P.K Subban and Drew Doughty league worst turnover ratio

[EDDIE20*]

do you want me to make a thread about how Subban has way better advanced stats than Karlsson?

You may as well since we get to read about the incredible Karlsson (who has absolutely no weaknesses or comparables apparently) on a daily basis.

 

[Vesa Awesaka]

So why even bring up Karl's name in your first post.

I edited it into my post after someone said Subban and Doughty only have a bad plus minus because they play with the puck a lot. I gave examples of several dmen in my following post that also played with the puck a lot but didnt have such a bad plus minus. I edited karlsson out of my initial post because it seemed to cause a lot of people to become upset. Karlsson is the best example of a dman who gets the puck on his stick more then any other player in the league

 

[struckbyaparkedcar]

No stats will ever beat the eye test.

This is why I don't shut up about the NBA kicking the NHL's ass in player tracking.

By centralizing the data so that teams gain advantages through analysis and application instead of whoever's collecting the best data, it also provided connected writers and statisticians with access, raising the quality of coverage, especially long-form stuff.

Meanwhile, NHL fans are tracking their own stats, or trying to piece together narrative from a few morsels of information, as we see here.

 

[GTA]

I understand that you may think i made this thread with karlsson in mind but i didnt. I think it speaks to the defensiveness that some people can't comprdhend someone just pointing out interesting stats and asking what they mean

No dude...it has nothing to do with defensiveness and everything to do with your post history. When you have consistent posts of a certain persuasion, of course people who read them will see right through threads like this. Bringing up Karlsson right away just validates everyone's suspicion.

 

[Lebowski]

I'm intrigued by the takeaway stats. Does recovering the puck from an attacked in the corner counts as one? Because Subban does that routinely. I don't see how Markov could have nearly twice as much as PK.

 

[Osprey]

Doughty has always been a turnover machine (it comes with being so dynamic and highly confident), but it's gotten worse (visually and according to the stats) since being paired with Muzzin. With an offensive-minded partner, Doughty tends to get extra cute and force the attack instead of making the safer play (which also tends to have worse consequences, because his partner has his mind on offense, too). For some reason, many fans have come to be convinced that Muzzin is the ideal partner for Doughty, but I've been against the pairing from the start. Doughty may be having his fun playing with another offensive guy, but I think that aspects of his overall game suffer because of it.

 

[Vesa Awesaka]

No dude...it has nothing to do with defensiveness and everything to do with your post history. When you have consistent posts of a certain persuasion, of course people who read them will see right through threads like this. Bringing up Karlsson right away just validates everyone's suspicion.

Review my post history. I said last year i preferred Subban. I had montreal winning the atlantic divsion this year. I regularly criticize karlsson and said in the karlsson thread on the sens board that i would like to see a bobby orr award made for offensive dmen because i dont feel like karlsson should win the norris. I also said price is favorite for the vezina over rinne

I'm probably one of the posters who tries to be the least bias on the sens board

 

[canadianguy77]

Suprised to see Letang at only -9. He carries the puck a lot for the Pens.

 

[Boardish]

The stat is flawed because every single arena counts giveaways and takeways a little differently.

You can't build an argument based on stats that are ''subjectively'' collected.

 

[Claimed Off Waivers]

Overrated 3rd pairing PP specialists

 

[parineum]

Doughty has always been a turnover machine (it comes with being so dynamic and highly confident), but it's gotten worse (visually and according to the stats) since being paired with Muzzin. With an offensive-minded partner, Doughty tends to get extra cute and force the attack instead of making the safer play (which also tends to have worse consequences, because his partner has his mind on offense, too). For some reason, many fans have come to be convinced that Muzzin is the ideal partner for Doughty, but I've always been against the pairing.

I don't think fans consider Muzzin an ideal partner but Doughty is on the record saying that he loves playing with him. Also, Muzzin is 13th in the league in Corsi For Percentage. Best on the Kings.

In response to the thread, Doughty carries the puck a lot. He will carry the puck into the zone while forwards change. He carries the puck into the zone on the power play. Obviously turnovers are never good but there's a big difference between a turnover entering the offensive zone and those in your own zone.

The zone that events happen is tracked by the NHL. I wonder what the turnover ratio would be by zone for top defensemen in the league.

 

[vanarchy]

Canucks will take these losers off your hands for like a 6th or a 7th or something.

Just to be nice.

 

[KrisLetAngry]

Possessing the puck more only pertains to give aways.

How much the Senators rely on Karlsson to skate the puck up the ice has absolutely nothing to do with takeaways. Karlsson is 2nd in the league in Turnovers, so using the "he has the puck more but has less then half the turnovers/takeway ratio" to show he's more reliable with the puck makes no sense.

Yep.
If you handle the puck it makes sense