Post-Game Talk: Patrick Russell needs to recalibrate his controller

[tiger_80]

Well, if Nurse becomes a top pairing d-man worth 8M, it's a good problem to have. This team has not had one since Souray. It just means, they will have to trade Larsson/let Russell go and look for cheaper young players and smart free agents signings for depth.

 

[Louis Cypher]

Koskinen bailed us out again.

I thought he was the worst goalie in the after everything the whiners were saying before this season.

 

[Louis Cypher]

The Wings hit a couple posts as well, and one of the Oilers stated "posts" on a shot by Draisaitl wasn't a post at all, it was outside of cage.

With our top calibre players it should be a blowout most times we face a deplorable lineup like this. The Wings are in no way a lineup that is composed to compete. Like I said its a circa 1993 Oilers lineup with Jason Arnott and little else. Toronto, Calgary, Vancouver all had little trouble stuffing this tawdry Wings club in the trash. Its the difficulty level of facing some AHL squads except older..

meh my issue is more with the NHL perennially having half a dozen sad sack teams as bad as Detroit Red Wings (which a lot of the time was the Oilers, yeah, I know) But to have half a dozen orgs having guaranteed lose lineups any given season really waters down the NHL product. Last night was easily the least compelling match of the season and its to hard to imagine an Original 6 team being as poor a draw anywhere as the Detroit Red Wings. For a product that charges as much in ticket prices as this one does they have to weed out the teams that are just crap and start getting them to be more competitive somehow. For consistency I stated the same for years regarding us, that the league should intervene in the case of teams that are not even trying, or able, to field a competitive lineup.

If only 6 clubs in the league purposely suck, or the orgs just suck, any given season it brings down the competitive level of a whole bunch of hockey games.

It's the same in any team sports.

 

[Shaquille Oatmeal]

 

[Oil Dood]

I thought he was the worst goalie in the after everything the whiners were saying before this season.

Totally willing to eat crow on him if he keeps this up, I am one of those who did not think he had a hope in hell of doing anything, so glad he is proving me and many others wrong.

 

[Shaquille Oatmeal]

I have a feeling that Smith is a better goalie coach than Schwartz.

 

[Sweetpotato]

I'd say they should regret it. Cause they should have signed him 3/4 years ago at 4M long term like I and other posters on here were suggesting. But nope, they wanted to wait for the obvious to happen, that is for Nurse to "prove" he could be a top 4 D-man in this league.

They didn’t have to cap and he wouldn’t have signed long term at 4 million...(I don’t think lol)

Nurse wanted the bridge deal. It wasnt Edmonton that pushed it he didn't want long term. This was talked about when he signed. Not everyone can be sweethearts like klef and Larsson

 

[Raab]

Coming off an injury riddled year where he only played 44 games and only potted 11 points, 2 years into his NHL career. Not to mention there was no guarantees he'd put up even 30 points a year let alone 44 points back then. Many posters were speculating in that 3M-4M range with alot of posters saying outright no to the long term contract, not cause there was NO WAY HED SIGN but because they viewed it as risky and wanting to wait to see what happens with his play.

I am 100% certain with how Nurse and how he was playing, how he was perceived at that time would have signed a 48 Million Dollar Contract. And people would have attacked the Oilers for "overpaying" back then, anything viewed as an overpay at the time, you better bet that player would sign it, and if he's on the fence (although i doubt he would have been) you up to 4.5M and get the deal done. Still should have done a deal like that.

Your argument is a double edged sword. No guaranteed Nurse shows the commitment to get better, if he received a big pay day. I'm a big believer in not giving young kids to much cash, and making them earn it. Even if it cost you money on their next contract.

 

[SupremeTeam16]

I find it interesting that most seem to think it's a foregone conclusion that the Oilers will regress into teams of past. While I tend to agree that some of our numbers will regress more towards the median I think this team will find other areas to improve in to offset that regression. Tippet has barely had his hands on this group for a month and systems wise and execution they look miles better then years past, with more time him and Holland will likely finds ways to get more out of the bottom 6. We have young guys pushing, tradeable assets like JP and all of our picks.

 

[Beerfish]

I thought he was the worst goalie in the after everything the whiners were saying before this season.

Whiners? Being critical of a goalie who was terrible the 2nd half of last year is being a whiner? The oilers have made the playoffs once in the last 13 years or so. the 'whiners' are correct about 95% of the things they say. The everything is swell crowd is wrong about 95% of things they say.

Goaltending has been good this year, 8 games into the year. If it keeps up we make the playoffs if it doesn't we don't, jut like the last two years of bad tending.

 

[belair]

Yeah I dont get the Jurco hate. He was the only bottom six player creating anything last night. With honorable mention to PRussel, he had a good game too.

Before the Detroit goal and before the Klefbom giveaway, watch Jurco's shot attempt. Keep in mind he's on a line that is out there to grind. He gains the zone on the right wing and instead of trying to maintain possession he takes a low percentage shot with no traffic bearing down on Bernier. The shot misses and rings around the boards resulting in a loss of possession. He then changes.

It's an example of some of the dumb things tweener players do that eventually result in them being scratched.

 

[Bones2079]

Funny, I don’t see the Flames on this list...

5 points up on the preseason cup champion Laffs.

 

[Bones2079]

The Wings hit a couple posts as well, and one of the Oilers stated "posts" on a shot by Draisaitl wasn't a post at all, it was outside of cage.

With our top calibre players it should be a blowout most times we face a deplorable lineup like this. The Wings are in no way a lineup that is composed to compete. Like I said its a circa 1993 Oilers lineup with Jason Arnott and little else. Toronto, Calgary, Vancouver all had little trouble stuffing this tawdry Wings club in the trash. Its the difficulty level of facing some AHL squads except older..

meh my issue is more with the NHL perennially having half a dozen sad sack teams as bad as Detroit Red Wings (which a lot of the time was the Oilers, yeah, I know) But to have half a dozen orgs having guaranteed lose lineups any given season really waters down the NHL product. Last night was easily the least compelling match of the season and its to hard to imagine an Original 6 team being as poor a draw anywhere as the Detroit Red Wings. For a product that charges as much in ticket prices as this one does they have to weed out the teams that are just crap and start getting them to be more competitive somehow. For consistency I stated the same for years regarding us, that the league should intervene in the case of teams that are not even trying, or able, to field a competitive lineup.

If only 6 clubs in the league purposely suck, or the orgs just suck, any given season it brings down the competitive level of a whole bunch of hockey games.

Now you are comparing how posts got hit. Did all these teams that rolled the Wings win all the rest of their games by huge margins? Just cause you don't blow out a team that everyone else did doesn't mean it wasn't a good win.

We scored 8 against Vegas last year and we stunk. So enjoy the wins, it's been a been a horrible past 30 years watching the Oilers. Maybe we don't have a good season, but at least it's fun now.

 

[Blue Line Turnover]

So far this season, I've been dead wrong about Koskinen and the ramifications of losing Sekera

 

[Dirt McGintty]

Before the Detroit goal and before the Klefbom giveaway, watch Jurco's shot attempt. Keep in mind he's on a line that is out there to grind. He gains the zone on the right wing and instead of trying to maintain possession he takes a low percentage shot with no traffic bearing down on Bernier. The shot misses and rings around the boards resulting in a loss of possession. He then changes.

It's an example of some of the dumb things tweener players do that eventually result in them being scratched.

I'll take one dumb decision from a player who was driving his line all night all day over a guy who dumps it in the corner to be safe every time. Donwe have a goal from a bottom 6 player yet?

 

[belair]

I'll take one dumb decision from a player who was driving his line all night all day over a guy who dumps it in the corner to be safe every time. Donwe have a goal from a bottom 6 player yet?

Keep an eye on him. That play is evidence of a player who doesn't own a ton of situational awareness. He's looked pretty ordinary for a number of games. Considering he's sitting on no goals for the year, it won't be the end of us seeing him taking ill-advised shots.

Just because our bottom six hasn't produced doesn't mean we can give a leash to players who are doing things that are completely counterproductive. At least guys like Sheahan, Khaira and Archibald have shown their willingness to establish themselves on the cycle. Nygard creates offensive opportunities. I'm not seeing a lot from Jurco that's going to keep him here long-term.

Haas has gotten owned physically but at least he's shown really good defensive awareness on the back check and generally finds himself in good position.

 

[Senor Catface]

Whiners? Being critical of a goalie who was terrible the 2nd half of last year is being a whiner? The oilers have made the playoffs once in the last 13 years or so. the 'whiners' are correct about 95% of the things they say. The everything is swell crowd is wrong about 95% of things they say.

Goaltending has been good this year, 8 games into the year. If it keeps up we make the playoffs if it doesn't we don't, jut like the last two years of bad tending.

Yeesh, get over yourself. I am 100 percent that you need to do that.

 

[Soundwave]

Keep an eye on him. That play is evidence of a player who doesn't own a ton of situational awareness. He's looked pretty ordinary for a number of games. Considering he's sitting on no goals for the year, it won't be the end of us seeing him taking ill-advised shots.

Just because our bottom six hasn't produced doesn't mean we can give a leash to players who are doing things that are completely counterproductive. At least guys like Sheahan, Khaira and Archibald have shown their willingness to establish themselves on the cycle. Nygard creates offensive opportunities. I'm not seeing a lot from Jurco that's going to keep him here long-term.

Haas has gotten owned physically but at least he's shown really good defensive awareness on the back check and generally finds himself in good position.

I thought Jurco had the most dangerous chance from the bottom six other than Russell's post honestly.

That one move where he went from behind the net and quickly cut to the front for a point blank shot on Bernier.

 

[nally]

McDavid worst empty net shooter in the league...the posted one in preseason I think right?

I was in buffalo last year when he hit the post on an empty net

 

[Soundwave]

I find it interesting that most seem to think it's a foregone conclusion that the Oilers will regress into teams of past. While I tend to agree that some of our numbers will regress more towards the median I think this team will find other areas to improve in to offset that regression. Tippet has barely had his hands on this group for a month and systems wise and execution they look miles better then years past, with more time him and Holland will likely finds ways to get more out of the bottom 6. We have young guys pushing, tradeable assets like JP and all of our picks.

They're not that far off from the 16-17 team that had 103 points from what I can see right now.

Nurse has grown into a Sekera tier defender, Klef is Klef, Neal basically replaces Eberle or Lucic, Kassian is Maroon. Persson is the new Benning, Bear is impacting the D like Larsson did (though through smart puck movement and offence rather than physical board play).

Koskinen/Smith duo is playing in the range that Talbot did.

McDavid, Draisaitl, and RNH are all better players today though.

It's not like that 16-17 team was *that* great. If you give McDavid/Draisaitl decent goaltending, things shift pretty quick on that basis alone, throw in added offence from Neal and more scoring from the blue line in general and a better PK ... and suddenly you got some water boiling.

 

[TheNumber4]

You think a guy who was limited by injury would say, "oh crap I think this is my peak, I better sign long term!"? That's what you'd do?

People would have attacked the Oilers for overpaying for sure. People like you attacked the Oilers for bridging him. People will attack the Oilers for signing him, or trading him, or playing him, or not playing him. People will, and are literally attacking the Oilers no matter what is happening. Heck there are people in this thread attacking the Oilers for winning!

Sometimes you get a deal, sometimes you don't. They got Drai on a great deal, Klef on a great deal, McDavid took less. Maybe Nurse gives them a hometown discount, maybe not. We'll see what happens, but we should all be pretty ecstatic if Nurse becomes a perennial 40-50pt d-man at $8m through his prime years.

I think players who are unproven, but are offered a "YOUR 100% PROVEN AND CERTIFIED NHLER" type contract worth in the neighborhood of 32 MILLION DOLLARS two years out of junior would jump on that, yes. And it happens all the time, Good Signings, Fair Signings (cause it's not like 4Mx8 is unfair), and Amazing Signings happen ALL the time. Players much more proven, with much more potential than Nurse have signed for less. So don't tell me there's no way he wouldn't have signed that contract, as if you know, when the consensus was from the fanbase was "Yeh, he'd sign that contract"

 

[TheNumber4]

Nurse wanted the bridge deal. It wasnt Edmonton that pushed it he didn't want long term. This was talked about when he signed. Not everyone can be sweethearts like klef and Larsson

Firstly, any public reports that came out about the Nurse signing and Nurse bridge deal happened after the 17-18 season where Nurse played a full season and put up a respectable +15 and 26 points. I am talking about signing him before the whole world, including himself, knew what he was and what he was going to be. When there was still a bit of doubt in the air, when Nurse only played 44 games and could only muster 11 points while being a minus player for the last 2 years and a staple on the 3RD pairing with spots above him FILLED. This is when you strike to get a good deal. Maybe 3.5M he wouldn't have taken, so goto 4M, still not working? Goto 4.5M... and get the deal done! Don't tell me a player 2 years out of junior and playing on the 3rd pair while being injured and not living up to his offensive potential wouldn't jump at 36 million. There was a LONG TERM deal to be had there and IF the Oilers were smart they would have atleast pushed for it (they didn't even try).

Secondly, even with the bridge deal (that apparently Nurse wanted oh so badly) it happened after a lengthy stalemate between the club and player, so it's not like that points out to Nurse wanting 100% bridge. It was noted before and during this signing that due to the Oilers cap commitments a long term deal was out of the cards. So this bridge deal sounds like a compromise. It's not like the Oilers offered a bridge deal and Nurse held out to get.... a bridge deal. Also, when Nurse GOT his bridge deal and when he started with thoughts of wanting more, alot of that was pushed by Sekera's injury. SO, again, if we had signed him a year earlier we could have avoided Nurse and his agent having Sekera's injury as a piece of negotiating power.

 

[TheNumber4]

Your argument is a double edged sword. No guaranteed Nurse shows the commitment to get better, if he received a big pay day. I'm a big believer in not giving young kids to much cash, and making them earn it. Even if it cost you money on their next contract.

It's a judgement call, you make that judgement call with EVERY long term or even short term guy you sign. If the Oilers truly thought that Nurse who's shown nothing but being extremely competitive, extremely committed, and wanting to win actually would slow down or mail it in cause of an early pay day, then the Oilers management are as bad as we thought they were.

But knowing Nurse (you drafted him afterall), IMO it should have an EASY call to sign this guy long term even if it was only based on his mediocre first 1.5 years in the league. What I saw in him as a 3rd pairing, injured, underwhelming offensive skill, player in his first 1.5 years was enough for me to be sold to sign him long term to whatever the market value his NUMBERS and PERFORMANCE actually warranted back in 15-16. Which if you can IGNORE everything that's happened sinced 16-17 with his progress and actually take a look at what was a reasonable number back then it would have been in that 3.5M-4M range.

 

[rboomercat90]

It takes two to tango. Why would Nurse sign long term for $4m if he knew he had the potential to be making double that by just being patient? Why would his agent let him do that?

Players aren’t leaving anything on the table anymore during contract negotiations if they feel they may have any leverage at all. Especially younger players still on the upswing of their careers. We haven’t seen very many team friendly long term contracts for young players handed out by anyone in the last few off seasons. It’s Russian roulette for all GM’s right now. Since you aren’t getting discounts you’re left with hoping your front office is at least good at player evaluation so the guys you do sign don’t end up being busts.

 

[replacement]

I think players who are unproven, but are offered a "YOUR 100% PROVEN AND CERTIFIED NHLER" type contract worth in the neighborhood of 32 MILLION DOLLARS two years out of junior would jump on that, yes. And it happens all the time, Good Signings, Fair Signings (cause it's not like 4Mx8 is unfair), and Amazing Signings happen ALL the time. Players much more proven, with much more potential than Nurse have signed for less. So don't tell me there's no way he wouldn't have signed that contract, as if you know, when the consensus was from the fanbase was "Yeh, he'd sign that contract"

Okay... Then don't tell me you know anything either. Neither of us knows. Stop pretending you know.