PC Building Guide and Discussion #13

[aleshemsky83]

It's possible you could get stable at higher freqs if you loosen timings or increase dram/mem controller voltage. But it depends how much you wanna screw around with it. Usually not worth the effort for RAM

I agree, not worth the effort especially on a 75 HZ display (60 when I switch to the tv). Rather focus on stability.

 

[ForsbergMoDo21]

Hello experts,

I could use some help in finding a new computer, as I’m not super knowledgeable. This is what I am replacing, bought in 2010:
ASUS Laptop N61 Series N61JQ-X1 Intel Core i7 1st Gen 720QM (1.60 GHz) 4 GB Memory 320 GB HDD ATI Mobility Radeon HD 5730 16.0" Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit - Newegg.com.

I’d love to stick with ASUS just because I’ve beaten the hell out of this thing and it’s still going, albeit very slow. so I’m impressed with that brand. I would prefer a desktop to a laptop, as this computer literally never moves (I have a separate travel laptop). My assumption is you get better specs for your money with desktops than laptops.

I primarily use this as a multitasking entertainment/school piece. The ability to have music/video running out to one monitor, and another monitor with two browsers/50 tabs open plus OpenOffice is the kind of regular use it’ll get. As far as high end, I’d like something that can play full 1080 video (or higher res) and the only modern game I’d need to run is Civ 6, which I just got on Steam for 70% off

Does anyone have any recommendations on what I could get or perhaps an up to date guide that matches specs to use?

Thanks

 

[aleshemsky83]

Well, if you want a build with a relatively no compromises experience, look for a build with a i5 8400, even though it's a 6 core, 6 thread cpu with "only" a 2.8 GHz base clock, it compares really favorably to modern ryzen cpus in gaming and is more than enough in normal use cases. Civ 6 should run on any modern GPU so it shouldn't be hard to find a good priced Asus prebuilt.

 

[Timmer44]

My favorite SSD tip, don't put your browser and cache on the HDD to save SSD space. You want that on the SSD.



Sometimes I'll just take the files and move them to the HDD if I might want them later instead of actually uninstalling.

Do people actually do that? That seems less like a tip and more like common sense. I know, I know... never underestimate (or is it overestimate?) users.

I had a 500GB SSD and a 2TB secondary storage drive. I Moved my Photos and more importantly, "Downloads" folder to this drive. Whenever I was downloading large files, my pC would slow to a crawl and I couldn't figure out why. I moved the folders back to the SSD and its back being quick.

I had a 5600RPM drive as my backup .

Does anyone have a suggestion for a 4TB backup drive.

 

[SniperHF]

I had a 500GB SSD and a 2TB secondary storage drive. I Moved my Photos and more importantly, "Downloads" folder to this drive. Whenever I was downloading large files, my pC would slow to a crawl and I couldn't figure out why. I moved the folders back to the SSD and its back being quick.

I had a 5600RPM drive as my backup .

Does anyone have a suggestion for a 4TB backup drive.

TBH it really shouldn't slow to a crawl just because you have downloads and photos on a traditional HDD (my downloads folder is on a HDD, causes no issues) It would certainly make accessing and moving those files a little slower, but it shouldn't affect the system at large. Maybe you moved something else in addition to photos and downloads without knowing it?

What are the specs of the system?


Also any time I have performance issues, I check task manager to see utilization on things.

 

[JMCx4]

... Also any time I have performance issues, I check task manager to see utilization on things.

+1. Smart first step in troubleshooting response time issues.

 

[Osprey]

I had a 500GB SSD and a 2TB secondary storage drive. I Moved my Photos and more importantly, "Downloads" folder to this drive. Whenever I was downloading large files, my pC would slow to a crawl and I couldn't figure out why. I moved the folders back to the SSD and its back being quick.

You probably had a problem with your system or your HDD because that shouldn't happen. Downloads and other big files are the best things to use HDDs for because they're rarely accessed and, when they are, it's usually sequentially (not randomly).

 

[Timmer44]

I should clarify, I originally thought my PC was sluggish (mouse freezing, lagging etc) when there was a lot of network traffic. I can regularily hit 7MB/s when downloading Torrents and Other files. Then I realized it was fine when streaming and when I was updating games/apps because the System is installed on the SSD. The downloads folder was linded to my D: drive, which was an old slow HD.

I don't know how windows handles downloading to secondary HDs, but my GUI lags pretty bad when reading/writing to the drive.

 

[SniperHF]

I can regularily hit 7MB/s when downloading Torrents and Other files.

If you're downloading multiple files at once I could see it causing slowdowns though I still wouldn't think it would be crippling. When you're doing that you are hitting every component harder.
But a single large file at 7MB/s is still below the speeds of even an extremely slow 5600 RPM drive.

But without seeing the utilizations and knowing the specs I'm just kinda spitballing.

 

[Timmer44]

If you're downloading multiple files at once I could see it causing slowdowns though I still wouldn't think it would be crippling. When you're doing that you are hitting every component harder.
But a single large file at 7MB/s is still below the speeds of even an extremely slow 5600 RPM drive.

But without seeing the utilizations and knowing the specs I'm just kinda spitballing.

I'm at work but when I'm home I'll get the specs. Appreciate the help

 

[Timmer44]

Ok, I think I solved it. I did a few more tests and found that I would expereince the lagging everytime I had high intetenet traffic. I think my WiFi was interfering with my wireless mouse and keyboard, making me think my PC was slowing down. I wired ethernet and extended the Mouse/KB transceiver closer and it seems to have solved my issues.

No new HD needed! Thanks.

 

[Osprey]

If you're downloading multiple files at once I could see it causing slowdowns though I still wouldn't think it would be crippling. When you're doing that you are hitting every component harder.

I've experienced that when downloading 6 or more files at once in Chrome. The system will slow to a crawl until one of the downloads finishes, and then it'll go right back to being responsive, even though 5 downloads are still going. It's really weird and I think that it happens only with Chrome, so it's probably something to do with that. I can have 200 tabs open, but go above 5 simultaneous downloads and Chrome says "nope"; hah.

BTW, I'll just add this here, since I literally just experienced it. My system was very sluggish just now and it turns out that it was the SysMain service with 25% disk utilization (as reported in Task Manager). I must've missed the memo before, but that's our old friend, the Superfetch service. Microsoft apparently renamed it in Windows 10 build 1809 and re-enabled it for anyone (like me) who had previously disabled it. Stopping and disabling it again fixed the system slowdown.

 

[SniperHF]

I must've missed the memo before, but that's our old friend, the Superfetch service

yes they did, fun guys at Microsoft eh?

I installed some fresh copies of 1903 last weekend and went looking for Superfetch only to find the same thing you did

 

[Knave]

Is a PCIE wifi card worth a go? I have used wireless USB adapters since I can't plug in to the modem but as time has gone on (with Windows 8, Windows 10) wireless adapters have a tendency to lose the signal for me and I'm unsure why. I follow their (years out of date at this point) instructions, download that RealTEK software thing, I've tried troubleshooting months ago and that didn't fix anything. It's gotten worse over the last couple of weeks so I'm considering PCIE wifi adapters because I'm thinking since it's hardware and it plugs into the motherboard maybe it will be more reliable?

 

[SniperHF]

I like pcie wifi cards generally.. even better if they have an antenna you can position.

 

[aleshemsky83]

Is a PCIE wifi card worth a go? I have used wireless USB adapters since I can't plug in to the modem but as time has gone on (with Windows 8, Windows 10) wireless adapters have a tendency to lose the signal for me and I'm unsure why. I follow their (years out of date at this point) instructions, download that RealTEK software thing, I've tried troubleshooting months ago and that didn't fix anything. It's gotten worse over the last couple of weeks so I'm considering PCIE wifi adapters because I'm thinking since it's hardware and it plugs into the motherboard maybe it will be more reliable?

I have one (PCIE wifi card). Its actually pretty much the same for me other than having more antennas.

Have had some issues with certain online games kicking me that I suspect had to do with the USB adapter in the past.

As for random disconnects or non-disconnects but the internet freezing up, Ive had that issue with both PCIE cards and USB adapters, so I can't really comment on that.

 

[aleshemsky83]

I've got this old Dell with an i7 4510u (don't let the name fool you, its a surprisingly slow dual core cpu) that I had to turn into a HTCP because for some bizarre reason the right hinge rusted almost locking it in place, which my dad just fought through until he snapped it. Just outside the manufacturer warranty. I'd say I'm mostly done with DELL. Too much plastic on their chassis.

Regardless the point of this is that as a HTPC, it was even slower than it was as a laptop. It felt way too slow, couldn't have aged that bad right? Well, I realized that I had connected it to a 4k display when it was originally powering a 1080p monitor. I set the resolution down and all the stutters and laginess vanished with no real downturn in quality (in fact windows scales far better), finally I decided to turn it to 1366x768, and it might be a placebo but it feels super snappy now, with zero scaling required its all at 100% scaling and windows and even office looks great. I recommend the same to anyone not using a super overpowered HTCP if they're not consuming 4k content or gaming seriously.

 

[Hammettf2b]

I'm having some weird keyboard issues. It keeps disconnecting and reconnecting really fast. I tried updating the drivers, uncheck "Allow the computer to turn off this device to save power", and switching usb ports. Is it common to have my keyboard listed as HID Keyboard? It shows my actual keyboard ( K70) in the unspecified area.

 

[SniperHF]

. Is it common to have my keyboard listed as HID Keyboard? I

I have no idea if it's common, but my mechanical KB and mouse show up that way.

I actually had a keyboard that did what you described before, it was a short in the USB cord.

 

[Hammettf2b]

I have no idea if it's common, but my mechanical KB and mouse show up that way.

I actually had a keyboard that did what you described before, it was a short in the USB cord.

I take it that can't be fixed?

Edit: I just got a notification that my keyboard was detected. It shows up as the K70.

 

[SniperHF]

I take it that can't be fixed?

Mine could because it has a replaceable cable (Cooler Master Trigger, USB Mini to USB A cable) Most KBs don't have that.

I'd have to see what the cable looked like to see if fixing it was possible.
Looking at this teardown video (@: 4:12)


I'd be inclined toward no. It looks like the end y's out into a ribon cable as opposed to whatever a normal USB cable is. Unless they happen to sell replacements or you wanna get soldery and figure out the pinout

Plus it's also possible it's the terminal, something electronic, or your USB port. Prolly the cable though, more likely.
I'd definitely try another USB port, and possibly a cheap USB keyboard for a while to see if it happens with that one.

 

[Hammettf2b]

Mine could because it has a replaceable cable (Cooler Master Trigger, USB Mini to USB A cable) Most KBs don't have that.

I'd have to see what the cable looked like to see if fixing it was possible.
Looking at this teardown video (@: 4:12)


I'd be inclined toward no. It looks like the end y's out into a ribon cable as opposed to whatever a normal USB cable is. Unless they happen to sell replacements or you wanna get soldery and figure out the pinout

Plus it's also possible it's the terminal, something electronic, or your USB port. Prolly the cable though, more likely.
I'd definitely try another USB port, and possibly a cheap USB keyboard for a while to see if it happens with that one.

I'll try my older keyboard to see if it works. It seems to work fine for a while but goes haywire every once in a while.

 

[Hammettf2b]

yup, I started using my old keyboard and haven't had any problems. Looks like im in the market for a new keyboard. Thank you @SniperHF for the help.

 

[Caeldan]

There's 4k and then there's 4k. Do you wanna run 4k at 60-75fps or a 144hz beast and it must be full blast settings wise? If you want 144hz then throw money at it like you planned.
Even with a 2080 ti you won't hit your full 144fps target in Destiny 2 at 4k. On the highest settings anyway. And if you won't hit it in destiny I'd be surprised if you did in Cyberpunk.

You basically can't keep up at that framerate/resolution no matter what you do. (this is kind of another reason why I probably wouldn't bother with 4k 144hz but I'm a pragmatist that way). IMO 2k is plenty good enough and you'll be a lot happier long term in terms of upgrade needs. But even then you'd probably still want a 2080 non-ti minimum it would just be a lot cheaper in terms of the monitor costs.

Alright, so with the November sales starting to trickle in... revisiting my PC build and decided that a 2k(QHD I guess?) 144hz build is the way to go for now.

With that said I'm currently looking at the following:
https://ca.pcpartpicker.com/user/caeldan/saved/Qs8Nqs
I'm still sitting on the motherboard because of wifi6, though I guess eventually when I have enough devices in that ecosystem I could probably just get a dongle... and in all honestly I'm likely going to be running ethernet to this PC build.

What I can't decide on is a case though. Currently I'm looking at:
Thermaltake Level 20 MT ARGB CA-1M7-00M1WN-00 Black Computer Case - Newegg.ca
Antec NX Series NX400, Mid-Tower ATX Gaming Case, Tempered Glass Side Panel & LED Strip Front Panel, 360 mm Radiator Support, 1 x 120 mm ARGB Fan Included - Newegg.ca
CORSAIR Carbide Series SPEC-OMEGA Mid-Tower Tempered Glass Gaming Case, Black and Red CC-9011120-WW - Newegg.ca

Mostly because price and free shipping at the moment. Finding cases that don't toss on 50 bucks worth of duty online for shipping to Canada can be tough.
But the Antex NX400 seems to actually be good price and has everything I need (since honestly all this ARGB crap is a bit overboard to me).

For NVME drives, do I need to buy an enclosure too? or do they just plug into something like a RAM chip?

 

[Osprey]

For NVME drives, do I need to buy an enclosure too? or do they just plug into something like a RAM chip?

NVMe drives plug directly into the motherboard, like a stick of RAM. The motherboard has to have such a slot (usually between a couple of the PCIe slots and perpendicular to them), but most should these days. If the motherboard doesn't have a slot, then you'll need to buy a PCIe card to plug the drive into, but I probably wouldn't bother in that case (because it's $30 more to spend and who knows if you'll get the same speeds) and would just buy a SATA drive, instead. There are enclosures for NVMe drives, but they eliminate all of their advantages and should really only be utilized down the line, when you're on your 2nd or 3rd NVMe drive and have one that you can't (or don't want to) install in your case.

BTW, your part list is private, so we (or, at least, I) can't see it.