Part 4: True North Sports & Entertainment's efforts to acquire an NHL team (Winnipeg)

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MAROONSRoad

f/k/a Ghost
Feb 24, 2007
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Maroons Rd.
Which international tournament would require more press space? Are there any? Winnipeg/Manitoba doesn't have the infrastructure to hold most large international tournaments. WJHC is probably too big for Manitoba now.

What a strange thing to say. I guess Buffalo, Saskatoon, Grand Forks and Ottawa are light years ahead of Winnipeg as hockey markets? :shakehead

GHOST
 

Jonjmc

Registered User
Feb 7, 2006
1,498
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What a strange thing to say. I guess Buffalo, Saskatoon, Grand Forks and Ottawa are light years ahead of Winnipeg as hockey markets? :shakehead

GHOST

What a strange thing to say. What does hockey markets have to do with infrastructure, which is exactly what the post you were responding to said? I'm not claiming I know if Winnipeg does or doesn't have the infrastructure, only that your reply had nothing to do with what he was questioning.
 

cbcwpg

Registered User
May 18, 2010
20,100
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Between the Pipes
Winnipeg/Manitoba doesn't have the infrastructure to hold most large international tournaments. WJHC is probably too big for Manitoba now.

???

So why was it that in 1999 Winnipeg hosted the WJHC in a dive that was the old Winnipeg Arena that was brutal to watch hockey in and had way less press box space than the current MTS Centre ( which for some reason people think is important )

Infrastructure: The term typically refers to the technical structures that support a society, such as roads, water supply, sewers, power grids, telecommunications, and so forth. Last time I looked we had those things. Hey we also live in igloos, but other than that, we should be good to go.

Maybe your right. Maybe from now on the WJHC should only be hosted in places like Phoenix which obviously has more "infrastructure" ( being a bigger city and all ). That way the whole world can see just how pathetic a hockey market that place is. Can you imagine..... A game between Finland and Sweden held in Phoenix.... there would be more people on the benches than in the stands.
 
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MAROONSRoad

f/k/a Ghost
Feb 24, 2007
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0
Maroons Rd.
What a strange thing to say. What does hockey markets have to do with infrastructure, which is exactly what the post you were responding to said? I'm not claiming I know if Winnipeg does or doesn't have the infrastructure, only that your reply had nothing to do with what he was questioning.

I think I got to the gist of what the poster meant. Winnipeg certainly has the infrastructure to hold the WHJC. This whole tangent 'topic' is ridiculous.

GHOST
 

pucka lucka

Registered User
Apr 7, 2010
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Umm, they specifically talked about Winnipeg in regards to future WJHC's. We have MTS Centre and Brandon's. The point is Manitoba might not have the infrastructure to support the size of the WJHC in NA. I don't think it's a stretch at all to say that. If I was awarding the WJHC in Canada, where can I sell more tickets, Alberta, BC, SO, Quebec which all have a much higher population density and arenas with large capacities.
 

dkehler

Registered User
Dec 1, 2009
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Winnipeg
The WJHC has become a much bigger event since Winnipeg last hosted it. It may not have completely outgrown Winnipeg, but it's not ludicrous to suggest that it might have. Hockey Canada has had the chance to "reward" Winnipeg for helping them out when it wasn't looking good for the world hockey championships attendance in Québec by offering to take over the tournament on short notice, but Québec got their act together and the world juniors went to the Saskatchewan over Manitoba because I believe they were prepared to guarantee more revenue.
 

MAROONSRoad

f/k/a Ghost
Feb 24, 2007
4,067
0
Maroons Rd.
Umm, they specifically talked about Winnipeg in regards to future WJHC's. We have MTS Centre and Brandon's. The point is Manitoba might not have the infrastructure to support the size of the WJHC in NA. I don't think it's a stretch at all to say that. If I was awarding the WJHC in Canada, where can I sell more tickets, Alberta, BC, SO, Quebec which all have a much higher population density and arenas with large capacities.

They move the tournament around. It'll be back to Winnipeg sometime within the next decade assuming TNSE wants to host it. Aside from Montreal, GTA and Vancouver and arguably Alberta, there isn't a better place in the world to host a tournament such as the WJHC than Winnipeg. They are not going to want to hold it exclusively in those other locals indefinitely. Unless you are going to get hung up about the fact that the MTS Centre is 'missing' a few thousand seats, I don't understand your point. Higher population density doesn't mean a thing once you sell out the arena. In Winnipeg that's a given for most of the key match ups. I am done with this topic.

GHOST
 
Nov 13, 2006
11,520
1,400
Ohio
Based on the numerous pieces of data floating around, I believe as ABD posted, some expansion of the press box was needed, and since they are working to get an NHL franchise, it just makes sense to upgrade to NHL standards. These people are clearly making sure there are as few gaps in their offering as they can control.
 

Jeffrey93

Registered User
Nov 7, 2007
4,335
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I am. Hamilton will not recieve an NHL team for the long term forseable future, thanks in part to Baldsilly's bullying tacticts. And then there the Buffalo territory and MLSE issues as well.

Here is my argument. MTS Centre, IMO, is most definately upgrading the pressbox for the coming of the NHL. Why? Because this is the one thing that the NHL had told them needed upgrading for it to be an NHL Calibre arena. This would not be done just for the AHL Moose team. They are already at the top of their league and one of the highest (or the highest) profitable teams in the league. For TNSE to spend lots of money for little $$$ return from those press box upgrades does not make economical sense as enhancing media coverage for a lesser calibre hockey league (in comaprison the the NHL) will not likely lead to increased viewership and therefore increased profits. But you do it for the NHL, and whammo, your chances for getting a team are almost guarenteed (in TNSE's case anyways), which means once you get the team, your profits will significantly increase from AHL standards in comparison with the small amount of money you spent for the upgrades. NHL will likely mean more profit than AHL in the long term.


There. Happy now?

Not quite happy yet. Are you suggesting that the NHL said "Unless you upgrade that press box there is NO chance yer getting a team."

Please. That is stuff that MIGHT be said and it would be agreed to be done if and when an NHL team shows up.
Teams have been awarded and played out of garbage arenas not even meant for hockey because it was agreed a new arena would be built if and when a team showed up.

There is absolutely no way the NHL told TNSE they need to upgrade their press box pro-actively in order to even be considered.

I love how we are immediately tossing out that the TNSE guy said the press box was sub-standard from the beginning. How convenient.
 

Jeffrey93

Registered User
Nov 7, 2007
4,335
46
Based on the numerous pieces of data floating around, I believe as ABD posted, some expansion of the press box was needed, and since they are working to get an NHL franchise, it just makes sense to upgrade to NHL standards. These people are clearly making sure there are as few gaps in their offering as they can control.

This I can get on board with.....it needs upgrading anyway....so instead of possibly doing it twice...go big the first time.
 

Confucius

There is no try, Just do
Feb 8, 2009
21,890
6,905
Toronto
It would be so funny if Hulsizer was paying for the reno's at MTS in order to gain leverage with Phoenix. Now there is a conspiracy theory.
 

bodybreak

Whiteshell Wild
Jul 11, 2006
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I can say that during AHL regular season games, the original press box is typically half full... Interesting then that they'd double capacity, if, for most events, that means now having a press box that will only be 1/4 used...

One major gripe about it was how high in the air it was (distance to ice level). Adding the second level below will improve that situation.
 

Ozzie Bear

Registered User
Apr 30, 2010
129
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Winnipeg, MB
I can say that during AHL regular season games, the original press box is typically half full... Interesting then that they'd double capacity, if, for most events, that means now having a press box that will only be 1/4 used...

One major gripe about it was how high in the air it was (distance to ice level). Adding the second level below will improve that situation.

I think a major part of the press box enhancements includes digital equipment & proprietory software that will comply with both NHL & NHLPA requirements. All players game clips are digitalized and can be viewed directly by the players & coaches between periods and after the game, as in NHL buildings now but not in AHL buildings. This can be used for coaching strategies and for matchups. But it can also be used to record TOI (Time on Ice) for each player, including matchups, who he was on with/against, situational play, and of course, statistics. Useful info (by both sides) as well when contracts are negotiated. They already did a software enhancement for comprehensive scouting info on all teams last winter, and I believe thaat these press box enhancements are in keeping with that (plus the obvious stuff for the media).
 

AllByDesign

Who's this ABD guy??
Mar 17, 2010
2,317
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Location, Location!
Schizah!! It's a damn press box. TNSE will likely bid on every future WJC that is awarded to Canada. By and large it eventually be awarded to Winnipeg. It isn't a matter of debate. Hilariously recycling the NHL viability conversation into a new topic is folly. Does Winnipeg have enough corporate support to sustain an IKEA franchise? Who the he'll cares, they're building one anyhow.
 

Killion

Registered User
Feb 19, 2010
36,763
3,211
Does Winnipeg have enough corporate support to sustain an IKEA franchise? Who the he'll cares, they're building one anyhow.

Ya, I heard about that. Congrats' Winnipeg. I once bought a leather couch at IKEA. It came in a huge box I barely got on the top of my then 73 VW SuperBug. Opened it up at home & found an Allan Wrench, a Knife & 2 Holsteins'. :)
 

bodybreak

Whiteshell Wild
Jul 11, 2006
1,452
0
not to mention Target, Walmart Supercentres and Outlet Mall stores... in a few years, those long weekend trips to ND and MN will no longer be necessary!
 

htpwn

Registered User
Nov 4, 2009
20,530
2,607
Toronto
Ya, I heard about that. Congrats' Winnipeg. I once bought a leather couch at IKEA. It came in a huge box I barely got on the top of my then 73 VW SuperBug. Opened it up at home & found an Allan Wrench, a Knife & 2 Holsteins'. :)

Apparently the founder of IKEA (now a billionaire, obviously) lives in a house where every piece of furniture is from... you guessed it... IKEA!

not to mention Target, Walmart Supercentres and Outlet Mall stores... in a few years, those long weekend trips to ND and MN will no longer be necessary!

Pfft... Walmart, Target, what we need is a revived Eaton's franchise.
 

peter sullivan

Winnipeg
Apr 9, 2010
2,356
4
This whole world junior debate is ridiculous. They held it in grand forks north Dakota. A town of 40 000 people. Why? Because it's two hours from Winnipeg.

Winnipeg is the 8th largest city in Canada which makes it the 8th best market on God's green earth to hold the world juniors.

It's an irrelevant argument anyways.
 

Melrose Munch

Registered User
Mar 18, 2007
23,546
2,006
htpwn I went ot eatons in the late 90's as a kid. It sucked. I prefer walmart supercenter and Sears by far.
 

htpwn

Registered User
Nov 4, 2009
20,530
2,607
Toronto
htpwn I went ot eatons in the late 90's as a kid. It sucked. I prefer walmart supercenter and Sears by far.

Eaton's was on its last legs in the 1990s and ironically was bought by the aforementioned Sears. At its peak, the store had something like 60% of all the market share in Canada for department stores. The company was considered as invincible as a CIBC or BMO.

Eaton's never built an NHL arena themselves, but they contributed to building two very important ones. The first was Maple Leaf Gardens, after they sold the land to Smythe for below market value, and secondly, their former now-renovated Winnipeg store (Which unbelievably dominated the market; on a regular day in the 1960s, it was guessed that 1 of 10 Winnipeggers would visit the location), is now well on its way to getting Winnipeg a new NHL team in the form of the MTS Centre.
 
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MAROONSRoad

f/k/a Ghost
Feb 24, 2007
4,067
0
Maroons Rd.
htpwn I went ot eatons in the late 90's as a kid. It sucked. I prefer walmart supercenter and Sears by far.

Ah, Walmart, that community and small business killer. I've been to small towns in Texas where all the small shops have been closed down and boarded up on main street. You have to drive to the edge of town to do your shopping at the Walmart Supercenter, surrounded by an ocean of parking lots and SUVs. The only thing good about Walmart is its cheap prices. I suppose it is also good for distributing the products of China Inc. and contributing to the deindustrialization of North America. And besides, I don't appreciate their tactic of hiring retirees as "greeters" that make you feel like a criminal by checking your bags and receipts, always with a smile, as you exit.

GHOST
 

AllByDesign

Who's this ABD guy??
Mar 17, 2010
2,317
0
Location, Location!
Eaton's never built an NHL arena themselves, but they contributed to building two very important ones. The first was Maple Leaf Gardens, after they sold the land to Smythe for below market value, and secondly, their former now-renovated Winnipeg store (Which unbelievably dominated the market; on a regular day in the 1960s, it was guessed that 1 of 10 Winnipeggers would visit the location), is now well on its way to getting Winnipeg a new NHL team in the form of the MTS Centre.

Sooo... ummm .. in which way did Eaton's contribute to the new MTS centre? beyond the "Brass Timothy" in the lobby.
 
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