spots.
It's really hard to judge. The reports of his salary demands when the talk was Montreal wanting him were insane, but I could definitely see him ending up as a short-term reclamation deal, you're right.
Crosby and Brayden Schenn are even better friends. They go on vacation with their families... maybe thy should trade for him.
