P-L Dubois Part 2

Ice9

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Jun 25, 2016
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In the woods
I was aggravated by him in the PO....heck, I was aggravated by alot during the PO. Ultimately, kid is young and still learning and developing. He should be fun for us to watch.
 
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jacketsnation

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Jul 25, 2017
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Kid cant even legally drink. Hes going to be point per game guy for sure. Look at hertl, meier this year'! Pld has better production at this stage of his career then both of them.
 
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Old Guy

Just waitin' on my medication.
Aug 30, 2015
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The fact that this discussion is occurring is laughable. If Jarmo drafted Jesse Pjulvaari the CBJ would not have been in the playoffs. Wennberg would not be the whipping boy of this community.
 

thebus88

19/20 Columbus Blue Jackets: "It Is What It Is"
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The fact that this discussion is occurring is laughable. If Jarmo drafted Jesse Pjulvaari the CBJ would not have been in the playoffs. Wennberg would not be the whipping boy of this community.

Shall we go back and look at the quotes of peoples feelings on BOTH Jarmo and Dubois after that pick was made?

Also, these talks are ironic and hilarious given what people were saying about Wennberg's "growth" and "potential" after his 1st couple years, WHEN HE WAS AND HAD PLAYED TERRIBLE.
 

Cyclones Rock

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Jun 12, 2008
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The fact that this discussion is occurring is laughable. If Jarmo drafted Jesse Pjulvaari the CBJ would not have been in the playoffs. Wennberg would not be the whipping boy of this community.

Wennberg would be a whipping boy regardless. He's awful and if Jarmo isn't foolish, Al will be an ex CBJ around 5 days after the Stanley Cup playoffs end.
 
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Theo Von

gang gang buzz buzz
Nov 15, 2013
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To me it looked like he was trying to hard to be “the guy.”

He made uncharacteristic plays, tried to beat multiple guys and be the hero. We didn’t need him to be tho

you're not just describing his post season play but his regular season play as well.
 

Theo Von

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Nov 15, 2013
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what are everyone's expectations of young PLD this season? point total? goal total? etc..

will he eclipse his previous season's point total of 61?
 

Jovavic

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Oct 13, 2002
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Between 45-55 points is my guess, losing a player like Panarin on the wing would hurt anybody, even if Nyquist comes in and they mesh to the tune of being 80% as effective.
 

EspenK

Registered User
Sep 25, 2011
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Good question. Minus Panarin's impact plus a years experience and maturation I'll guess 50-65. One of many interesting subplots this season.
 

MoeBartoli

Checkers-to-Jackets
Jan 12, 2011
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For the same reason as EspenK, I'm on a similar track of 50-65. It's not just Bread being gone, it's that LW is such a weak spot for us unless Texier becomes a legit top 6 LW.
 

Cyclones Rock

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Jun 12, 2008
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I'd like to see more than 60 points from PLD. He's a third overall and the hope is that he'll be a top NHL center. I'll be alarmed if he scores less than 20 goals or gets less than 50 points.

If he's a top talent, his learning curve (season 3) should just about make up for the loss of Panarin so he should come close to last season's totals of 27-34=61 points. He's 21-which is still very young-but top draft pics/ top talents are breaking out by that age.
 
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stevo61

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Jul 5, 2011
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I think he'll be around a similar point total this year. For him the biggest thing is mindset. Youd see moments where he would take over a game but too many moments he was too quick to let Panarin do the work because he's the superstar. Dubois has the talent to be a game changer but I think he needs to come into this year with a different mentality and he will be fine.
He and Bjorkstrand almost share that trait, I dont want to call them passive but they try to earn their spot I guess instead of just taking it even though they have the talent to do so
 

Old Guy

Just waitin' on my medication.
Aug 30, 2015
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I step back from this discussion and just reflect. It's not that this is a worthless discussion or opinions don't matter. Every time PLD's name is brought up, I still hear all the Ooooohh's from the arena floor in Buffalo when Ville Siren announced his name. Everybody was so damn certain that Jesse PoolParty was going 3rd. Now JP has already asked for his way out of Edmonton. Pierre Luc DuBois has shown so much and delivered so much and played so well for the Blue Jackets. It really doesn't matter if it's 70 points, 60 points, or 50 points to me. (Obviously rooting for the highest). I'm just so damn happy with the CBJ brian trust for what they accomplished with this young man getting to this point.
 

majormajor

Registered User
Jun 23, 2018
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55 or 60 seems reasonable.

The thing that Panarin did all of was the transition work, he'd enter the zone and then distribute. Dubois doesn't have the best puck control so how he manages the neutral zone is going to be interesting. I do think he can improve there so perhaps that's what he'll learn this year. I'm pretty confident in his overall scoring ability. He can rip the puck, he can pull it off the wall and use his shoulders to push guys back. If he's in the offensive zone I'm confident he can score, it's just getting there that I'll be curious about.
 

JohnnyJacket13

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I think he's on a similar trajectory as Scheifele. Wouldn't shock me if his game elevates now that he has two full years under his belt, but also wouldn't surprise me if he regresses slightly without Panarin. He's going to have to create more plays on his own by carrying/distributing the puck, which I think he is more than capable of.
 

blahblah

Registered User
Nov 24, 2005
21,327
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Between 45-55 points is my guess, losing a player like Panarin on the wing would hurt anybody, even if Nyquist comes in and they mesh to the tune of being 80% as effective.

I really don't think that is a given. I have no expectations, but I don't really anticipate much of a drop if any. He's doesn't seem like a 3 shot per game player, so 25 goals seems about the right total. He'll have more than enough around him, and the minutes, to get anther 35 or more assists.

If he can produce on the PP, we could very well start to see him push that 70 point mark. We shall see. I'm more concerned about his play in our zone than him producing.
 

thebus88

19/20 Columbus Blue Jackets: "It Is What It Is"
Sep 27, 2017
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I think he'll be around a similar point total this year. For him the biggest thing is mindset. Youd see moments where he would take over a game but too many moments he was too quick to let Panarin do the work because he's the superstar. Dubois has the talent to be a game changer but I think he needs to come into this year with a different mentality and he will be fine.
He and Bjorkstrand almost share that trait, I dont want to call them passive but they try to earn their spot I guess instead of just taking it even though they have the talent to do so

Essentially all of this.

Part of it is a huge reason why I think the concept of every other "point producer" seeing a decrease in points because of the loss of Panarin is BOGUS. All the PRIME 1st line ice time, powerplay time, look/shots have to go to somebody, and YES goals and assists will still occur. Even though losing Panarin WILL NOT increase the "effectiveness" of our offense, I think to say that the team as a whole or certain players individual points totals will be negatively affected isn't actually "backed up" by anything, other than bogus math that only takes certain things into consideration. The way the team will play will have to change. Simple as that.

I AGAIN relate this (Panarin) situation to the Rick Nash situation of the past. While the team ("top end" skill and depth) is vastly superior as a whole to when Nash was still around, the similarities between how other CBJ players and opposing players "looked" for them on the ice during games is real. Both Panarin the last couple years/currently, and the vast majority of time of 'CBJ Nash' (not that team as a whole) were good enough WHEN ON THEIR GAMES to be looked at as the "GO TO" guy on offense, and essentially the team could win games with the offense (the puck) essentially being "funneled" not only through the 2 guys, but actually TO the 2 guys.

As we saw with the Nash teams of the past, the overall TERRIBLE depth and skill of the roster was not able to overcome the individual skill of a literal "gamebreaker" in Nash, specifically when teams would alter their game plans to focus primarily or more on Nash than "normal". What we have now currently (or the last 2 years) is a CBJ team (depth AND SKILLWISE) that doesn't NEED to "funnel" the offense through 1 or 2 guys, but with Panarin we still saw that.

That's not to say that he didn't help the team, and that AT TIMES, the strategy of the team (of Panarin as the GO-to guy) and play of BOTH Panarin and THE TEAM literally had the team playing like and beating the very best teams in the league for extended periods of time multiple times.

But, all this talk about how good these 2 guys are/were and how they could have a HUGE impact on the wins is all dependent on them being "ON their game". With the teams (offensive) strategy "focused" around 1 guy, if they are NOT "ON", it can be a disaster. How many times in the past couple year when Panarin slowed down, did the team start to perform much worse overall? Some people like to interpret that as that if he's not playing good, the team simply isn't good enough to win certain games. The truth is that the team/Torts have just continued on (many times) during these stretches playing the same way, filtering/funneling the puck to Panarin to try to get him out of the "funk" or because of the perception that looking to him is still the best available option.

The difference now, between the "Nash-CBJ days" and the "Panarin-CBJ days" is that we HAVE players (or moreso a TEAM) that CAN win more than the random game without their "best player" (to be CLEAR Seth Jones DOES EXIST) driving the play.

This is where, "2-Way 2nd Liner Ceiling Pierre Luc Dubois", "Milano Equivalent Bjorkstrand", and "Columbus Resident Cam Atkinson" come into play.
 

thebus88

19/20 Columbus Blue Jackets: "It Is What It Is"
Sep 27, 2017
5,002
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Michigan
I step back from this discussion and just reflect. It's not that this is a worthless discussion or opinions don't matter. Every time PLD's name is brought up, I still hear all the Ooooohh's from the arena floor in Buffalo when Ville Siren announced his name. Everybody was so damn certain that Jesse PoolParty was going 3rd. Now JP has already asked for his way out of Edmonton. Pierre Luc DuBois has shown so much and delivered so much and played so well for the Blue Jackets. It really doesn't matter if it's 70 points, 60 points, or 50 points to me. (Obviously rooting for the highest). I'm just so damn happy with the CBJ brian trust for what they accomplished with this young man getting to this point.

Perception vs Reality

Real eyes realize real lies.

Dubois is the "real deal", and is (imo) still disgustingly underrated by many CBJ (and NHL) fans in relation to other HIGHLY HYPED players in the league, both Johansen and Werenski included.

Much/most of the lack of hype or respect for Dubois has to do with Panarin, while people forget that Panarin has played his best hockey WITH Dubois.
 

MoeBartoli

Checkers-to-Jackets
Jan 12, 2011
13,954
10,154
55 or 60 seems reasonable.

The thing that Panarin did all of was the transition work, he'd enter the zone and then distribute.
I’m in agreement on your point projection but it’s the point about Panarin’s zone entries that are of greater importance. In many ways Bread erased the need for a center as his play served as a surrogate center offensively. To me that’s where his absence will be most felt - 3 on 3 and shootouts notwithstanding.
 

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