Penguins Biggest Draft Boom and Bust Since 2000

[Honour Over Glory]

I'd call the likes of Angelo Esposito, Keven Veilleux, Ryan Stone, Johnathan Filewich, Tomas Surovy, Luca Caputi bigger busts based off hype then a guy like Beau Bennett, Bennett at least should flashes of what he could become if he didn't have candy glass for bones.

Angelo has a similar issue as Beau, the poor kid just had the worst luck with injuries, I think he had two major knee surgeries before he could ever gain any traction as a prospect going pro.

Angelo is doing just fine btw - He owns about 40 properties in Quebec.

 

[Peat]

Yeah I think this is a good take re: Sprong.

I don't personally think he'll amount to anything but he's still got a chance to make something of himself, yet. But for this team? Yeah... a bust.

But I completely agree that it was the right IDEA that just didn't work out. Just like Bennett by way of Shero.



Hey don't forget Sutter!

How could you forget that guy?!?

Only thing is does a guy count as a bust if you get a good trade out of him? Sure, I think he's busting hard as a player compared to his potential, but in terms of what he did for the org, it's a decent enough return. If Pettersson was one of our 2nd rounders, he'd be one of out top 3 2nd rounders since 2020.

 

[KIRK]

Few comments:

1. Shero did not "always have issues drafting". His drafting from 2009-2013 was really strong, the Penguins got 15 players with more than 82 games played in the NHL from those 5 drafts (will be 16 once Jarry hits it). Shero had issues drafting early in his Penguins career, but he was really strong with drafting by the end of his time.
2. I have problems calling Sprong a "bust" when he's only 23 right now, was a 2nd round pick and has done really well in the AHL. I don't know that he'll become much at the NHL level, but it's way too early to call him a bust and I don't even think he'd qualify as a bust.

I will grant you that Shero's last few drafts, like Craig Patrick's last few drafts (not counting Sid, Geno, Fleury obviously), look a lot better with the benefit of hindsight.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I will grant you that Shero's last few drafts, like Craig Patrick's last few drafts (not counting Sid, Geno, Fleury obviously), look a lot better with the benefit of hindsight.

Man if some of these forwards didn't pan out his record would look like utter shit, IMO. I mean they did... so kudos. But it was at least a little bit left field on a lot of those guys.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Only thing is does a guy count as a bust if you get a good trade out of him? Sure, I think he's busting hard as a player compared to his potential, but in terms of what he did for the org, it's a decent enough return. If Pettersson was one of our 2nd rounders, he'd be one of out top 3 2nd rounders since 2020.

Same goes for Angelo, traded in the Hossa deal. That set things up for the Pens 1st cup in the Sid era after going to the finals with that loser and then shoving it in his face the following year when he bolted for the Wings.

 

[Gurglesons]

Man if some of these forwards didn't pan out his record would look like utter shit, IMO. I mean they did... so kudos. But it was at least a little bit left field on a lot of those guys.

The issue is the Pens were going hard to win from 08-13 so a ton of the picks were moved and it made it much harder for him to do work. Notice how the year he didn’t make any big trades in 2012 we have the best draft of his era in a relatively underwhelming draft?

 

[HandshakeLine]

It’s going to be real interesting to see if last year’s Team Chonky Bois is another smart reading of how the game is going to shift In a few years or if they’re going to end up like some of the lesser CP / Shero drafts.

 

[KIRK]

The issue is the Pens were going hard to win from 08-13 so a ton of the picks were moved and it made it much harder for him to do work. Notice how the year he didn’t make any big trades in 2012 we have the best draft of his era in a relatively underwhelming draft?

I'm not sure what Shero did in 2012 with the 1st round draft capital he had is something to hang his hat on.

That said, his 2nd and 3rd round work, really from 2010-2013, was exemplary (Harrington, if I'm reading it right, was his biggest BUST . . . aside from that, Rust, Murray, TB, Sundqvist, Jarry, Jake).

Thing is, it's not something that would come into full focus until after he was gone (not unlike CP's choices on Letang and Gologoski in his last two drafts).

 

[Gurglesons]

I'm not sure what Shero did in 2012 with the 1st round draft capital he had is something to hang his hat on.

That said, his 2nd and 3rd round work, really from 2010-2013, was exemplary (Harrington, if I'm reading it right, was his biggest BUST . . . aside from that, Rust, Murray, TB, Sundqvist, Jarry, Jake).

Thing is, it's not something that would come into full focus until after he was gone (not unlike CP's choices on Letang and Gologoski in his last two drafts).

Maatta and Murray were essential to back to back wins.

 

[KIRK]

Maatta and Murray were essential to back to back wins.

8 and 22 overall. Pouliot and Maatta. Not something to write home about for Shero. Sorry.

But, Murray certainly proves what I said about Shero's record from 2010 onward in the 2nd and 3rd rounds.

 

[The Greatest 101]

Too harsh on Sprong. He was never really hyped as much as Pouliot or Bennett among Pens fans.

 

[KIRK]

Too harsh on Sprong. He was never really hyped as much as Pouliot or Bennett among Pens fans.

Oh, I think he was every bit as hyped as Beau.

I'll grant the Pouliot hype was on another level due to his first camp and draft position.

 

[Gurglesons]

Too harsh on Sprong. He was never really hyped as much as Pouliot or Bennett among Pens fans.

Nah. Sprong was hugely hyped on here and amongst the fan base.

 

[KIRK]

Nah. Sprong was hugely hyped on here and amongst the fan base.

Which still somehow paled in comparison to the way JR was pimping him.

 

[The Greatest 101]

The difference between Sprong and Bennett is that the fans and the organization turned on Sprong pretty quickly once they realized he was a one-trick pony who didn’t know what defense was and had no problem moving on from him. However, there are still people making excuses for Bennett even now.

 

[Peat]

It’s going to be real interesting to see if last year’s Team Chonky Bois is another smart reading of how the game is going to shift In a few years or if they’re going to end up like some of the lesser CP / Shero drafts.

Not sure the game shifting will affect either Poulin or Legare that much unless it's seismic as they've both got good enough hands and brains to make it as fairly mediocre athletes if it comes to it; I can't see it veering to strength or speed so dramatically that this changes.

8 and 22 overall. Pouliot and Maatta. Not something to write home about for Shero. Sorry.

But, Murray certainly proves what I said about Shero's record from 2010 onward in the 2nd and 3rd rounds.

This should be narrowed down to 8OA and Pouliot. Even with the injuries, Maatta's been a fair to good return for 22OA, and I'm guessing none of the other guys people wanted amounted to anything much.

Of course, Pouliot at 8OA is bad enough all by itself not to need any help.

 

[HandshakeLine]

Yeah, Pouliot was... not a great pick. He might be the biggest bust of our 1st round picks since 2000 relative to where he was taken and who was on the board.

But even the 1st round is always a crapshoot. Kraft, Hillier, Koltsov, Bergkvist, Wells and Dome were all 1st round picks who never amounted to anything, even during a relatively less-competitive era of NHL play.

 

[Peat]

Yeah, Pouliot was... not a great pick. He might be the biggest bust of our 1st round picks since 2000 relative to where he was taken and who was on the board.

But even the 1st round is always a crapshoot. Kraft, Hillier, Koltsov, Bergkvist, Wells and Dome were all 1st round picks who never amounted to anything, even during a relatively less-competitive era of NHL play.

I don't think it makes sense to call the entire 1st round a crapshoot. From 15-20 on, maybe even past 10 most drafts, sure, but within that top 10 is a different story.

 

[HandshakeLine]

I don't think it makes sense to call the entire 1st round a crapshoot. From 15-20 on, maybe even past 10 most drafts, sure, but within that top 10 is a different story.

I think if you treat any player that has a successful career more than a few seasons long in the NHL a success, then the top 10 are fine. The difference is when we expect those NHL players to be elite players (not even generational)-- some of them are, many of them do not turn out to be. JJ is a 3OA, for example. But even then, I wouldn't call JJ a bust. He's just... disappointing.

 

[Don'tcry4mejanhrdina]

Esposito's weird because injuries totally derailed him. Like Willy said, I think the reasoning behind the pick was sound, and trading him while he still had value was a really great move.

Busts are so hard to quantify though.

Esposito is the perfect example of "peaked in high school". He probably drives a trans am.

 

[HandshakeLine]

Esposito is the perfect example of "peaked in high school". He probably drives a trans am.

But does he post on the main board?

 

[The Old Master]

Is Beau really a bust?

well, he is busted.

 

[AlphaMikeFoxtrots]

I think if you treat any player that has a successful career more than a few seasons long in the NHL a success, then the top 10 are fine. The difference is when we expect those NHL players to be elite players (not even generational)-- some of them are, many of them do not turn out to be. JJ is a 3OA, for example. But even then, I wouldn't call JJ a bust. He's just... disappointing.

when I first started watching in the 13-14 season, columbus was a team I hated watching the pens play specifically bc a) i knew the crosby/jj history, thanks pierre, we've GOT IT, and b) he ALWAYS seemed to put up points on us

i still never thought much of him as a player, he was just annoying af

now he's a pen who's pretty annoying still and...doesn't really put up points on anyone hopefully the extended break has alleviated his top pair brain fry

 

[mrzeigler]

Angelo has a similar issue as Beau, the poor kid just had the worst luck with injuries, I think he had two major knee surgeries before he could ever gain any traction as a prospect going pro.

Angelo is doing just fine btw - He owns about 40 properties in Quebec.

I disagree a little with the popular opinion that Beau's failure was mostly due to bad luck with injuries. If you'll let me slip into the role of armchair sports psychologist, I think some of it can be chalked up to his mindset. I recall an instance where, after scoring early in a game, he was the intermission interview, and he described the goal as, essentially, the product of being lucky — not the byproduct of hard work, skill or playing smart. Being lucky. But here's the thing — that goal wasn't due to a lucky bounce or fluky play. Beau made a really nice play to score there but he didn't own that moment. Maybe he's just modest, but from that point on, I paid attention to his quotes and his style of play ... and both seemed to fit a player who didn't necessarily believe he could take control the game and instead thought that good outcomes sometimes were based on luck, or his teammates' skill or maybe the system but not his individual talent/effort.

That said, I'm still a little pissed off that he didn't get his name on the Cup after playing pretty well in the playoffs ... but the Pens instead opted to put Dupuis' name on it even though he'd retired midyear due to bloodclots.

 

[ziggyjoe212]

I didn't read the article but the biggest bust, by far, has to be Kris Beech. Considering he was the main piece in the Jagr trade....yikes. I don't think any Pens prospect comes close to him. Even Pouliot.