Value of: Ovechkin to Pittsburgh

mpp9

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Dec 5, 2010
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Kessel is right up there with his shot, creates his own offense and is a waaaaay better play maker. I don't think OV would make us better if you swapped him with Kessel.

Ovy is the focal point of a team's defense. He was better than Sid and Geno in the 16 series. He can create offense, just not to the extent he did in his prime.

Kessel is a better playmaker. He doesn't have a better one timer which is what playing with 87 and 71 is best exploited. We all know Phil fans on a ton of chances because of his stick flex and preference to score off the rush. Having Ovy on our third line and forcing teams to cheat to his side on the PP would be a nightmare to deal with. He's not good enough to lead a team to a Cup. He's still an elite player who contributes to the game when he's not scoring.

Having another 9.5 mil player would be tough, but he's certainly a couple mil better than Phil.
 

mpp9

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Dec 5, 2010
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Most definitely. I'm not against Ovechkin ever wearing a Penguins jersey, but the thought of him in one right now is purely nonsense given the Penguins roster and recent success. Even if Washington offered him up, there'd be no reason for the Penguins to bite. The Pens just led the league in scoring and won a second consecutive Cup, adding a $9.5M winger would require massive roster upheaval that is neither needed nor wanted.

It'd require a cheap 3C and moving Kessel. That's really it.
 

Laineux

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Aug 1, 2011
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It'd require a cheap 3C and moving Kessel. That's really it.

I don't see Ovechkin being better than Kessel at this point at all. He reeks defensively and I don't know how many goals he'd score without getting fed two minutes of one timers in every powerplay.
 

mpp9

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Dec 5, 2010
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I don't see Ovechkin being better than Kessel at this point at all. He reeks defensively and I don't know how many goals he'd score without getting fed two minutes of one timers in every powerplay.

Kessel is worse away from the puck. And why wouldn't we want Ovy getting prime minutes on the PP. Hes the best in the game at it.

Literally the only thing Phil does better is set up his linemates. That doesn't bridge the gap in goal scoring and what Ovy does as a total package.
 

Empoleon8771

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Aug 25, 2015
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Redmond, WA
Kessel skates a lot better than Ovechkin, is a way better playmaker and is a way better playoff player. Ovechkin shoots harder and hits harder, that's about it. You're either underrating Kessel or overrating Ovechkin. He's flat out not "worth a couple more million than Kessel". He just isn't.
 

Big McLargehuge

Fragile Traveler
May 9, 2002
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S. Pasadena, CA
Salary cap is a valid argument. Player vs player, I can't see the argument for Phil. One guy wins Rockets. The other hasn't broken 30 in years.

Salary cap and assets required are built into my 'argument'. I'm not willing to topple the apple cart to fix something that's working better than we hoped. Ovechkin is better than Kessel, but Kessel has a much cheaper cap hit and is already a Penguin...with two rings.
 

Riptide

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Dec 29, 2011
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Salary cap is a valid argument. Player vs player, I can't see the argument for Phil. One guy wins Rockets. The other hasn't broken 30 in years.

Except I'd rather have someone who can create his own offense and could carry a line on his own then have someone you need to staple to Crosby or Malkin's wing.
 

mpp9

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Dec 5, 2010
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Kessel skates a lot better than Ovechkin, is a way better playmaker and is a way better playoff player. Ovechkin shoots harder and hits harder, that's about it. You're either underrating Kessel or overrating Ovechkin. He's flat out not "worth a couple more million than Kessel". He just isn't.

A lot better? Ovy moves pretty well for a truck of a player. Way better playoff player? Ovy has 20 points in 25 playoff games the last two seasons. Phil has 45 in 49 benefiting playing behind 87 and 71. Odd definition.

Ovy is a better player. Can't believe I have to argue this.
 

mpp9

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Dec 5, 2010
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Except I'd rather have someone who can create his own offense and could carry a line on his own then have someone you need to staple to Crosby or Malkin's wing.

Phil couldn't do it last playoffs. People are forgetting he was MIA a lot while it was the 87 and 71 show.
 

Remington 700

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Jul 11, 2007
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Game 7, second round of the 2017 playoffs. Ovechkin needs a win to finally make the conference finals. His laziness directly results in the only 2 goals scored in a 2-0 loss. Pass on having a guy who can't be bothered to actually try to play defense in a game 7.
 

Empoleon8771

Registered User
Aug 25, 2015
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Redmond, WA
A lot better? Ovy moves pretty well for a truck of a player. Way better playoff player? Ovy has 20 points in 25 playoff games the last two seasons. Phil has 45 in 49 benefiting playing behind 87 and 71. Odd definition.

Ovy is a better player. Can't believe I have to argue this.

And Ovechkin plays with Backstrom, while Kessel only played with Bonino on his run in 2016. It doesn't matter if Ovechkin is better because it's not a significant difference and it's idiotic to suggest trading Kessel for him.
 

Riptide

Registered User
Dec 29, 2011
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Yukon
Phil couldn't do it last playoffs. People are forgetting he was MIA a lot while it was the 87 and 71 show.

Ovechkin has never once been put in that position - so you don't even know how he'd react. And given that his playmaking skills are worse than Kessels, he's going to need even more support then Kessel would.
 

Laineux

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Aug 1, 2011
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Game 7, second round of the 2017 playoffs. Ovechkin needs a win to finally make the conference finals. His laziness directly results in the only 2 goals scored in a 2-0 loss. Pass on having a guy who can't be bothered to actually try to play defense in a game 7.

Pretty much. Ovechkin is a big time loser. Penguins don't need any losers in their team.

Kessel is a proven winner and was integral part of two straigth Cup runs. It just makes no sense to trade a working player to a declining forward with a guestionable work ethic and super high salary.¨

After Ovechkin's performance this year I'm not even rooting for him to win a Cup anymore.
 

Jenkins

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Aug 2, 2017
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A lot better? Ovy moves pretty well for a truck of a player. Way better playoff player? Ovy has 20 points in 25 playoff games the last two seasons. Phil has 45 in 49 benefiting playing behind 87 and 71. Odd definition.

Ovy is a better player. Can't believe I have to argue this.

If you think OV would be a significantly better player than Kessel in our two cups sure but I doubt he would be so why take the risk and spend more cap and trade wise.

Unless OV was injured he just didn't look anywhere as good as he used to be these past playoffs. It actually looked like he was unfit. Still an awesome shot but he went to the circle a lot and just waited. Not much movement.
 

mpp9

Registered User
Dec 5, 2010
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If you think OV would be a significantly better player than Kessel in our two cups sure but I doubt he would be so why take the risk and spend more cap and trade wise.

Unless OV was injured he just didn't look anywhere as good as he used to be these past playoffs. It actually looked like he was unfit. Still an awesome shot but he went to the circle a lot and just waited. Not much movement.

He looked fine to me in 16. And he didn't play any worse than Phil last series. I'd love to see Ovy here, but I'll leave it at that.
 

Sidney the Kidney

One last time
Jun 29, 2009
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pretty much, kinda like how washington can never trade for crosby. too much hate

Any team that wouldn't want to trade for Crosby because they don't like him while he's on a rival team is just plain idiotic. There's not a single player in the league I'd say "I don't want him on the Penguins" if it meant making the Pens better, even if I currently hate his guts. Because at the end of the day, I want the Penguins to win.

It's one of the reasons why, if the deal somehow worked (cap-wise, assets given up in trade, etc.) where Ovechkin became a Penguin, I'd be all for it even though currently I'm not his biggest fan.

No offense, but that's one of the sillier comments I've ever read on here. Not wanting a player who will make your organization better than it is and give it a chance to actually win a championship instead of choking every year in the second round, all because currently you think he's a whiner or whatever else Crosby has done to cause "too much hate".
 

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