Player Discussion: Patrik Laine - Part 20'ish or so

[YWGinYYZ]

Last thread (here) was at the post limit. Continue here.

Please: no flaming, trolling, etc. Respect your fellow posters - if you can't, then we'll remove you from the conversation, and it may also result in a warning.

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[Whileee]

...from the last thread, responding to a question about wingers' scoring and GF% with Scheifele and Wheeler...

5v5

Scheifele and Wheeler - with Ehlers: 20 goals for, 9 goals against (69% GF)
Scheifele and Wheeler - without Ehlers: 28 goals for, 34 goals against (45% GF)

Scheifele / Wheeler / Connor - 20 goals for, 25 goals against (44% GF)
Scheifele / Wheeler / Laine - 8 goals for, 9 goals against (47% GF)

The story is pretty clear - Scheifele and Wheeler have been great with Ehlers, and not very good with any other LW.

Losing Ehlers for a long stretch really dragged the Jets down, as has Buff's absence. Ehlers is so important for the Jets in terms of tilting the ice and closing out space for the opposition.

 

[Jet]

...from the last thread, responding to a question about wingers' scoring and GF% with Scheifele and Wheeler...

5v5

Scheifele and Wheeler - with Ehlers: 20 goals for, 9 goals against (69% GF)
Scheifele and Wheeler - without Ehlers: 28 goals for, 34 goals against (45% GF)

Scheifele / Wheeler / Connor - 20 goals for, 25 goals against (44% GF)
Scheifele / Wheeler / Laine - 8 goals for, 9 goals against (47% GF)

The story is pretty clear - Scheifele and Wheeler have been great with Ehlers, and not very good with any other LW.

Losing Ehlers for a long stretch really dragged the Jets down, as has Buff's absence. Ehlers is so important for the Jets in terms of tilting the ice and closing out space for the opposition.

Knowing this - it seems obvious to put Ehlers with 55/26 and bump Laine down with Hayes. I do worry about who is going to carry the puck into the zone on that line - though Connor has done that reasonably well before and it looks as if Laine is starting to bring back that element to his game a bit.

 

[Whileee]

Knowing this - it seems obvious to put Ehlers with 55/26 and bump Laine down with Hayes. I do worry about who is going to carry the puck into the zone on that line - though Connor has done that reasonably well before and it looks as if Laine is starting to bring back that element to his game a bit.

Ehlers makes every line better. I think that for now I would leave him with Hayes and Connor. The Laine-Scheifele-Wheeler line has a lot of potential. I think it slumped a bit with Scheifele at less than his top form, but leaving Ehlers with Hayes gives the Jets more balance and threat throughout the line-up.

 

[Jet]

Ehlers makes every line better. I think that for now I would leave him with Hayes and Connor. The Laine-Scheifele-Wheeler line has a lot of potential. I think it slumped a bit with Scheifele at less than his top form, but leaving Ehlers with Hayes gives the Jets more balance and threat throughout the line-up.

The thing that worries me is you can't have your top line getting outscored.

 

[Howard Chuck]

...from the last thread, responding to a question about wingers' scoring and GF% with Scheifele and Wheeler...

5v5

Scheifele and Wheeler - with Ehlers: 20 goals for, 9 goals against (69% GF)
Scheifele and Wheeler - without Ehlers: 28 goals for, 34 goals against (45% GF)

Scheifele / Wheeler / Connor - 20 goals for, 25 goals against (44% GF)
Scheifele / Wheeler / Laine - 8 goals for, 9 goals against (47% GF)

The story is pretty clear - Scheifele and Wheeler have been great with Ehlers, and not very good with any other LW.

Losing Ehlers for a long stretch really dragged the Jets down, as has Buff's absence. Ehlers is so important for the Jets in terms of tilting the ice and closing out space for the opposition.

I know it's a Laine thread, but I think it's looking like Ehlers is helping every line he's on.

 

[Tommigun]

I know it's a Laine thread, but I think it's looking like Ehlers is helping every line he's on.

So Ehler's not going to be traded anymore?

 

[Jack722]

I wonder if Tanev - Lowry - Copp could be reunited to take big matchups and leave LSW with softies.

 

[Kaako Kappo]

Ehlers makes every line better. I think that for now I would leave him with Hayes and Connor. The Laine-Scheifele-Wheeler line has a lot of potential. I think it slumped a bit with Scheifele at less than his top form, but leaving Ehlers with Hayes gives the Jets more balance and threat throughout the line-up.

Every line except Laine-Little-Ehlers. Man it was mind boggling to watch that line play. They could not get the puck to Ehlers to save their lives, and that's really all they needed to do. Nikolaj is at his absolute best when transitioning to offensive zone with the puck.

 

[LowLefty]

...from the last thread, responding to a question about wingers' scoring and GF% with Scheifele and Wheeler...

5v5

Scheifele and Wheeler - with Ehlers: 20 goals for, 9 goals against (69% GF)
Scheifele and Wheeler - without Ehlers: 28 goals for, 34 goals against (45% GF)

Scheifele / Wheeler / Connor - 20 goals for, 25 goals against (44% GF)
Scheifele / Wheeler / Laine - 8 goals for, 9 goals against (47% GF)

The story is pretty clear - Scheifele and Wheeler have been great with Ehlers, and not very good with any other LW.

Losing Ehlers for a long stretch really dragged the Jets down, as has Buff's absence. Ehlers is so important for the Jets in terms of tilting the ice and closing out space for the opposition.

Do you have the numbers for the top line LY?

Edit - meant last season (not LY)

 

[LowLefty]

Every line except Laine-Little-Ehlers. Man it was mind boggling to watch that line play. They could not get the puck to Ehlers to save their lives, and that's really all they needed to do. Nikolaj is at his absolute best when transitioning to offensive zone with the puck.

Ehlers game has changed a lot recently - he's not simply carrying the puck until he loses it (like he used to) -
He's become a better playmaker and passer which is what he wasn't when playing with Little / Laine.

 

[nobody imp0rtant]

Any way to know how many posts there have been in all the dedicated Laine threads (here and other boards) since we won the lottery and it was clear he would be coming here? And that wouldn't even include all the posts about Laine in countless other threads. I know we'll never reach Coyote megathread status, but I gotta think Laine talk has to be in the top 10 topics of all time.

 

[Howard Chuck]

So Ehler's not going to be traded anymore?

Lol, I sure hope not!

 

[Tommigun]

Lol, I sure hope not!

Good A lot of people wanted to trade him a few months back when he was in a slump.

 

[Howard Chuck]

Good A lot of people wanted to trade him a few months back when he was in a slump.

We want to trade anyone in a slump..... buy high sell low!

 

[Whileee]

Do you have the numbers for the top line LY?

Edit - meant last season (not LY)

They had a much better balance in terms of goals last year (and other metrics).

2017/18 - 5v5...

Scheifele / Wheeler / Ehlers: CF% 53.4, 7 GF, 6 GA, GF% 54
Scheifele / Wheeler without Ehlers: CF% 50.5, 37 GF, 25 GA, GF% 60

They simply haven't been as effective this season except with Ehlers. My "eye test" is that they have been spending way too many shifts hemmed in their own zone, unable to regain possession or get a clean zone exit, except when Ehlers is on LW. I'm not sure if it's because of their competition (I doubt that explains most of it), or just a general decline in defensive effectiveness (my hypothesis).

Regarding Ehlers and Laine, they have been effective together but not with Little at C. Both Stastny and Copp have had some positive results with them.

 

[mzappa]

Any way to know how many posts there have been in all the dedicated Laine threads (here and other boards) since we won the lottery and it was clear he would be coming here? And that wouldn't even include all the posts about Laine in countless other threads. I know we'll never reach Coyote megathread status, but I gotta think Laine talk has to be in the top 10 topics of all time.

Oh wow - the Coyotes megathreads. Little Logan, The crazy cowboy hat guy, Hulzier and Goldwater, the Cupcake incident. Missing anything?!

How to find those threads? they were classic.

 

[Tommigun]

They had a much better balance in terms of goals last year (and other metrics).

2017/18 - 5v5...

Scheifele / Wheeler / Ehlers: CF% 53.4, 7 GF, 6 GA, GF% 54
Scheifele / Wheeler without Ehlers: CF% 50.5, 37 GF, 25 GA, GF% 60

They simply haven't been as effective this season except with Ehlers. My "eye test" is that they have been spending way too many shifts hemmed in their own zone, unable to regain possession or get a clean zone exit, except when Ehlers is on LW. I'm not sure if it's because of their competition (I doubt that explains most of it), or just a general decline in defensive effectiveness (my hypothesis)

But isn't that because CLT used to take the heavy matchups last year, while Maurice has been matching Scheifele's line against the other top line this year?

Follow-up question: why did he change this? I thought it was brilliant to have CLT as a shutdown line. It's not like they bring much offensively.

 

[LowLefty]

They had a much better balance in terms of goals last year (and other metrics).

2017/18 - 5v5...

Scheifele / Wheeler / Ehlers: CF% 53.4, 7 GF, 6 GA, GF% 54
Scheifele / Wheeler without Ehlers: CF% 50.5, 37 GF, 25 GA, GF% 60

They simply haven't been as effective this season except with Ehlers. My "eye test" is that they have been spending way too many shifts hemmed in their own zone, unable to regain possession or get a clean zone exit, except when Ehlers is on LW. I'm not sure if it's because of their competition (I doubt that explains most of it), or just a general decline in defensive effectiveness (my hypothesis).

Regarding Ehlers and Laine, they have been effective together but not with Little at C. Both Stastny and Copp have had some positive results with them.

Thanks Whileee -
I'm not surprised by what they accomplished in the previous season - they worked very well together then.
I agree - the line (with KC) lost the will to play D - especially in their own end and Ehlers helped with this work and exits.

 

[Whileee]

But isn't that because CLT used to take the heavy matchups last year, while Maurice has been matching Scheifele's line against the other top line this year?

Follow-up question: why did he change this? I thought it was brilliant to have CLT as a shutdown line.

It's my impression that Scheifele's line is getting more match-ups against top lines, but I haven't done the analysis. Not sure why Maurice might want Scheifele facing top competition - maybe he's trying to give them that challenge in preparation for the playoffs, when they are going to be facing more top competition more often.

 

[jepjepjoo]

Thanks Whileee -
I'm not surprised by what they accomplished in the previous season - they worked very well together then.
I agree - the line (with KC) lost the will to play D - especially in their own end and Ehlers helped with this work and exits.

Last season:

CSW GF%55.77
SW without Connor GF%65.22

This season:

CSW GF%44.44
SW without Connor GF%60.87

 

[Robinson2187]

Lol, I sure hope not!

Never say never in HF land

 

[LowLefty]

Last season:

CSW GF%55.77
SW without Connor GF%65.22

This season:

CSW GF%44.44
SW without Connor GF%60.87

Interesting - thanks
Do you have the breakdown last season, ie; how much time did the line play with and w/o KC

 

[Howard Chuck]

They had a much better balance in terms of goals last year (and other metrics).

2017/18 - 5v5...

Scheifele / Wheeler / Ehlers: CF% 53.4, 7 GF, 6 GA, GF% 54
Scheifele / Wheeler without Ehlers: CF% 50.5, 37 GF, 25 GA, GF% 60

They simply haven't been as effective this season except with Ehlers. My "eye test" is that they have been spending way too many shifts hemmed in their own zone, unable to regain possession or get a clean zone exit, except when Ehlers is on LW. I'm not sure if it's because of their competition (I doubt that explains most of it), or just a general decline in defensive effectiveness (my hypothesis).

Regarding Ehlers and Laine, they have been effective together but not with Little at C. Both Stastny and Copp have had some positive results with them.

Just as an experiment, I would love to see Laine Hayes Ehlers. I'll bet it would be our first line.

 

[Robinson2187]

Just as an experiment, I would love to see Laine Hayes Ehlers. I'll bet it would be our first line.

It's thought provoking for sure.