Proposal: Panarin's RFA rights for Victor Rask

[Hawksfan2828]

And that's fine. Rask and Faulk at 50% is still a terrible deal for Carolina. Not sure how you can't recognize that.

I don't know about that.

It's not as far off as you think it is.

Panarin and Kruger for Rask and Faulk would be straight up even money.

But I don't know if I would do that... Very tempting but it's pretty difficult to lose a ppg 24-year-old winger with a nasty shot.

 

[H a w k s*]

Well, you want a 24-year-old ppg player...

It's scary to think what Panarin could do when he's 26,27,28...

He's gonna get worse players peak offensively at 25.

 

[RememberTheRoar]

Well, there are many teams that could take on his extension.

If the Hawks do trade Panarin they need to get a top 6 winger, top prospect and a 1st or 2nd round pick back in the deal..

There's no doubt Rask is a top 6 forward, and he could play wing. It just comes down to finding agreement on the other pieces.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

I don't know about that.

It's not as far off as you think it is.

Yes, it is.

Rask (23 YO) 50-60 point player + Faulk (24YO) 45-50 point #1 Defenseman (at 50% mind you) for 80 point, 25 year old Panarin. Canes get WORSE offensively and end up paying MORE for it. That's "far off" in anybody's book. As I said, Faulk ALONE could likely get a top line forward, without Rask and without 50% retained. It's far off no matter how often you say it isn't far off, IT IS. Just admit it, it's a bad deal for Carolina.

Panarin and Kruger for Rask and Faulk would be straight up even money.

Great and 3rd/4th liner is EXACTLY what Carolina needs.

But I don't know if I would do that... Very tempting but it's pretty difficult to lose a ppg 24-year-old winger with a nasty shot.

1) 25, not 24.
2) Canes aren't giving up a 23 year old 50-60 point C and a 24 year old 45-50 point #1 RHD for him so you don't have to worry about it.

 

[paragon]

Makes zero sense for any team to give anything for Panarin. He's going to be awarded so much money in arbitration, that Hawks will have to let him just walk.

Considering Rasks contract I wouldn't trade him straight up for Panarin.

 

[RememberTheRoar]

Makes zero sense for any team to give anything for Panarin. He's going to be awarded so much money in arbitration, that Hawks will have to let him just walk.

Considering Rasks contract I wouldn't trade him straight up for Panarin.

This is the ultimate worst case scenario for the Hawks, one the rest of the league would LOVE.

 

[Hawksfan2828]

There's no doubt Rask is a top 6 forward, and he could play wing. It just comes down to finding agreement on the other pieces.

It would have to be a 1st round pick and a top prospect - like 8.0 B prospect.

The best move the Hawks could make would be to get a contract extension done.

If we need to trade Searbook or Kruger to make it work who cares, I mean we will get assets back in any deal for either player - they're not cap dumps like Bickell.

Yes, it would suck to lose Seabrook, but it would suck even more to lose a 24-year-old ppg player...

I think we can replace Seabrook a lot easier than Panarin.

 

[Michel Beauchamp]

Reading this thread, I could not help wondering which team had cap problems facing them next season...

A team will not get full value for a player when it can't afford to sign him...

 

[RememberTheRoar]

It would have to be a 1st round pick and a top prospect - like 8.0 B prospect.

The best move the Hawks could make would be to get a contract extension done.

If we need to trade Searbook or Kruger to make it work who cares, I mean we will get assets back in any deal for either player - they're not cap dumps like Bickell.

Yes, it would suck to lose Seabrook, but it would suck even more to lose a 24-year-old ppg player...

I think we can replace Seabrook a lot easier than Panarin.

I don't know about that. That's tough to gauge for me.

 

[RememberTheRoar]

Reading this thread, I could not help wondering which team had cap problems facing them next season...

A team will not get full value for a player when it can't afford to sign him...

Which makes this deal pretty damn fair. Panarin is obviously >> than Rask, but Rask's contract is >> than Panarin's next contract.

A cap-strapped team should want the better contract, a rebuilding team should want the better player.

 

[Hawksfan2828]

Reading this thread, I could not help wondering which team had cap problems facing them next season...

A team will not get full value for a player when it can't afford to sign him...

Really in what universe does this happen?

How many teams you think would be interested in Panarin?

Answer: a lot.

Look at what Saad got, and he's no where near Panarin as far as skill and production.

Hawks aren't forced to move Panarin - he's a RFA - Hawks don't even have to sign him. Bowman could sit back and watch a bidding war explode over Panarin and potentially walk away with two firsts, a second and third-round picks if he signs an offersheet for 7.5 per or higher - and that value isn't out of the question.

I mean at the very least his RFA rights are worth a First, second and third-round picks, but realistically at 7.5 it's (2) first round picks, second and thrid round picks.

 

[paragon]

This is the ultimate worst case scenario for the Hawks, one the rest of the league would LOVE.

There's simply no way Hawks can keep him. All the big contracts are long and carry a NMC.

There's also no way Hawks could pay him what he deserves (7M+). Only chance is that someone holds a gun to his head and gives him a small offer he can't refuse.

Hawks can still get a decent return for him, because I'm sure there will be plenty of takers, but they have to be quick and trade him before he gets an offer sheet.

 

[RememberTheRoar]

Makes zero sense for any team to give anything for Panarin. He's going to be awarded so much money in arbitration, that Hawks will have to let him just walk.

Considering Rasks contract I wouldn't trade him straight up for Panarin.

Really in what universe does this happen?

How many teams you think would be interested in Panarin?

Answer: a lot.

Look at what Saad got, and he's no where near Panarin as far as skill and production.

Hawks aren't forced to move Panarin - he's a RFA - Hawks don't even have to sign him. Bowman could sit back and watch a bidding war explode over Panarin and potentially walk away with two firsts, a second and third-round picks if he signs an offersheet for 7.5 per or higher - and that value isn't out of the question.

I mean at the very least his RFA rights are worth a First, second and third-round picks, but realistically at 7.5 it's (2) first round picks, second and thrid round picks.

This is why you can't sit on his RFA status for an unlimited time. They do need to make a decision at some point.

If Panarin's agent wants to to be a real *******, he'll push for arbitration as a route to UFA status.

 

[Hawksfan2828]

Which makes this deal pretty damn fair. Panarin is obviously >> than Rask, but Rask's contract is >> than Panarin's next contract.

A cap-strapped team should want the better contract, a rebuilding team should want the better player.

He's worth way more than that.

http://www.coppernblue.com/news-and...sheet-compensation-2016-restricted-free-agent

Difficult to gauge what he will get but it's between 6 and 7.5 per.

At minimum as far as picks Panarin is worth a 1st, 2nd and 3rd and that's if he signs an offersheet at $5,632,847 to $7,510,464.

He could sign for more.

That's a lot of value and Rask's value is no where close to that.

 

[Hawksfan2828]

This is why you can't sit on his RFA status for an unlimited time. They do need to make a decision at some point.

All the Hawks have to do is qualify him.

Then they can sit back and match offers up until they fill comfortable.

I mean Panarin could just sign a 3-year bridge deal at 5 per...

 

[RememberTheRoar]

There's simply no way Hawks can keep him. All the big contracts are long and carry a NMC.

There's also no way Hawks could pay him what he deserves (7M+). Only chance is that someone holds a gun to his head and gives him a small offer he can't refuse.

Hawks can still get a decent return for him, because I'm sure there will be plenty of takers, but they have to be quick and trade him before he gets an offer sheet.

There are ways they can keep him, but it could take major sacrifices. Or it would take Panarin telling his agent to take less money in order to stay with the Hawks.

Also, the Hawks absolutely do need to move quickly if he must me moved next offseason.

 

[Unsustainable]

Well, you want a 24-year-old ppg player...

It's scary to think what Panarin could do when he's 26,27,28...

We didn't make the offer.

 

[paragon]

Hawks aren't forced to move Panarin - he's a RFA - Hawks don't even have to sign him.

Of course they aren't forced to move him, but it's better than letting him walk for nothing after he is awarded 7M in arbitration.

His return could be closer to Sharp than Saad and not because Panarin is not a great player, but because the Hawks are obviously handcuffed.

 

[Hawksfan2828]

There's simply no way Hawks can keep him. All the big contracts are long and carry a NMC.

There's also no way Hawks could pay him what he deserves (7M+). Only chance is that someone holds a gun to his head and gives him a small offer he can't refuse.

Hawks can still get a decent return for him, because I'm sure there will be plenty of takers, but they have to be quick and trade him before he gets an offer sheet.

Well if a team wants to poach him and give up (2) 1st round picks, 2nd and 3rd round picks then fine.

Or Panarin could just sign a bridge deal at 5 per (or even less)...

It really depends on how many teams are interested in signing Panarin - either way the Hawks will end up signing him or will be getting lots of assets back in an offersheet or trade.

 

[RememberTheRoar]

All the Hawks have to do is qualify him.

Then they can sit back and match offers up until they fill comfortable.

I mean Panarin could just sign a 3-year bridge deal at 5 per...

If that were realistic, why isn't it done?

Illinois isn't Florida, 5M in Florida is worth more than 5M in Illinois.

 

[Hawksfan2828]

Of course they aren't forced to move him, but it's better than letting him walk for nothing after he is awarded 7M in arbitration.

His return could be closer to Sharp than Saad and not because Panarin is not a great player, but because the Hawks are obviously handcuffed.

I don't even think he's arbitration eligible.

 

[Hawksfan2828]

If that were realistic, why isn't it done?

Illinois isn't Florida, 5M in Florida is worth more than 5M in Illinois.

It's obvious Bowman wants to see what's up with the cap at the winter GM meetings that are comming up next week.

Once he has an idea about the cap next season I think he will try to get a deal done.

Remember - the same thing happened with Toews, Kane and Keith. They all signed extensions after the GM meetings.

 

[Hawksfan2828]

Enough trade debate - Hawks game is on.

 

[RememberTheRoar]

Enough trade debate - Hawks game is on.

Agreed.

 

[GoldiFox]

Well if a team wants to poach him and give up (2) 1st round picks, 2nd and 3rd round picks then fine.

Or Panarin could just sign a bridge deal at 5 per (or even less)...

It really depends on how many teams are interested in signing Panarin - either way the Hawks will end up signing him or will be getting lots of assets back in an offersheet or trade.

Your acceptable return for Panarin is 2 firsts (likely mid to late), a 2nd and a 3rd OR Victor Rask + Faulk (50% retained).

Bit of a gulf there.