Pat Quinn can't handle team Canada

[stockwizard*]

As opposed to the wonderful insight youre offering with your 4 year old childish insults?

You should read Bob McKenzie's article on TSN. No 'system' in the world is going to make Pronger outbattle a guy half his size for the puck or prevent him from taking stupid penalties. These are fundamental problems with the team and it has more to do with a lack of execution and inability to follow the coaches plan rather than the strategies themselves...These are the same coaches who were good enough to lead the team to Gold in Salt Lake and the World Cup in 04, so they must be doing something right. Are people actually naive enough to believe that Quinn purposely tells his team to play unmotivated, undisciplined and unorganized hockey?

What are you talking about?
Doesn't Quinn set the lines? What the hell is Draper doing on the scoring line?
Quinn has no system and cannot motivate this team.
Quinn is the sole reason his buddy McCabe is on the team.
Quinn is a major problem.

 

[thebodyczech]

What are you talking about?
Doesn't Quinn set the lines? What the hell is Draper doing on the scoring line?
Quinn has no system and cannot motivate this team.
Quinn is the sole reason his buddy McCabe is on the team.
Quinn is a major problem.

I agree with with your second and last observations. Otherwise, McCabe's been having a great year. St. Louis, although comparatively struggling this year, had a terrific 03-04 campaign. I don't think nepotism determined St. Louis' position. Quinn, Gretzky, or whoever simply went with the hot hands.

And, to clarify, the Senators are my second favorite NHL team; so it's not that I'm a Leaf supporter.

 

[Nihilism]

so what happened in 02?? Team Canada loses to Sweden and you didn't see Quinn start yelling at his players... and guess what, they won the fricken tourney!!!

So you're giving him all the credit when he wins, yet when they lose it's not his fault? GIMME A BREAK. You only like him because he used to coach your hockey team. Sorry to break it to you junior, but he is the wrong coach for this team. And Gretzky is the bonehead who picked, and he also has to take the rap.

I hope the gestapo don't come and take me away now, because apprently in this country any discourse about Gretzky is cause for hanging.

 

[octopi]

IWith Quinn's position with the Leafs(I think he was with the Canucks once too?) he may very well have the inside track on Sweden....right?

 

[ScottyBowman]

Were the '02 Olympics held in NA?

I believe so.

 

[shealy04]

I believe so.

Oh wow, honestly, brain-fart...

time to go to bed

 

[BlueAndWhite]

My dad actually had the fortune to sit next to Pat Quinn on a flight a couple years ago and chatted with Quinn a bit about the SLC Olympics. Quinn said something about how the most important factor on that team to him wasn't the skill but the amount of leadership in the dressing room. If the current team doesn't succeed under him (and there's still a ways to go, let's not forget that) then I think that could be a factor. Quinn has always struck me as a coach who relies a lot on his veteran players to show leadership and motivate the team. That shouldn't really be a problem with this roster, but when you look at the SLC team they have lost a little bit. Guys like Lemieux, Yzerman, Nieuwendyk and Shanahan are out and have been replaced by younger guys who, while still very skilled players, might not have the same leadership attributes that those guys did.

QUOTED FOR EMPHASIS.


As a Leaf fan, who has seen Quinn coach for the past few years - I'd agree with your assessment of Quinn.

I really do hope that these players can "light a fire under their own asses" so to speak, because Quinn simply isn't that type of coach.

 

[shaner8989]

But when Quinn won the Gold Medal in 2002.... he was the man though right. Stupid thread. i cant wait till canada wins gold and all u haters can eat your words and look like fools.

 

[Took a pill in Sbisa]

How was Quinn given this position in the first place?

Is it because he won the Jack Adams Trophy 14 years ago?

I mean, the guys hasn't won the Stanley Cup even, let alone make the Finals in the past 7 years..
Is it because he's coaching the Leafs? Is that all?

I just don't see how he is more qualified than any of Brent Sutter, Jacques Martin, Ken Hitchcock, or heck even Darryl Sutter.

 

[thebodyczech]

How was Quinn given this position in the first place?

Is it because he won the Jack Adams Trophy 14 years ago?

I mean, the guys hasn't won the Stanley Cup even, let alone make the Finals in the past 7 years..
Is it because he's coaching the Leafs? Is that all?

I just don't see how he is more qualified than any of Brent Sutter, Jacques Martin, Ken Hitchcock, or heck even Darryl Sutter.

I've been wondering the same thing.

 

[think-blue-]

What are you talking about?
Doesn't Quinn set the lines? What the hell is Draper doing on the scoring line?

All 4 lines are expected to contribute at both ends. This type of strategy has worked in 02 and 04.

Quinn has no system

Wow. Imagine that. He's managed to fool everyone and get by for 18 years and two recent international championships without a system.

and cannot motivate this team.

Already addressed earlier in the thread. But its interesting that Joe Sakic is evading criticism. Isnt he the captain, and isnt the captains role to motivate his team?

Quinn is the sole reason his buddy McCabe is on the team.

False. McCabe is the reason why McCabe is on the team.

 

[thebodyczech]

All 4 lines are expected to contribute at both ends. This type of strategy has worked in 02 and 04.

But, without innovation, there is no progress. Other teams have found new strategies. The Canadians didn't bother to innovate theirs. That in itself is a sign, to me at least, of a complacent or at least overconfident team. Sweden redid its strategy. Slovakia seems to be playing better defense. The Finns, if I'm correct, have changed their strategy as well. I don't think it's coincidental that the teams that sat down to think about their strategies, and how to improve or redraw them, are the ones excelling.

 

[deathbear]

i am SICK of all the leaf-related bashing that's been going on. mccabe has hardly played, and when he has he hasn't done anything wrong. what the **** is going on here anyway??

are we SO biased that we're unable to cheer for canada and the players we're lucky to have???? i'm starting to hate this place.

 

[LannysStach]

McCabe is the only player running at -2 on the team -- and he plays way-less than all the other players. plus he's leading the Olypmics in penalties.

the writing is SO on the wall for old Uncle Pat. so funny those who can't see it.

 

[Chandler55]

McCabe is the only player running at -2 on the team -- and he plays way-less than all the other players. plus he's leading the Olypmics in penalties.

the writing is SO on the wall for old Uncle Pat. so funny those who can't see it.

yeah like a 10 min misconduct is worth 5 minors

 

[Steve L*]

This thread is the same as all the other involving Leaf employees.

Leaf employee get criticised.
Most other fans agree.
Leaf fans show up and blindly defend their man.
Other fans say theyre wrong.
Leaf Fans cry about posters being Leaf haters.
Thread gets locked.

 

[Platapie]

This thread is the same as all the other involving Leaf employees

Let me correct that for you. This thread is the same as any involving a team that isn't playing up to expectations.

OMG- the coaching staff. OMG-- TOO SLOW. Etc etc.

I heard the same crap during the WJC's, remember, all the crap about how Sutter had formed a terrible work team that wouldn't compete, particularly with a goalie that was selected because of western bias, etc.

There are three coaches on the bench, and I refuse to assume that only Quinn calls the shots on that team. I agree this squad has looked bad, but the fact of the matter is the players are playing piss poor hockey. For the record, I'm not impressed with Quinn's job on the Leafs, but I think you can seperate his job with the NHL team and his job with the olympic team-- the Leafs are a relatively weak club, team Canada is not. Or are we going to change our tune and argue the Leafs are a top tier team that is just not coached correctly? I'd LOVE to go down that avenue.

IMO people need to calm down. This team has looked bad but it is still loaded with talent and by no means is out of the tournament yet. Hell, the next game decides if we play the Slovaks or the Russians (IIRC), and either opponent will be a handful-- thus we're going to have to play these teams anyway. As long as this team looks better by the the time those games start, I wont care, and neither will anyone else here. So lets all take a deep breath, relax, realize that other countries are pretty damn good at hockey also, and just settle down and see how this plays out. If the team fails, the coaching staff will be held accountable. If it does well, it'll be because they overcame the horrible coaching I'm sure.

Edit- With regards to Mccabe, selecting him to this tournament was a mistake not because of his ability per se, but because of his abilities on international ice. We saw it during the lockout, he just doesn't adjust properly to it. In the NHL, he is an excellent player, despite what others want to think, but on International ice, the man is out of his element.

 

[Roo]

To lay the blame of Canada's mediocrity thus far on the coach, and only 1 of the 3 coaches specifically, is ludicrous.

We won the last two big tournaments with the same coaching staff.

We are losing these games because our players arent doing well enough. Its as simple as that. When your team is taking bad penalties (esp when we went down 2-0 against the swiss), and your passing is horrendous, and you cant score, and when you miss a simple assignment in the defensive end, HOW CAN YOU ATTRIBUTE IT TO ONE PERSON WHO ISNT EVEN ON THE ICE??

Do you think Quinn needs to tell Pronger not to take more penalties, or to tell hime, 'you know what, you shouldnt take a penalty when we're already down one man'..? Should he tell Redden to make better passes so we dont ice the puck so much?

If this coaching staff is good with Wayne Gretzky & co., its fine with me. Nobody wants to blame the players though (unless his name is mccabe). Thats whats strange to me. Many players (including mccabe) havent played well and deserve part of the blame.

How about Sakic and Iginla. The 'leaders' of this team. To be shut out twice in a row, how come noone says anything about them? They most definately need to step up and put something on the scoreboard at times like these.

This is a team, and when a team loses, they lose together. Everyone is at fault. Not just 1 person, no matter who he is.

 

[Big Mama*]

.

Oh yeah, and sorry to all you leaf fans, but Mccabe has been awful too. Ive seen him throw like 5 hail mary cross ice passes in this Canada Finland game alone. Hes not helping us defensively, and if he isnt scoring goals on the PP then he has no value. .

Iginla has done ... . Regher does the best impression of a pylon on Team Canada. How many gaffes did he have against Finland? Pronger has taken stupid penalties and gets out worked. The Foote-Redden pair routinely misses coverages and Redden constantly coughs up the puck. Poor Jbo gets turned inside out more than my shirt and the only players that fear Blakes shot are on Team Canada (and the boards).

As for McCabe he was th only guy who didn't make a gaffer against the Finns. Covered up for a boneheaded play by Redden and Pronger. He only tried the Hail Mary a couple of time and that was with just a little time left.

Oh yes and it is Hitchcock running the defence and changing the d-man.

 

[NFITO]

So you're giving him all the credit when he wins, yet when they lose it's not his fault? GIMME A BREAK. You only like him because he used to coach your hockey team. Sorry to break it to you junior, but he is the wrong coach for this team. And Gretzky is the bonehead who picked, and he also has to take the rap.

I hope the gestapo don't come and take me away now, because apprently in this country any discourse about Gretzky is cause for hanging.

are you serious here?? cause your entire post is a joke!

first of all... there aren't too many people that call me junior, considering that I'm older than most posters on this board... I'm probably one of few posters here that actually saw Gretzky in his rookie season in the NHL!

secondly, I NEVER once said that he should get credit for the wins, and yet no blame for the losses... instead of trying to make up crap, maybe you should understand what someone is saying first???

Quinn got no credit when the team won in 02... so why are people ripping him now when the team lost 2 in a row (and the elimination round hasn't even started yet)??

thirdly, I am not a Quinn fan... just because he used to coach our team - a decade ago - doesn't mean that I have some attachment to him. I am not a Leafs fan... I'm not a Quinn fan... I'm not a McCabe fan...

But I'm also a realist - not a nihilist who doesn't believe in anything and has too look at the world through pessismistic eyes!

so please - break it to me junior - why is he the wrong coach for this team? Gretzky seems to disagree and I'd like to know why you think he's so wrong for this team, when we haven't even hit the elimination rounds yet?

He was the coach of this team during 02 - and guess what - they won the fricken gold!! He was also the coach in 04... and guess what... yea - they won the championship then too.

So after that, why would Gretzky now replace him?

We all know that Gretzky is a loyal guy... he brought back a lot of players that have represented Team Canada before (in fact Bertuzzi is the only player on the team that wasn't part of Team Canada in either 02 or 04)... he's further showing his loyalty by bringing back a coach - and staff - that have won back to back championships and have NOT yet lost a tournament when coaching this team.

In Gretzky's position, it's a no-brainer.... the hard decision for him was who to name in 02... but he chose Quinn, Hitchcock and Martin, and they won... so he brought them back in 04... and they won again... so why in the world would he not bring them back now??

Gretzky believes that the most important intangible in big tournaments like this is experience and leadership... that's why he put together the team he did. Without Lemieux and Yzerman available, he went with some of the younger guys, but still those that have some experience (Thornton, Lecavalier, etc) over those that don't have as much (like Staal, Crosby, etc)... until they actually lose in the elimination rounds and their tournament is over, it's kinda hard to argue with that logic... especially considering that it was this experience that helped turn around a disappointing start in their past 2 tournaments and lead them to gold - both times!!

So junior - I'm waiting to know exactly why Quinn was such a bad choice, considering the resume he has representing Team Canada? Or maybe you believe that the fact he coached the team to gold in the last 2 tournaments means nothing (while now blaming him for the losses), and what's more important is picking the fan's flavour of the day instead?

Again I'm not a Quinn fan at all... I just find it rather pathetic that all this blame is going to him, especially after seeing Team Canada disappointing in the preliminary rounds in their 2 previous tournaments only to go on to win the Gold... and in both cases it was Quinn and co. behind the bench.

 

[west in the east]

The thing about being a coach is that when you win you get none of the credit and when you lose you get most of the blame... this is the way much of this thread is going

 

[Big Mama*]

How was Quinn given this position in the first place?

Is it because he won the Jack Adams Trophy 14 years ago?

I mean, the guys hasn't won the Stanley Cup even, let alone make the Finals in the past 7 years..
Is it because he's coaching the Leafs? Is that all?

I just don't see how he is more qualified than any of Brent Sutter, Jacques Martin, Ken Hitchcock, or heck even Darryl Sutter.

Because he wins. Three straight golds for hockey Canada. 98 World Championship, 02 Olympic gold and 04 World Cup.

He has taken teams to the finals twice. Conference finals 4 times. Has missed the playoffs only once in his career. Has won over 72% of his first round playoff series. Has two Jack Adams Trophies. And the Best

He turned the Leafs from losers into winners. And made the owners of MLSE very rich in the process.

 

[Blades of Glory]

Quinn and Gretzky are paying the price for the players not performing. Whichever way you look at it, the PLAYERS have to bond together and do their job. Quinn can only coach, Gretzky can only put the team together. The team is good enough to win Gold easily, its the players job to come together and do it, not the coach.

When Canada wins, the players get all the credit, and when Canada loses, the coach gets shelled with insults. It shouldn't be that way, but it's like that in all sports, especially hockey.

 

[HellsBells]

Iginla has done ... . Regher does the best impression of a pylon on Team Canada. How many gaffes did he have against Finland? Pronger has taken stupid penalties and gets out worked. The Foote-Redden pair routinely misses coverages and Redden constantly coughs up the puck. Poor Jbo gets turned inside out more than my shirt and the only players that fear Blakes shot are on Team Canada (and the boards).

As for McCabe he was th only guy who didn't make a gaffer against the Finns. Covered up for a boneheaded play by Redden and Pronger. He only tried the Hail Mary a couple of time and that was with just a little time left.

Oh yes and it is Hitchcock running the defence and changing the d-man.

McCabe has been by far the worst defender for Team Canada. That is obvious to anyone that watched the games. And what does Iginla have to do with the defencemen ?? If your calling out Iginla, lets talk about Sakic, Gagne, Thornton, Bertuzzi, Richards, Lecavalier, Heatley, St. Louis etc.... Jarome Iginla has hardly been Team Canada's worst forward.

 

[Big Mama*]

McCabe has been by far the worst defender for Team Canada. That is obvious to anyone that watched the games. And what does Iginla have to do with the defencemen ?? If your calling out Iginla, lets talk about Sakic, Gagne, Thornton, Bertuzzi, Richards, Lecavalier, Heatley, St. Louis etc.... Jarome Iginla has hardly been Team Canada's worst forward.

I was disscusing the Finnish game. Against the Finns McCabe was the only d-man who didn't make a gaffe.

Lots of forwards are playing poorly but Iginla was once one of the best.